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Thread: Manufacturing Industry in Ireland - It Does Exist You Know

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    Default Manufacturing Industry in Ireland - It Does Exist You Know

    To listen to Irish Politicians, manufacturing industry might not exist here, but I know it does.

    The impression is conveyed that we are too good to "get our hands dirty" by making stuff (as Germany and Italy do, for example). We are supposed to stick to something Mammy would like that we can do in a suit, in the Smart Economy (??) or Professions.

    Manufacturing is the core of any prosperous and balanced economy or state. There is, contrary to the desired spin, manufacturing in Ireland and some of it very good. A few new jobs here -

    http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/m...bs-481089.html

    Started this thread for discussion of manufacturing in Ireland, history, present and future.

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    Default Re: Manufacturing Industry in Ireland - It Does Exist You Know

    As MD of a subsidiary of a Muli National I can assure you that even traditional manufacturing is still alive and kicking.
    However what you say about the nice clean jobs is totally true also. Unless you are Pharmaceutical then people are reluctant to apply for a job and that is most prevalent in Engineering.
    The biggest problems we face are pay scales and Government support. We are kept by and large in the background.
    However, we are an export company that is growing and fighting our way out of the recession.
    There is no support for the small companies either and therefore we cannot grow them as a supplier base.
    The economy is destroying manufacturing and our Clean Green people are nice and happy to eliminate these Dirty jobs.
    However, we will survive because companies like our tend to have real people that want to use their initiative and be innovative, in order to be cost effective. In doing so we produce highly skilled and motivated workers, not clones.

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    Default Re: Manufacturing Industry in Ireland - It Does Exist You Know

    Quote Originally Posted by Lifeisagame View Post
    As MD of a subsidiary of a Muli National I can assure you that even traditional manufacturing is still alive and kicking.
    However what you say about the nice clean jobs is totally true also. Unless you are Pharmaceutical then people are reluctant to apply for a job and that is most prevalent in Engineering.
    The biggest problems we face are pay scales and Government support. We are kept by and large in the background.
    However, we are an export company that is growing and fighting our way out of the recession.
    There is no support for the small companies either and therefore we cannot grow them as a supplier base.
    The economy is destroying manufacturing and our Clean Green people are nice and happy to eliminate these Dirty jobs.
    However, we will survive because companies like our tend to have real people that want to use their initiative and be innovative, in order to be cost effective. In doing so we produce highly skilled and motivated workers, not clones.
    It is exactly engineering-based "traditional manufacturing" that I'm talking about here. I was listening to a guy last week who was saying his firm had been "coiling copper wire for 30 years". Is there any reason why we shouldn't be making things in Ireland ?

    The Government seems to say that we have no hope of competing with India and China, because of wage rates, but as these countries develop their wages are going up too - so what is the truth ?

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    Default Re: Manufacturing Industry in Ireland - It Does Exist You Know

    Quote Originally Posted by C. Flower View Post
    It is exactly engineering-based "traditional manufacturing" that I'm talking about here. I was listening to a guy last week who was saying his firm had been "coiling copper wire for 30 years". Is there any reason why we shouldn't be making things in Ireland ?

    The Government seems to say that we have no hope of competing with India and China, because of wage rates, but as these countries develop their wages are going up too - so what is the truth ?
    The government says we cannot compete with India and China yet the worlds No. 2 exporting country is Germany. Message to government: Go Figure!!!!

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    Default Re: Manufacturing Industry in Ireland - It Does Exist You Know

    Quote Originally Posted by Slim Buddha View Post
    The government says we cannot compete with India and China yet the worlds No. 2 exporting country is Germany. Message to government: Go Figure!!!!
    Chinese Government issued a decree to all companies to increase salaries by 25% recently and another 25% to come in the near future.

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    Default Re: Manufacturing Industry in Ireland - It Does Exist You Know

    Another question: How do the Swiss export so much when they have a rock-hard currency?? Luxury watches, food flavouring, pharmaceuticals, engineering services, cement are all big earners as is, of course, banking.

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    Default Re: Manufacturing Industry in Ireland - It Does Exist You Know

    Quote Originally Posted by Slim Buddha View Post
    Another question: How do the Swiss export so much when they have a rock-hard currency?? Luxury watches, food flavouring, pharmaceuticals, engineering services, cement are all big earners as is, of course, banking.
    From my political perspective, I would put the official Irish attitude down to the petty-bourgeois/gombeen power base of Fianna Fail and FG. I have the impression that they actively dislike manufacture. I've seen a direct example of local powers-that-be brushing off an opportunity for a skilled manufacturing plant in their town as it might pressurise local wage rates up.

    And of course they bought into the nonsense that it was possible to have a services based economy.

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    Default Re: Manufacturing Industry in Ireland - It Does Exist You Know

    The point I was trying to make, cactus, is that both Switzerland and Germany spent decades building a reputation for producing solid reliable products. And in a fight against exports from elsewhere, reputation is everything.

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    Default Re: Manufacturing Industry in Ireland - It Does Exist You Know

    Quote Originally Posted by Slim Buddha View Post
    The point I was trying to make, cactus, is that both Switzerland and Germany spent decades building a reputation for producing solid reliable products. And in a fight against exports from elsewhere, reputation is everything.
    I suppose the question I'm trying to ask is, are we better at manufacture in Ireland than our reputation?

    It seems to me that there is a definite lack of love between Government and manufacturing - beyond the "dirty deal" of low Corporation Tax, there is no sense of pride or wish to create the right conditions. The whole ESB debacle is an indication of that.

    They were far more comfortable with the finance sector......

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    Default Re: Manufacturing Industry in Ireland - It Does Exist You Know

    Quote Originally Posted by C. Flower View Post
    I suppose the question I'm trying to ask is, are we better at manufacture in Ireland than our reputation?

    It seems to me that there is a definite lack of love between Government and manufacturing - beyond the "dirty deal" of low Corporation Tax, there is no sense of pride or wish to create the right conditions. The whole ESB debacle is an indication of that.

    They were far more comfortable with the finance sector......
    And that turned out wonderful, didn't it? An inner-city re-generation project funded by a dodgy clause in the tax code.

    But it is typical of the thinking, such as it is, to be found in our political class. When it comes to a choice between solid hard graft and an opportunity to pull a stroke, the stroke wins every time.

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    Default Re: Manufacturing Industry in Ireland - It Does Exist You Know

    Quote Originally Posted by Slim Buddha View Post
    And that turned out wonderful, didn't it? An inner-city re-generation project funded by a dodgy clause in the tax code.

    But it is typical of the thinking, such as it is, to be found in our political class. When it comes to a choice between solid hard graft and an opportunity to pull a stroke, the stroke wins every time.
    Folks I genuinely appreciate your interest and focus on CFs Thread.
    Traditional Manufacturing in Ireland is a very tough game.
    Your supplier base depends on your volume. Some Europeans stood by their local supplier base and it was win win. Unfortunitely, our supplier base in Ireland was built on margin rather than volume related profit. So you have no choice but to back away from them. Forget Asia for a moment, Irelands indigenous companys need to change to compete. My policy is quite simple, you want our name on your customer list, but that is no good if you are not making profit. I always ensure my suppliers are making a reasonable margin. But our indigenous suppliers want less wage and more profit and the result is bad quality. I cannot live with that. I still buy in Europe and hope to expand in the not too distant future. However, my Corporate Target is Local Sourcing, but local sourcing is Europe not Ireland.
    However, our Government is more interested in people in call centers than people learning on the ground, ironically I know I pay more.
    If you want Manufacturing in Ireland then you must respect what it produces, SKILLS for those that cannot get on a ladder in a Call Center.
    Respect the fact that people can work from the head down and not just from the neck down. My people make money and are my pride.

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    Default Re: Manufacturing Industry in Ireland - It Does Exist You Know

    Quote Originally Posted by Lifeisagame View Post
    Folks I genuinely appreciate your interest and focus on CFs Thread.
    Traditional Manufacturing in Ireland is a very tough game.
    Your supplier base depends on your volume. Some Europeans stood by their local supplier base and it was win win. Unfortunitely, our supplier base in Ireland was built on margin rather than volume related profit. So you have no choice but to back away from them. Forget Asia for a moment, Irelands indigenous companys need to change to compete. My policy is quite simple, you want our name on your customer list, but that is no good if you are not making profit. I always ensure my suppliers are making a reasonable margin. But our indigenous suppliers want less wage and more profit and the result is bad quality. I cannot live with that. I still buy in Europe and hope to expand in the not too distant future. However, my Corporate Target is Local Sourcing, but local sourcing is Europe not Ireland.
    However, our Government is more interested in people in call centers than people learning on the ground, ironically I know I pay more.
    If you want Manufacturing in Ireland then you must respect what it produces, SKILLS for those that cannot get on a ladder in a Call Center.
    Respect the fact that people can work from the head down and not just from the neck down. My people make money and are my pride.

    This confirms my own impression of how people who make things with their skills and their hands are regarded in Ireland. In Germany, skilled manufacturing employees are highly regarded by society as a whole and the education system is geared towards producing sufficient numbers of such people for Germany's amnufacturing/export economy.

    Ironically, bankers are not highly regarded at all.

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    Default Re: Manufacturing Industry in Ireland - It Does Exist You Know

    Quote Originally Posted by Slim Buddha View Post
    This confirms my own impression of how people who make things with their skills and their hands are regarded in Ireland. In Germany, skilled manufacturing employees are highly regarded by society as a whole and the education system is geared towards producing sufficient numbers of such people for Germany's amnufacturing/export economy.
    Where do we train people like lathe operators, riveters, etc, in Ireland ?? Do they learn through apprenticeship ?

    Ironically, bankers are not highly regarded at all.

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    Default Re: Manufacturing Industry in Ireland - It Does Exist You Know

    Quote Originally Posted by C. Flower View Post
    Where do we train people like lathe operators, riveters, etc, in Ireland ?? Do they learn through apprenticeship ?



    Lots of people are trained on the job,starting off sweeping the floor and working their way up through the factory. All the book learning in the world is useless if it can't be put into practice.
    The government despise manufacturing as the equipment costs make it cash intensive whereas a call centre only needs a phone line and a few computers .
    Why haven't FAS been teaching intensive language courses ?

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    Default Re: Manufacturing Industry in Ireland - It Does Exist You Know

    The Germans are running out of workers
    http://www.spiegel.de/international/...727342,00.html

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