Vincent Browne Heckle !

[PaddyJoe]

If you have an unlimited ATM withdrawal facility Paddyjoe .... you must be loaded

I wish

[ang]

Capital controls, limited ATM withdrawals and suspension of Schengen are all on the agenda if Greece doesn't vote the right way on Sunday. And not just in Greece either.

Won't contain it PJ there will have to be a firewall of Trillions thrown at it and even then it's high risk.

The money simply doesn't exist and all are standing naked.

[riposte]

Yeah I heard one analyst (they are 10 a penny now) say yesterday that "there is not enough money in the world to bailout Italy."

[Dr. FIVE]

Symphysiotomy survivor Theresa Devoy, chairperson of Survivors of Symphysiotomy Marie O’Connor and solicitor Colm McGeehan

[DCon]

For anyone else who does not know: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Symphysiotomy

[DCon]

Yeah I heard one analyst (they are 10 a penny now) say yesterday that "there is not enough money in the world to bailout Italy."

if they re-value gold to be 100K an ounce, the Central Banks can go mad

[C. Flower]

Good for Vincent, for covering symphisiotomy. Opening contributor is saying that Catholic doctors reintroduced this surgery, that involves permanently severing the pubic bone or the pelvis, to enable continued "natural" childbirth. She is saying that this was done to reduce the risk that a woman might request contraception or sterilisation after one or two caesarian deliveries.

It was not to our knowledge a ruling of the Catholic Church. It seems to have been a ghastly local culture among Irish doctors, having been long abandoned elsewhere.

Hard to believe that extreme misogeny didn't underlie it.

There have been programmes on this surgery, and the physical impacts on women were agonising and dreadful, short and longterm.

[C. Flower]

A desperate story.

[Dr. FIVE]

absolutely awful,

what a legacy we are left with, just keeps getting worse and worse

[C. Flower]

The solicitor acting for a group of women is furious about the Department of Health report, leaked to the press by the Deparment two days before publication.

He said that no women had been consulted by the D of H, and that the report relied heavily on previous publications that could be used to present symphysiotomy as an acceptable alternative to caesarian section.

The view generally seems to be that the Government will resist compensating the women affected by dragging things out until they have died, as they are mainly in the 70 + age group.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/...317755314.html

[Dr. FIVE]

symphysiotomy campaign launched in 2003

http://www.irishexaminer.com/archive...-82398094.html

Micheál Martin was the first Minister for health to rule out an inquiry

http://www.breakingnews.ie/archives/.../kfaumhqlmhsn/

[C. Flower]

I remember reading up as much as I could about symphysiotomy a couple of years ago, to see what best practice was. I was astounded how the accounts of the medical profession were so different to the many accounts of women - accounts that were completely credible, and would tally with what would be expected from such radical and damaging surgery.

In general, the medical writers said that it was not seriously harmful and was an alternative to caesarians, and to the best of my memory particularly suggested it for women who didn't have access easily to hospitals (mainly in Africa), so that they would be less likely to die in childbirth, or suffer from fistula. It would make you wonder if there are thousands of women in Africa who have been subject to that.

I also wonder whether the practice in Ireland was influenced by what was happening in Africa, via missionary doctors.

Those writers, I assume, hadn't asked women who had had symphysiotomies how it had affected them, but had relied on statistical evidence.

[Holly]

The professional class in Ireland have had an easy ride until now. The people look upon medical doctors, lawyers, politicians, priests, schoolteachers, banksters and entrepreneurs as their "betters".

[riposte]

"All professions are conspiracies against the laity."--George Bernard Shaw.

[Dr. FIVE]

symphysiotomy campaign launched in 2003

http://www.irishexaminer.com/archive...-82398094.html

Micheál Martin was the first Minister for health to rule out an inquiry

http://www.breakingnews.ie/archives/.../kfaumhqlmhsn/

and Lenihan was junior minister at the time

We must be cautious about judging procedures and interventions which were used in previous generations in light of current knowledge and experience. Enormous medical advances have been made in obstetric practice since the 1950s and procedures were not as advanced then as they are in Ireland today. Under these circumstances, the Minister for Health and Children has no plans to establish an inquiry into the use of symphysiotomy in obstetrical practice.