Racism increase in Ireland

[fluffybiscuits]

Its nice to see someone voice what I'm sure many readers on here feel.
If this site is to remain interesting and free then all views of members should be debated,whether they agree with yours or not.
The continuous knocking of fellow working class Irish people and condemning them as racist and requiring 'monitoring' whilst ignoring the enormous changes to this country which have happened so quickly is tantamount to gross stupidity.

Im a working class who happens to know most working class are not racists but we are sick of idiots telling us they speak for us by claiming "blacks out" and other assorted rubbish . They will never represent either me nor any other working class person I know as myself and the vast majority of people I know can quite happily live in harmony with other minorities.Those claiming they want to make Ireland a whites only country are mindless morons and are very much in the minority. Indeed why didnt the failures known as the Immigration Control Platform get anywhere if people care as much as the racisits claim?....

[fluffybiscuits]

Sepp Blatter commented that there was no racism in football and players should more or less put up and shut up. Reason Im adding it here he is not aware there is a minority in Irish sport that have suffered racism . Eamon Zayed was one and when Joseph Ndo played for a Dublin club some of the fans were warned about their conduct. If its in a league here you can be sure as hell its in the other leagues in Europe.

[Cato]

There is no problem speaking freely as long as its not to the detriment of others.

What do you mean by this? Someone disagreeing with my views could be detrimental to me - should I silence them?

[Cato]

Do you think there should be any legal limitations at all one what one person can say to another ?

I would say that the only limitations should be defamation of an individual (and there should be more altitude there than is currently provided for in Irish law), incitement to violence, and the old 'shouting fire in a crowded theater' chestnut.

I am not in favour of hate speech laws. I think that the ACLU was dead right to take the Skokie case.

I have always found the arguments of JS Mill to be persuasive on this whole area and on individual liberty in general.

[fluffybiscuits]

What do you mean by this? Someone disagreeing with my views could be detrimental to me - should I silence them?

The holding of such views is a blockade to human rights. In South Africa the belief that black people were not in anyway human led to their degredation and a two tier system that took years to break down. In Ireland at the moment its not an issue as Ireland more or less treats the vast majority of its citizens equally but if it came a commonly held belief then I would have an issue with it. Personally I take a very dim view of any belief that could create a two tier system.

[Cato]

The holding of such views is a blockade to human rights. In South Africa the belief that black people were not in anyway human led to their degredation and a two tier system that took years to break down. In Ireland at the moment its not an issue as Ireland more or less treats the vast majority of its citizens equally but if it came a commonly held belief then I would have an issue with it. Personally I take a very dim view of any belief that could create a two tier system.

So do I, but I argue against it and campaign for and support laws to stop discrimination in the supply of goods or services or in employment. I certainly do not set myself up as a censor and attempt to silence those I disagree with. Meet speech with counter-speech and argue for your views.

[fluffybiscuits]

So do I, but I argue against it and campaign for and support laws to stop discrimination in the supply of goods or services or in employment. I certainly do not set myself up as a censor and attempt to silence those I disagree with. Meet speech with counter-speech and argue for your views.

Im all in favour of that, indeed here in Ireland but up to a point where it denies others civil rights it becomes an issue. A lot of people who are racist wil never be dissuaded from changing their mind although I have read about a few in Searchlight magazine.

[Cato]

Im all in favour of that, indeed here in Ireland but up to a point where it denies others civil rights it becomes an issue. A lot of people who are racist wil never be dissuaded from changing their mind although I have read about a few in Searchlight magazine.

Can you give me an example of where speech (as distinct from action) has denied someone their civil rights?

[fluffybiscuits]

Can you give me an example of where speech (as distinct from action) has denied someone their civil rights?

http://www.sweetliberty.org/issues/wars/hitler.htm

Hitlers various speeches in which he built upon a disenfranchised population demicated by war sped up the murder and extermination of the Jewish population. People were led to believe by a man who was a despot that the Jews were the source of all their woes. While not the sole factor it was a contributing factor...

Do I lose on Godwins law ?

[Cato]

http://www.sweetliberty.org/issues/wars/hitler.htm

Hitlers various speeches in which he built upon a disenfranchised population demicated by war sped up the murder and extermination of the Jewish population. People were led to believe by a man who was a despot that the Jews were the source of all their woes. While not the sole factor it was a contributing factor...

Do I lose on Godwins law ?

Okay, I was thinking more of an example from a liberal-democracy with constitutional and super-national human and civil safeguards in place, which did not apply in Hitler's case.

Of course, his speeches did not, in and of themselves, cause any of those actions - it was the laws they passed and the weakness in the Weimar constitution that allowed that to happen.

One of the first things that the Nazis did when they got into power was to limit free-speech and further, it was restrictions on the voices of the left by the Weimar State, fearing a communist take-over, that prevented any kind of counter-speech taking place. The far-right, Hitler etc., were given a free run and counter-speech against him was difficult.

In the context of today's Ireland, shall we say, such voices as the Nazis are met with severe challenge, except of course when they are silenced by force, as in Trinity lately, and are then handed a moral victory against anti-racist voices.

[fluffybiscuits]

Okay, I was thinking more of an example from a liberal-democracy with constitutional and super-national human and civil safeguards in place, which did not apply in Hitler's case.

Of course, his speeches did not, in and of themselves, cause any of those actions - it was the laws they passed and the weakness in the Weimar constitution that allowed that to happen.

One of the first things that the Nazis did when they got into power was to limit free-speech and further, it was restrictions on the voices of the left by the Weimar State, fearing a communist take-over, that prevented any kind of counter-speech taking place. The far-right, Hitler etc., were given a free run and counter-speech against him was difficult.

In the context of today's Ireland, shall we say, such voices as the Nazis are met with severe challenge, except of course when they are silenced by force, as in Trinity lately, and are then handed a moral victory against anti-racist voices.

Do you think the banning of Griffin was wrong as a matter of interest? To me it just appears that people that are apathetic are the ones who are vunerable and open to being influenced too easily. We already have a branch of Irish society that believes the immigrants are to blame for the mess we are in thanks to extreme far right elements.

[fluffybiscuits]

http://www.independent.ie/national-n...o-2980239.html

More tales of racist Ireland. This particular Nigerian taxi driver in question needed dental work worth 2500 Euros. DRM are probably masturbating reading the article...

[fluffybiscuits]

http://www.irishcentral.com/news/Rac...18&cid=8500709

Poll from Irish central shows 39% of people believe racism is blown out of proportion in Ireland . Tell that to the right wing scum intent on stirring up ****...

[jmcc]

Irishcentral.com may not be representative of average Irish (in Ireland) views as most of its traffic seems to be from the US. In terms of the Irish web, I doubt that it ranks anywhere near the traffic of Boards.ie, RTE.ie, the Irish Times or the Independent.

The contrarian position would be that these stories are news because they are rare (and of course the cynical viewpoint is that they appeal to a certain right-on element as much as to racists).

Regards...jmcc

[fluffybiscuits]

Irishcentral.com may not be representative of average Irish (in Ireland) views as most of its traffic seems to be from the US. In terms of the Irish web, I doubt that it ranks anywhere near the traffic of Boards.ie, RTE.ie, the Irish Times or the Independent.

The contrarian position would be that these stories are news because they are rare (and of course the cynical viewpoint is that they appeal to a certain right-on element as much as to racists).

Regards...jmcc

Still a lot of stories which dont make the news here or seem to play a minor part seem to get picked up by the media there espeically irish central. A lot of the Irish diaspora would be more than likely Catholic with a strong right wing viewpoint hence how stories like this could appeal to them.