Syria - Opposition Organises against Assad

[C. Flower]

A former Syrian political prisoner has criticised Robert Fisk for being "embedded" in the Assad viewpoint - and mentions the jihadists who are coming in from Turkey and Algeria "to make big explosions"

http://english.ahram.org.eg/NewsCont...d-by-Syri.aspx

[Sam Lord]

Another kind of tragedy, destruction of culture, a feature of the Iraq war too, and now Libya. RTE reported on the burning of the Souk this morning.

It appears to have been burnt in an electrical fire that resulted from a gunfight. Not deliberately started by insurgents as has been suggested here.

The shift from protest to heavily armed battles has pushed protest off the street.

This suggests that it was a decision of someone to move from protest to armed actions. While this falls in nicely with the conspiracy theories of the "left" that everything is a western plot it is entirely incorrect. It was, in fact, the violence of the Assad regime which pushed protest off the street. The resistance started as an attempt to protect demonstrations. This point is made in what is quite a good article in the New Left Project and worth reading:

The revolution was inspired by and followed the model of Tunisia and Egypt. Even the initial slogan of ‘the people demand the fall of the regime’, daubed on a wall in Dera’a, consciously emulated Tunisia. Every such unarmed protest was suppressed with the uttermost violence. The Free Syrian Army was formed out of armed detachments protecting demonstrations, only really beginning in earnest last summer. The Syrian regime has been ‘militarized’ for decades. If it persists in some form, the solution favoured by some on the left, the Syrian people will continue to suffer its violence. They are not to be condemned for fighting back.

http://www.newleftproject.org/index....lar_revolution

U.K. and U.S. intelligence, working out of Cyprus and Turkey, said to be doing most of the arming and providing information on Syrian troop movements.

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/syria-rebel...041638306.html

Firstly, your linked article says nothing about the UK and US intelligence doing most of the arming never mind providing some evidence of it. Secondly, it provides no source for its assertion that British intelligence is assisting the resistance from Cyprus other than an unnamed source. I really despise that sort of "journalism".

The article I linked above is quite informative on the question of arms and states the following amongst other things:

It is no secret that the U.S., and its more vociferous junior imperial partner, wants rid of Assad and in this aim they are joined by Saudi Arabia, Qatar and the GCC more generally. The Saudis and Qataris are providing money, and in some cases materiel, to those bits of the FSA of which they approve. Nor is it any revelation that Western (and Turkish) agencies are attempting to broker the flow of these resources into the country and thereby exercise influence over the revolutionary situation. In any revolution, anywhere, now or in the future, outside powers will try to do this. Where this line of argument goes very wrong is in claiming that the Syrian revolution, as a result of these attempts, now consists of ‘sundry’ elements working for Western intelligence agencies and abetting the recolonisation of the country.

First, the weaponry and funding in question is not very much, and not for everyone. One can spot images of FSA anti-aircraft guns or cannon but very rarely. These are also most likely to have been taken with defectors of the defeat of a regime garrison. The regime’s advantage in airpower and ground armour is overwhelming: the FSA’s resources bear no comparison. One would expect a massive international conspiracy worth its salt to furnish its fifth column with some serious anti-tank and anti-aircraft weaponry. Such munitions are not evident. Most of the FSA’s light arms seem to come from the Syrian army itself, through defection or purchase with money from Syrian exile businessmen in the Gulf.

Amnesty International is reporting that armed forces of both sides are carrying out atrocities.

A curse on both your houses.

Actually, the revolutionary forces would have to kill day and night for years to come anywhere near the numbers of people butchered by the regime over recent decades. Assad's uncle, for example, boasted that in one month in Homs alone in 1982 they killed 38,000.

The place has been one big dungeon and torture chamber for left wing and progressive activists for decades.

I don't know what it will take for the "left" around the world to grasp these simple things and I really have given up hope that it ever will. But, personally, I can't wait for the day that Assad gets his bayonet.

[C. Flower]

It appears to have been burnt in an electrical fire that resulted from a gunfight. Not deliberately started by insurgents as has been suggested here.

This suggests that it was a decision of someone to move from protest to armed actions. While this falls in nicely with the conspiracy theories of the "left" that everything is a western plot it is entirely incorrect. It was, in fact, the violence of the Assad regime which pushed protest off the street. The resistance started as an attempt to protect demonstrations. This point is made in what is quite a good article in the New Left Project and worth reading:

http://www.newleftproject.org/index.php/site/article_comments/syria_neither_riyadh_nor_tehran_but_popular_revolu tio
Firstly, your linked article says nothing about the UK and US intelligence doing most of the arming never mind providing some evidence of it. Secondly, it provides no source for its assertion that British intelligence is assisting the resistance from Cyprus other than an unnamed source. I really despise that sort of "journalism".

The article I linked above is quite informative on the question of arms and states the following amongst other things:
A curse on both your houses.

Actually, the revolutionary forces would have to kill day and night for years to come anywhere near the numbers of people butchered by the regime over recent decades. Assad's uncle, for example, boasted that in one month in Homs alone in 1982 they killed 38,000.

The place has been one big dungeon and torture chamber for left wing and progressive activists for decades.

I don't know what it will take for the "left" around the world to grasp these simple things and I really have given up hope that it ever will. But, personally, I can't wait for the day that Assad gets his bayonet.

You are putting a very odd and incorrent spin on what I wrote.

The sequence of events, well documented on this thread and in the media generally, is that localised peaceful demonstrations in Syria were ferociously attacked by the Syrian army and that the armed resistance began with defections from the Syrian army. Subsequently different waves of "supporters" have come in, backed by various outside powers.

The Syrian opposition largely opposed militarisation of the uprising, but were unable to prevent it.

If you look at the post before yours, you will see a report about a Syrian writer who spent 16 years in Assad's jails.

[Count Bobulescu]

You are putting a very odd and incorrent spin on what I wrote.

The sequence of events, well documented on this thread and in the media generally, is that localised peaceful demonstrations in Syria were ferociously attacked by the Syrian army and that the armed resistance began with defections from the Syrian army. Subsequently different waves of "supporters" have come in, backed by various outside powers.

The Syrian opposition largely opposed militarisation of the uprising, but were unable to prevent it.

If you look at the post before yours, you will see a report about a Syrian writer who spent 16 years in Assad's jails.

I largely agree with Sam lord’s analysis of your post #255. I don’t think he has put an “odd or incorrect spin” on what you wrote. The link you posted makes no mention of US or UK supplying arms. That of course is not to say they are not supplying arms, but you have provided no evidence of it. So your assertion that it is happening is more likely a figment of your imagination because you want to believe it is happening, or spread the idea that it is happening.

At the risk of sounding “snooty” on the topic of news sources, when I saw that you had cited Yahoo News, who in turn cited Sky News, I didn’t hold out much hope of enlightenment. That’s like a double whammy of unreliability.

With the exception of the WSJ, whose editorial page I detest, I trust no news out of the Rupert Murdoch stable. Sky is simply the less controversial UK sister of the much derided US Fox News. No self respecting left winger in the US would be caught dead citing Fox as an authority.

Yahoo as an aggregator is also withering on the vine. It has recently made a feeble effort to provide some original content. By virtue of its E-mail platform it gets a lot of eyeballs, but so too does your Super Sexy Sun and I wouldn’t trust it either.

I can’t see what the criticism of Robert Fisk at post # 256 that you refer to, whether it’s valid or not, has to do with SL”s take on your post # 255. That criticism is directed at Robert Fisk and no-one else.

[Count Bobulescu]

Turkey fired on selected targets inside Syria immediately after Syrian shells hit a Turkish border town, Turkey's prime minister said in a prepared statement. Turkey said it will hit more targets if Syrian attacks are repeated.

http://stream.wsj.com/story/syria/SS...=djemalertNEWS

[C. Flower]

More massive market place bombs in Aleppo - presumed by that amorphous and everywhere-hated entity "Al Qaeda."

The result - confusion - fear - disorientation - driving people off the streets.

http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Lates...ind-them-video

[C. Flower]

I largely agree with Sam lord’s analysis of your post #255. I don’t think he has put an “odd or incorrect spin” on what you wrote. The link you posted makes no mention of US or UK supplying arms. That of course is not to say they are not supplying arms, but you have provided no evidence of it. So your assertion that it is happening is more likely a figment of your imagination because you want to believe it is happening, or spread the idea that it is happening.

At the risk of sounding “snooty” on the topic of news sources, when I saw that you had cited Yahoo News, who in turn cited Sky News, I didn’t hold out much hope of enlightenment. That’s like a double whammy of unreliability.

With the exception of the WSJ, whose editorial page I detest, I trust no news out of the Rupert Murdoch stable. Sky is simply the less controversial UK sister of the much derided US Fox News. No self respecting left winger in the US would be caught dead citing Fox as an authority.

Yahoo as an aggregator is also withering on the vine. It has recently made a feeble effort to provide some original content. By virtue of its E-mail platform it gets a lot of eyeballs, but so too does your Super Sexy Sun and I wouldn’t trust it either.

I can’t see what the criticism of Robert Fisk at post # 256 that you refer to, whether it’s valid or not, has to do with SL”s take on your post # 255. That criticism is directed at Robert Fisk and no-one else.

Always interested in your preferences for different news outlets.

Hague has admitted supporting the opposition with money. It's not exactly a secret. Of course we should accept his word of honour as a British gentleman that there's nothing more to it.

In London, the British foreign secretary, William Hague, said on Friday that his government would contribute a further $8 million in nonlethal aid, including communications equipment and medical supplies, to the rebels.
“We must build relationships now with those who may govern Syria in the future,” Mr. Hague said.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/11/wo...pagewanted=all

[C. Flower]

Four days of shelling back and fore between Turkey and Syria.

This is a war.

http://photos.mercurynews.com/2012/1...ish-artillery/

[Count Bobulescu]

U.S. military reportedly deploys task force in Jordan

Top news: As violence continues to rage in Syria -- the New York Times, citing unnamed American officials, is reporting that the U.S. military has secretly dispatched a task force of more than 150 "planners and other specialists" to a Jordanian military training center near Amman.

The task force is intended to help the Jordanian military "handle a flood of Syrian refugees, prepare for the possibility that Syria will lose control of its chemical weapons and be positioned should the turmoil in Syria expand into a wider conflict," the Times reports.

Meanwhile, Turkey, another neighbor of Syria's, has warned that it will respond aggressively if Syrian shells keep falling on Turkish territory. "If it continues, we will make a stronger response," Turkey's top general, Necdet Ozel, declared. The Turkish military fired on Syrian positions for six straight days in retaliation for a Syrian shell that killed five Turkish civilians.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/10/wo...crisis.html?hp

[DCon]

Israel flings a bomb into Syria

Israel was drawn into the Syrian civil war for the first time on Sunday, firing warning shots into the neighboring country after a stray mortar shell fired from Syrian territory hit an Israeli military post.

http://bigstory.ap.org/article/ap-ne...t=users/cjones

[Sam Lord]

Israel flings a bomb into Syria



http://bigstory.ap.org/article/ap-ne...t=users/cjones

It is not correct to say that they shot into Syria as every indication is that the shooting came from an Israel post within Syria. (i.e. on the Golan Heights)

[DCon]

The bombing is getting bombingier

ISRAELI MILITARY REPORTS `DIRECT HITS' ON SYRIA TARGETS: AP

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-1...onsecutive-day

[ang]

Update -

@PaulaSlier_RT
#SYRIA - #Britain's top general says plans are in place for an intervention in #Syria should the humanitarian sitn continue to deteriorate

[Ephilant]

Turkey has requested Nato for assistance. The assistance asked for takes the form of deployment of PAC-3 Patriot missiles, currently only ion the possesion of Germany, the US and the Netherlands.
The Bundestag has been asked to approve the deployement of some of those German missiles and 170 German soldiers in Turkey to defend itself against Syrian aggression. Decision expected on Mondy.

http://www.n24.de/news/newsitem_8381205.html

[Count Bobulescu]

We don’t know what currency/denominations etc if any, were actually used, but 200 tons of US $100 bills has a value of around $20 billion.

This past summer, as the Syrian economy began to unravel and the military pressed hard against an armed rebellion, a Syrian government plane ferried what flight records describe as more than 200 tons of “bank notes” from Moscow.

The records of overflight requests were obtained by ProPublica. The flights occurred during a period of escalating violence in a conflict that has left tens of thousands of people dead since fighting broke out in March 2011.

http://www.propublica.org/article/fl...-cash-to-syria