Painful American Happenings....

[Dagger John]

Both men were receiving what the diocese calls "sustenance payments" after being suspended by the diocese. This was halted Aug 5, 2004.

And the point is?

[Andrew49]

And the point is?

In 1997, a Catholic tribunal in Tucson formally determined that a local priest had solicited sex while hearing confession, saying that evidence in the case against the Rev. Michael Teta showed that his ‘‘insidious ‘rape’ ’’ of his victims was ‘‘so heinous that the only solution is that he take up some other occupation.’’ In a sentencing document that runs more than 100 pages, the tribunal recounted the evidence against Teta, saying at one point that ‘‘there is almost a satanic quality in his mode of acting toward young men and boys.’’

Despite the urgency of the findings, then-Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, a top Vatican official, took more than six years to review the case before Pope John Paul II affirmed a decision to strip Teta of his status as a priest, or laicise him.

[Dagger John]

In 1997, a Catholic tribunal in Tucson formally determined that a local priest had solicited sex while hearing confession, saying that evidence in the case against the Rev. Michael Teta showed that his ‘‘insidious ‘rape’ ’’ of his victims was ‘‘so heinous that the only solution is that he take up some other occupation.’’ In a sentencing document that runs more than 100 pages, the tribunal recounted the evidence against Teta, saying at one point that ‘‘there is almost a satanic quality in his mode of acting toward young men and boys.’’

Despite the urgency of the findings, then-Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, a top Vatican official, took more than six years to review the case before Pope John Paul II affirmed a decision to strip Teta of his status as a priest, or laicise him.

Not entirely the full story again Andrew. Accused 1978 - removed from ministry (A very quick resolution).

The real question is - did he abuse after that?

[Andrew49]

Not entirely the full story again Andrew. Accused 1978 - removed from ministry (A very quick resolution).

The real question is - did he abuse after that?

Just as much as they are subject to the laws of the church, they are subject to state and federal laws.

1990, 1991: The Catholic Diocese of Tucson relieves the Rev. Michael Teta and Monsignor Robert C. Trupia of ministerial duties.

1992: The diocese begins the process of laicizing Trupia and tries to defrock him. The local diocese also tries to defrock Teta, who lives in Tucson. Teta and Trupia continue to receive monthly pay from the diocese.

Jan. 8, 2001: Trupia is arrested in Yuma on seven felony counts of child molestation, but the charges are dropped the next day because they violated the criminal statute of limitations.

Oct. 6 2001: For the first time, the diocese acknowledges publicly that it suspended Teta and Trupia in the early 1990s.

Jan. 30, 2002: The diocese reaches an out-of-court settlement of $14 million with 10 men who said they were sexually abused by local priests in the 1960s, '70s and '80s. Churches named in civil suits filed by the men included Our Mother of Sorrows church and school in Tucson.

Feb. 21 2002: The diocese turns over Trupia's name to the Pima County prosecutor who oversees sex crimes.

June 21: The diocese releases the names of 15 priests who have had "credible" accusations of child sexual abuse lodged against them, including Teta and Trupia.

February 2003: Trupia is reportedly living in Maryland and continues to receive a monthly payment from the diocese.

August 2004: Bishop Gerald F. Kicanas announces the two priests have been defrocked by the Vatican.

[Dagger John]

The only problem I can see there with regard to the Church is the alleged abuse that may have happened after they were relieved of their ministry. They should have been passed to the civil authorities at or around the time of their accusation.

If they had abused after that then those who did not tell the authorities locally should be charged with whatever is appropriate.

The cases then which seem most disturbing is the cases in the 80s and 90s.

What is known about them?

[C. Flower]

Not entirely the full story again Andrew. Accused 1978 - removed from ministry (A very quick resolution).

The real question is - did he abuse after that?

I find the idea that a paedophile rapist could be rendered safe by "removing him from the ministry" crass beyond belief.

These people were either incredibly stupid, or wilfully put children at risk.
Possibly both.

[Dagger John]

I find the idea that a paedophile rapist could be rendered safe by "removing him from the ministry" crass beyond belief.

These people were either incredibly stupid, or wilfully put children at risk.
Possibly both.

Depends what it means - the questions are not easily answered. Did the civil authorities know? if so when and with what result/

What procedures did the Church take? They seem to have found against them as far as legalities are concerned - but what did they do to stop them? And, if the civil authorities were not interested - what could they do?

[Andrew49]

The current story hasn't been a news item since both priests were defrocked in 2004.

The last news item before that was only a local news item (Feb 4 2002) in the Arizona Daily Star - : (seems to me an awful lot of digging is being done on this story at the moment in America !)

Bishop apologizes to parishioners for abuse (The Arizona Daily Star) ...ex-priest William Byrne, who died of a brain tumor in 1991 Monsignor Robert C. Trupia, who lives in Maryland;... - Feb 04 2:46 AM ET

The priests named in the lawsuits included visiting priest Father Pedro Luc de la Meunier, who is believed to have since died; the Rev. William Byrne, who died of a brain tumor in 1991; Monsignor Robert C. Trupia, who lives in Maryland; and the Rev. Michael Teta, whose last known address was in Tucson. The lawsuits give accounts of young boys, some of them altar boys and students at Our Mother of Sorrows School, being abused by priests who befriended them and often gave them drugs and alcohol. The lawsuits said the diocese knew about the abuse but didn't take any steps to prevent it from continuing.

Gene Ackerley, a 79-year-old charter member of Our Mother of Sorrows, said some parishioners reacted to the initial news of the lawsuits with denial. They wondered whether the incidents had really happened. The denial turned to anger and now to healing, he said. "It has been a terrible experience," said Ackerley, the owner of an advertising agency. "We were absolutely horrified and disgusted to learn of this."

Ginny Sertich, a 37-year-old lifelong member of the church, was a teacher at Our Mother of Sorrows School when news of the lawsuits first surfaced. She never doubted the allegations, though it wasn't easy to hear. "One of the priests named married my mother and father and then married my brother and then married my sister and was very much a part of our family life," said Sertich, who attended Our Mother of Sorrows School as a child and was a close friend of one of the plaintiffs in the legal actions. My parents and I and my family had to reconcile, you know, that this truly took place."

Sertich's family was close with Father Byrne. She also knew Trupia and Teta. Sertich said the atmosphere at the school and the church is far different from what it was in the 1970s when issues like sexual abuse were never discussed. Sertich, a former youth leader at the church, said youths are encouraged now to speak openly about topics like sexual abuse, and she's confident with the safeguards in place. Like other parishioners, Sertich is ready to move on without anger at the church. "Scripture asks for peace that surpasses understanding, I feel more support for my church than ever before," echoed Tamra Kuehl, a 20-year-old junior at the University of Arizona who has been a church member since the age of 5. "Priests are human and there are bad priests out there. . . . But the priests I have known have always been wonderful and I have never felt threatened."

Church members praise Cahalane in large part for keeping their congregation together. Though Cahalane did not come to the church until 1981, members say he did not back down from the issue when it arose. They credit him with keeping up spirits. And the church was recently named in a book titled "Excellent Catholic Parishes" for its program aimed at bringing alienated Catholics back to the faith.

A parish-only "listening session" is scheduled for tonight at the church. And a healing service is set for Feb. 25. Cahalane said he believes the "painful truth" of what happened at Our Mother of Sorrows is finally leading to justice. And he is also hoping that the airing of the abuse will lead others who have suffered sexual abuse by any adult or authority figure to come forward. "There are many people in the congregation that without a doubt, this is the tip of the iceberg for them because it will bring back into their memory what happened in their childhood," Cahalane said. "We say that the Lord writes straight with crooked lines."

[Dagger John]

Do you think that they are resurfacing it due to the failure to nail the Pope by the NYT?

[Andrew49]

Vatican's Point Man on Abuse Was Successfully Sued by Whistleblowing Priest

Making Levada the point man in responding to media criticism of the pope was a dicey move. Pope Benedict chose Levada in 2005 to succeed him as prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, the office that historically ruled on disputes of theology. In 2001, Pope John Paul II gave Ratzinger control over abuse cases and whether to defrock clerics. To his credit, Ratzinger took on an issue that until then was scattered among other departments.

But choosing Levada to bring justice to the Vatican was always problematic, given his record as archbishop of San Francisco and before that, Portland, Oregon. Levada used the same tactics of other bishops in sheltering perpetrators, which spurred civil lawsuits and bad headlines. Moreover, Levada stands alone among American bishops in having been sued, successfully, by a whistle-blowing priest, Jon Conley, who reported another priest to the police for making sexual advances on a teenage boy. Father Conley received a six-figure settlement from the archdiocese. Conley's struggle offers a cameo of what's wrong in the Vatican today.

Source

[Captain Con O'Sullivan]

Do you think that they are resurfacing it due to the failure to nail the Pope by the NYT?

The implication being that the entire mess the church is in is somehow down to a media witchhunt?

Do you dispute that the catholic church has covered up child abuse by its priests over many decades in many different countries?

I have to say its a mawkish sight watching church apologists twisting and turning and trying to dance uncomfortably around the fact that their Bishops, Cardinals and the Pope are all implicated in the cover up of child molestation.

I've watched you on this thread almost interrogate Andrew, obviously trying and failing to find some point on which to deflect criticism of the church.

There is a point at which human beings should ask themselves some questions.

[Andrew49]

The implication being that the entire mess the church is in is somehow down to a media witchhunt?

Do you dispute that the catholic church has covered up child abuse by its priests over many decades in many different countries?

I have to say its a mawkish sight watching church apologists twisting and turning and trying to dance uncomfortably around the fact that their Bishops, Cardinals and the Pope are all implicated in the cover up of child molestation.

I've watched you on this thread almost interrogate Andrew, obviously trying and failing to find some point on which to deflect criticism of the church.

There is a point at which human beings should ask themselves some questions.

It appears Vatican Radio is on Dagger John's side:

The Vatican heatedly defended Pope Benedict XVI, claiming accusations that he helped cover up the actions of pedophile priests are part of an anti-Catholic "hate" campaign targeting the pope for his opposition to abortion and same-sex marriage. Vatican Radio broadcast comments by two senior cardinals explaining "the motive for these attacks" on the pope and the Vatican newspaper chipped in with spirited comments from another top cardinal.

"The pope defends life and the family, based on marriage between a man and a woman, in a world in which powerful lobbies would like to impose a completely different agenda"

Spanish Cardinal Julian Herranz, head of the disciplinary commission for Holy See officials, said on the radio. Herranz didn't identify the lobbies but "defense of life" is Vatican shorthand for anti-abortion efforts. Also arguing that Benedict's promotion of conservative family models had provoked the so-called attacks was the Vatican's dean of the College of Cardinals, Angelo Sodano:

"By now, it's a cultural contrast, the pope embodies moral truths that aren't accepted, and so, the shortcomings and errors of priests are used as weapons against the church."

Also rallying to Benedict's side was Italian Cardinal Giovanni Lajolo, who heads the Vatican City State's governing apparatus. The pope "has done all that he could have" against sex abuse by clergy of minors, Lajolo said on Vatican radio, decrying what he described as a campaign of "hatred against the Catholic church."
Link

Benedict has ignored victims' demands that he accept responsibility for what they say is his own personal and institutional responsibility for failing to swiftly kick abusive priests out of the priesthood, or at least keep them away from children. But he has been protected by a vanguard of senior Vatican prelates who are fending off what they contend is an orchestrated attempt to attack Ratzinger.

If it was an orchestrated campaign, based only on 'gossip' and 'chit-chat' why are there:
painful American happenings
painful Canadian happenings
painful Irish happenings
painful Dutch happenings
painful German happenings
painful Austrian happenings
painful Italian happenings
painful Australian happenings
painful Norwegian happenings
painful Philippines happenings
.
.
.
.
.
?

It's not the highlighting of clergy abuse case by the press and media that causes problems for the Church .... it was the criminal cover-up of those abuses that caused the problems.

[Captain Con O'Sullivan]

And I note that the Vatican are careful to load any personal involvement of Ratzingers down onto a secretary or the line that the then-Cardinal wouldn't normally see all correspondence.

Thats total bullshit. Invoices for wine and communion bread bought in bulk I can understand not exactly requiring the Cardinal's attention but if Xombies expect me to believe that the heinous cases that passed under his control somehow slipped across his desk as a run-of-the-mill event and not worthy of his attention is just a lie.

The desperate attempts by church apologists to try any zany suggestion which would allow them to deflect blame from people clearly implicated in the cover-up of widespread child abuse says a lot about them as people.

They can discuss 'morality' till the cows come home but they still can't see the difference between right and wrong.

[Andrew49]

The Gossip of the Moment!

That's a phrase used by the Vatican to defend it's inaction in the Father Murphy case - this is some 'Moment' for the Vatican. Murphy's was first discovered to be abusing deaf children in 1955!!

[Captain Con O'Sullivan]

Yes, the catholic church has always made some kind of principle out of its long term view.

Unfortunately the long-term prognosis for the catholic church is not good. They don't understand that now people have a way of speaking to each other outside the traditional channels (Main Stream Media, politicians, legal system etc).

I can't help thinking that the fatal mistake the church is making is the assumption that people will forget about all this after a while.

They are operating under the illusion that this is a temporary nuisance and its that sort of arrogant assumption that will destroy them in the end. They are already stuck with a 'dirty' pope and as far as I can see two of the leading candidate-Cardinals to replace him are also sullied.

Another fatal assumption the church is happily lying to itself about is that eventually all the reported cases will work their way through the system. Unfortunately I believe cases will soon start emerging from Latin America and Africa and if I know the catholic church as well as I do they'll regret sending some of the wilder cases out on the missions.

I believe Argentina and Brazil have already seen opening cases and that too would have been unimaginable not so long ago in those countries.

My own best guess is that at some point Interpol (which Andrew has mentioned already) will become involved with this organisation and my prediction is that it will have a lot to do with adoptions out of China.