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Thread: Cabinet got No Say on Guarantee: Willie O'Dea

  1. #1
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    Default Cabinet got No Say on Guarantee: Willie O'Dea

    Surely this raises all sorts of questions over how this Country is run and who is really in charge.

    I know this is a case of WOD trying to remove himself from anything to do with this disaster of a guarantee which has brought this Country to it's knees, but this version of events given by WOD does not correspond with the most recent version given by John Gormley that the cabinet had discussed the Guarantee before that fateful night in September 2008.

    Mr O'Dea says he would have welcomed cabinet discussion on the Guarantee but there was none.

    I wonder when FG/LAB will call in all the relevant authorities including the Gardai to investigate how and why this decision was made.

    Former Defence Minister Willie O'Dea has revealed for the first time how the last Cabinet was bounced into issuing the bank guarantee, which has given a "blank cheque" to holders of senior bonds in Irish banks.

    Mr O'Dea said a 'fait accompli' on the disastrous €440bn guarantee was presented by then Taoiseach Brian Cowen and Finance Minister Brian Lenihan to other ministers at 1am on the night in question.
    <SNIP>
    He said yesterday that during the call on the night of September 29/30, 2008, there was no discussion and he was presented with no option but to agree to the decision, which he, and presumably all other ministers, were told had to be made before markets opened the following morning.
    http://www.independent.ie/national-n...a-2607504.html

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Cabinet got No Say on Guarantee: Willie O'Dea

    This isn't the first time I've heard this: at the time when Lenihan was running for leadership of FF, there were a few grouchy rivals who made it very clear that the Cabinet was left out in the cold. I think that M. Martin was one of them.

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    Default Re: Cabinet got No Say on Guarantee: Willie O'Dea

    I've heard similar stories. I was at a meeting which Eamon O Cuiv addressed, and when asked about the bank guarantee, he said that he had received a phone call in the middle of the night while he was asleep asking him whether he approved it or not without being told any of the details.
    Нооруз пиээ пурылыа выиттыа


    'Our goal is to conquer state power for the Irish working class'
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    "Can I ask whether this is what the men of 1916 died for: a bailout from the German chancellor with a few shillings of sympathy from the British chancellor on the side?"
    Michael Noonan, November 2010

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Cabinet got No Say on Guarantee: Willie O'Dea

    The decision by Mr Cowen and Mr Lenihan to offer a blanket guarantee was [] described by former EU Parliament President Pat Cox as the
    "most reckless single decision in the history of the State whose legacy we will live with for a very long time".
    A bit rich from the former PD - whose Director of Policy, Séamus Mulconroy, was trumpeting PD policy, in the Irish Times [2006], about light touch regulation:

    IFSC needs light regulation. If Ireland abandons softer regulation, we will have one of the most stringent financial sector regulatory environments in the world. The IFSC has been one of the outstanding success stories of modern Ireland, a public-private partnership that worked, the brain child of entrepreneur Dermot Desmond, backed by the then taoiseach Charlie Haughey. .... In the early days the value proposition for the IFSC was simple: low corporation tax, a light touch regulatory regime – as little red tape as possible.

    Source
    Give me a misty day, pearly gray, silver, silky faced, wide-awake crescent-shaped smile

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Cabinet got No Say on Guarantee: Willie O'Dea

    Cowen was a slob who gave Lenihan a free hand to do whatever he wanted. Neither of the arrogant duo paid the slightest attention to anyone because they knew their loyal party members would do as they were told.

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    Default Re: Cabinet got No Say on Guarantee: Willie O'Dea

    I can't give Dillie O'Wee any credibility at all and thats his fault. Worth bearing in mind too that he's been playing the old soldier because he thinks he was betrayed by colleagues who let him down in his many hours of need.

    Its much more likely to be the spiteful little boy trying to hit out in the usual FF fashion at anyone who doesn't back a cattlemarket spiv to the hilt no matter what he was about.
    Think National. Act Local. Oh- and superstition is just the dark matter of human history.

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    Default Re: Cabinet got No Say on Guarantee: Willie O'Dea

    It looked to me like a page filler to avoid discussion of our current situation, which has moved on quite a bit from September 2011.

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    Default Re: Cabinet got No Say on Guarantee: Willie O'Dea

    Holy ****, looks like Lenihan and Cowen themselves may have had no choice on the guarantee

    Check out Lenny's obit in the Torygraph;

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/obit...n-Lenihan.html

    Most specifically, THIS bit...

    "Pressure mounted from the United States government to underwrite the debts — Timothy Geithner, United States Secretary of the Treasury, feared that an Irish bank debt default, while not threatening of itself, could have spread contagion to the entire European system, to which American-backed “credit default swaps” were exposed to the tune of 120 billion euros.

    This was later confirmed by State Department cables leaked through WikiLeaks.
    "

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    Default Re: Cabinet got No Say on Guarantee: Willie O'Dea

    Dillie O'Wee is lying.

    There was no panicked last-minute late-night decision.

    The idea of the Guarantee had been floating about since at least May 2008, and numerous discussions had taken place between bankers, officials, Lenny and Clowen on a regular basis for months as they put the scam together. The final report had been delivered on the Friday before, and the final decision was taken at a corporeal Cabinet meeting on the Sunday.

    The FF version of events still being spun by Corporal O'Wee is pure nonsense, and always was. Even Lenny's public engagements diary - freely available somewhere on the Oireachtas website though I can't be bothered digging it up right now - makes it perfectly clear that the Guarantee was anything but a kneejerk last-minute crisis decision.

    FFers lie. About everything. All the time.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Cabinet got No Say on Guarantee: Willie O'Dea

    This issue is somewhat bigger than whether Dillie was telling porkies or not.

    The Torygraph appears to be suggesting that the decision which bankrupted us WAS TAKEN IN THE US......what can we do about this ???

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Cabinet got No Say on Guarantee: Willie O'Dea

    Just as I wouldn't believe an FFer if he told me the sky was blue, I wouldn't believe anything the Torygraph have to say on any subject either.

    The Guarantee bears all the hallmarks of a typical FF small-town cute-hoor stroke and scam, a Big Lie, a bluff to protect the insiders and make sure their criminality remains hidden form the little people. It's pure classic FF chicanery, and I don't see any need to be inventing foreign bogeymen.

    Lenny, Clowen, Seanie, Alan Gray and Kevin Cardiff cooked it up between them over the course of a few months, probably hugging themselves with delight at how sneaky and underhand it all was.

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    Default Re: Cabinet got No Say on Guarantee: Willie O'Dea

    ehhmm, the Torygraph is the voice of the official, long term UK establishment. I suspect they may know what they are talking about on this one. Anyway, they belong to a different jurisdiction, what possible motive would they have to lie about it?? I'm sure their top brass hold no candles for FF....

    .... and finally, this chimes entirely with what was being reported by Morgan Kelly re Geithner's opposition to bond holder burning more recently

    hate to break it to you, but there are bigger and badder gombeens out there internationally than FF

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    Default Re: Cabinet got No Say on Guarantee: Willie O'Dea

    Quote Originally Posted by morticia View Post
    Anyway, they belong to a different jurisdiction, what possible motive would they have to lie about it??
    Ummm, they're Tories. Tories lie. About everything. All the time.

    Quote Originally Posted by morticia View Post
    .... and finally, this chimes entirely with what was being reported by Morgan Kelly re Geithner's opposition to bond holder burning more recently
    I'm aware of that and it does look like Geithner has questions to answer, and he probably encouraged Lenny and Clowen down this road, but the facts remain that the idea of the Guarantee emerged from the stinking bowels of Anglo and was the subject of numerous FF/DoF/Bankers discussions from at least May 2008 onwards. Geithner may have played some role further down the road but the Guarantee was an FF/Anglo scam from the beginning.

    Quote Originally Posted by morticia View Post
    hate to break it to you, but there are bigger and badder gombeens out there internationally than FF
    Yeah like the criminal psychopaths in the UK and US governments and their official mouthpieces like the Torygraph. Honestly, what age are you?

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Cabinet got No Say on Guarantee: Willie O'Dea

    I'd like Mr Geithner to answer some questions, please!

    I'm no fan of the Tories (and would agree entirely on their mendacious record), but I can't think of a reason why they'd want to feed us BS about that; the UK always thought the bank guarantee was stupid anyway (they may have been right on that one), so why would they want to make it look more legit by implying that it had been ordered from on high??

    As for my age, probably older than you! (north of 40). And no, I'm not trying to defend the guarantee, or FF.

    If it turns out Geithner did have a heavy hand in it, could it be argued that the US should be liable for some of the debt?

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