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Thread: Wikileaks Cable: US Soldiers handcuffed and shot 5 children 4 women called in air strike to destroy evidence

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    Default Wikileaks Cable: US Soldiers handcuffed and shot 5 children 4 women called in air strike to destroy evidence

    A terrible story that has come out through Wikileaks and that is threatening the US's prospects of an agreement to pull out of Iraq with an indemnity for all actions by its troops.

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011...iry?CMP=twt_fd

    Iraqi officials said the new information was sufficient cause to deny the Americans any bases and demand all troops leave.

    "The new report about this crime will have its impact on signing any new agreement," an Iraqi parliamentarian, Aliya Nusayif, told the AP. She said Iraq's parliament would investigate and seek to prosecute any US soldiers who commit crimes in Iraq in the future.

    As part of the negotiations over keeping US troops in Iraq, Washington is demanding immunity for all US military personnel. But Maliki's spokesman, Ali al-Moussawi, said: "We will not give up the rights of the Iraqi people, and this subject will be followed."

    The leaked state department memo, dated 27 March, 12 days after the incident, says that the US mission in Geneva had received a letter from Alston, the UN special rapporteur on extrajudicial, summary or arbitrary executions. In his letter, Alston said he had received various reports on the killings, and the dead included Faiz Hratt Khalaf, 28, his wife, three children, his mother, sister, two nieces, a three-year-old and a visiting relative.

    "According to the information received, American troops approached Mr Faiz's home in the early hours of 15 March 2006. It would appear that when the MNF [multinational forces] approached the house, shots were fired from it and a confrontation ensued for some 25 minutes. The MNF troops entered the house, handcuffed all residents and executed all of them. After the initial MNF intervention, a US air raid ensued that destroyed the house," Alston wrote. He added: "Iraqi TV stations broadcast from the scene and showed bodies of the victims (ie five children and four women) in the morgue of Tikrit. Autopsies carried out at the Tikrit hospital's morgue revealed that all corpses were shot in the head and handcuffed."

    Alston, who is now a professor at New York university, told a reporter for the McClatchy group of newspapers that the US had not responded to his letter – as was "the case with most of the letters in the 2006-2007 period", when sectarian and other violence was at its height. The Iraqi government had not responded either.

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    Default Re: Wikileaks Cable: US Soldiers handcuffed and shot 5 children 4 women called in air strike to destroy evidence

    The Guardian had access to these cables all along, they only published this today since the lot was dumped and is now in the open, also revealing the names of the sources.

    Expect some mysterious deaths to be reported in the near future.
    Thus all which you call Sin, Destruction—in brief, Evil—that is my true element.

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    Default Re: Wikileaks Cable: US Soldiers handcuffed and shot 5 children 4 women called in air strike to destroy evidence

    Quote Originally Posted by TotalMayhem View Post
    The Guardian had access to these cables all along, they only published this today since the lot was dumped and is now in the open, also revealing the names of the sources.

    Expect some mysterious deaths to be reported in the near future.
    This is something that was reported to the UN, and formal complaint made. The US army claims to have investigated already.

    Are you suggesting that the US army will go gunning down UN officials ?

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    Default Re: Wikileaks Cable: US Soldiers handcuffed and shot 5 children 4 women called in air strike to destroy evidence

    The UN made a complaint, but the informant was no UN official.
    Thus all which you call Sin, Destruction—in brief, Evil—that is my true element.

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    Default Re: Wikileaks Cable: US Soldiers handcuffed and shot 5 children 4 women called in air strike to destroy evidence

    You can download the ALL cables (via torrent, there's no stopping this now), nothing blacked out, all sources and informants are named in there.
    Thus all which you call Sin, Destruction—in brief, Evil—that is my true element.

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    Default Re: Wikileaks Cable: US Soldiers handcuffed and shot 5 children 4 women called in air strike to destroy evidence

    Quote Originally Posted by C. Flower View Post
    Iraqi officials said the new information was sufficient cause to deny the Americans any bases and demand all troops leave.
    A little world tour via Shannon should be enough to instil a more enlightened attitude in those officials.

    "The new report about this crime will have its impact on signing any new agreement," an Iraqi parliamentarian, Aliya Nusayif, told the AP. She said Iraq's parliament would investigate and seek to prosecute any US soldiers who commit crimes in Iraq in the future." (my emphasis.)

    In other words they get a blanket amnesty for all previous atrocities. I suppose that's why occupying countries install Quisling governments.

    "The MNF troops entered the house, handcuffed all residents and executed all of them"

    Why the reluctance to call murder murder?

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    Default Re: Wikileaks Cable: US Soldiers handcuffed and shot 5 children 4 women called in air strike to destroy evidence

    [quote]
    Quote Originally Posted by Cruimh View Post
    If it is true it is appalling. If there is any substance to it then the US authorities will seek out the perpetrators and prosecute them as they often do

    but how do questions from a UN offical 'provide evidence U.S. troops executed at least 10 Iraqi civilians."
    Questions are questions, not 'evidence'
    From where are you quoting ? Those words don't show up in a search of this site.

    But the trouble with Wikileaks is that it presumes are the cables contain proven facts. They don't. Diplomatic cables are a mixture of fact, rumour, conjecture and claims later disproved. When American diplomats meet someone for a chat, they write down a record. They may have been told the truth, or spoofed, or misunderstood something. But Wikileaks spins everything in the cables as fact.

    That is the fatal flaw in wikileaks - it does not recognise that diplomatic cables are not all factual. A lot are speculative gossip
    This is all true and I've made the same points myself.

    What you are missing out altogether is that the Guardian report says that Alston, the former UN Rapporteur, has confirmed that he sent this report to the UN and that the UN did not respond to his letter.

    The meat of his report was not only that he had received reports on what happened, but that the handcuffed bodies of the women and children were shown on Iraqi TV and that inquests at Tikrit showed they had died not from bombing, as alleged by the Pentagon, but by being shot in the head.

    The report is carried in the Guardian, a reasonably reputable newspaper that has been very cautious about its release of Wikileaks cables.

    The "evidence" in the thread title refers to the house and the bodies, that were bombed by the US. It does not, as you suggest, refer to the wikileaks cable. No-one disputes that the bombing took place.

    Why did the OP present the speculations as Facts?
    Is this a reputable politcal discussion broad based on fact or a site with any agenda and bias?
    The OP merely presented the Guardian report with a one line intro. It is up to you or anyone else if you accept the content of a press report. Personally, I think that in this case, if the reportage is accurate, that the evidence is overwhelming that this family were not killed accidentally in bombing, as claimed by the Pentagon.

    We know that atrocities took place in Iraq. What is important about this development is that the Iraqi Government is showing signs of life, and asserting its right to require murder of its citizens must be accounted for. The US's refusal to come under international law on war crimes is in my opinion a running sore in global geopolitics.

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