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Thread: National Survey of Ongoing Housing Developments: Dealing with Unfinished and Ghost Estates

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    Default National Survey of Ongoing Housing Developments: Dealing with Unfinished and Ghost Estates

    http://www.environ.ie/en/Development...y,24374,en.htm

    The Department of the Environment has published a national housing survey of over 2,000 recent developments.

    They have found over 20,000 completed empty houses and nearly 20,000 unfinished houses.

    The Department plans to publish a "best practice" manual for local authorities, on how to deal with unfinished developments. This will be approximately four years after developments began to be abandoned.

    The longer these developments remain unfinished the bigger a problem they become.



    National Survey of Ongoing Housing Developments: October 2010


    Background
    The Department of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government initiated a field based survey of all housing developments of two or more dwellings that had commenced by the time of the survey, (summer 2010) to establish a proper evidence basis for further action by Government and local authorities in relation to planning, housing, building control and other matters relating to such developments.

    Survey Methodology
    The survey was conducted centrally by the Department’s field staff with the co-operation of local authorities and site owners and in accordance with a methodology that was developed by the Housing and Planning Divisions of the Department and tested in a pilot phase of the survey in County Laois.

    The survey was conducted over the months May-September 2010 inclusive and after a period of checking was finalised on the 29th September last.

    Key Results
    • 2846 developments have been inspected, of which only 429 (15%) are active;
    • While is difficult to be precise about the exact numbers of housing units approved in total on all of the above developments[1] estimates so far are for 179,273 dwellings;
    • There are 78,195 dwellings in the developments surveyed that are complete and occupied;
    • 23,250 dwellings are complete and vacant;
    • 9976 dwellings are near complete[2];
    • 9,854 dwellings are at various early stages of construction activity from site clearance, foundations up to wall plate level;
    • There is planning permission for a further estimated 58,025 dwellings that have not commenced and are therefore not posing any immediate construction or site specific difficulties.

    Summary results across the 34 City and County Council areas and State totals follow this note.


    Next Steps
    The survey is the first independent, field based analysis of multi-unit or scheme type housing across the state and will be of invaluable use to Government, Regional and Local authorities and interested bodies in monitor the construction status and spatial distribution of housing development across the state.


    The Department has also developed a range of complementary actions to fully harness the benefits of the survey including:
    • Publication of Terms of Reference for a high level Housing Expert Group under the chairmanship of Mr John O’Connor CEO Designate of the Housing and Sustainable Communities Agency to report back to the Ministers on actions, including the publication of a best practice manual on unfinished housing developments as a consultation draft initially followed by the finalisation of this document in early 2011.
    • Further applied analysis of the database in conjunction with expert researchers in the property sector and in academia;
    • The further development and updating on an annual basis of the survey, including its integration into a wider departmental Geographical Information System and other relevant datasets.
    Last edited by C. Flower; 21-10-2010 at 05:44 PM.

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    Default Quote: National Survey of Ongoing Housing Developments: Expert Group to deal with ghost estates

    There are more than 2,800 ghost estates in the country, according to a report from the Department of the Environment.

    The report identifies a county-by-county inventory of unfinished estates.

    The survey was carried out by the department from May to September. It shows that building had started on 120,000 homes in ghost estates.

    Of these, 77,000 are completed and occupied, while 33,000 are completed and vacant or nearly completed. Around 10,000 others are in early stages of construction.

    An expert group is now being set up by the Government to advise on how best to deal with the problems of ghost estates.
    Source: RTÉ News

    Sure, they couldn't leave it to the affected county and town councils to deal with the matter. No, they have to appoint highly paid "experts" to assure the demolition contracts go to the right people. And so Irish cronyism goes into the next round.
    Last edited by C. Flower; 21-10-2010 at 05:43 PM.
    Thus all which you call Sin, Destruction—in brief, Evil—that is my true element.

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    Default Re: Expert Group to deal with ghost estates

    We have a similar thread, so I'll be merging, if you don't mind

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    Default Re: Expert Group to deal with ghost estates

    Quote Originally Posted by C. Flower View Post
    We have a similar thread, so I'll be merging, if you don't mind
    Sure thing, and TBH, National Survey of Ongoing Housing Developments sounds much better than 'expert group' which is for everyone to spot the real purpose of this latest scam.

    Of course they will have to knock down a couple of hundred thousand houses in order to hike property prices again (NAMA can't last forever, you know) and their cronies in the construction sector will be reimbursed with demolition contracts in the meantime.
    Thus all which you call Sin, Destruction—in brief, Evil—that is my true element.

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    Default Re: National Survey of Ongoing Housing Developments: Dealing with Unfinished and Ghost Estates

    [QUOTE=C. Flower;82007]http://www.environ.ie/en/Development...y,24374,en.htm

    The Department of the Environment has published a national housing survey of over 2,000 recent developments.

    The figures that strike me from this report are from the national totals:-


    Complete and occupied dwellings 78195

    Complete and vacant dwellings 23250

    No construction started 58025

    There is obviously a great deal of property out there that was ear-marked for building but it hadn't even begun when we went BANG.

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    Default Re: National Survey of Ongoing Housing Developments: Dealing with Unfinished and Ghost Estates

    Senator Phil Prenderghast, (Labour spokesperson on older people) has ripped into the survey of South Tipp and says that sewerage and lighting problems have been overlooked. In fact, it must be very difficult to know what has and hasn't been done undergrounds once the builder and possibly architect and engineering companies have gone.
    “The audit of ghost estates published by the Department of Environment last week is inaccurate and does not give a full picture of what it means to live in the middle of an abandoned building site.
    “While the figure of almost 1,000 houses lying idle or incomplete in 31 ghost estates in South Tipperary is about right, some of the other claims in the audit are misleading or just plain wrong.
    “For instance, the audit claims that all lighting and footpaths are completed. I have seen estates in the four corners of this county where sections of path have not been concreted or are strewn with trip hazards such as elevated service points and uncut dry lining. The lighting is also plainly Inadequate or not working at all in some of these estates.
    “The Department’s audit also fails to give any account of the faulty seweragLinke and water systems that blight the daily lives of these homeowners.
    “It also makes the ridiculous claim that sites where work has not commenced don’t pose any difficulties. These sites are often strewn with rubble, rusting fences and builders’ gear, rubbish and other sorts of debris. They are dangerous for children and can be a rally point for anti-social behaviour.
    “This also happens with the 35 public spaces which the audit says are not finished.
    “I have met many people living in these estates who are furious that their houses are situated on abandoned building sites - not the attractive settings shown on the original plans. And to add insult to injury, they find themselves in negative equity.
    “Now they find a government audit of where they live is wrong on many fronts. This shows a terrible insensitivity towards some of the most acute victims of our economic collapse.”

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    Default Re: National Survey of Ongoing Housing Developments: Dealing with Unfinished and Ghost Estates

    Quote Originally Posted by Newsy View Post
    There is obviously a great deal of property out there that was ear-marked for building but it hadn't even begun when we went BANG.
    Hence NAMA. By the very nature of building loans. Builder goes to bank, gets loan, buys land, builds houses, sells at profit, repays loan. Identifies next project, approaches bank, gets loan.....

    While builders loans like this might have a nominal life of 20 years, in practice during the bubble the interest would be rolled up over the lifetime of the project and the entire loan + interest cleared off when the project was built & sold, maybe 2-3 years later.

    Therefore pretty much every NAMA loan is absolute crud. Unsold, half-built or never-started projects like these from the very peak of the bubble. I always find it mind-boggling that we are four years into the housing bust and well over 2 years I think since NAMA was first mentioned, and still most people don't seem to realise this, and the meeja are certainly in no hurry to enlighten them!

    BTW on the Pin 2Pack has long been tracking empties and is convinced the true figure is much closer to 300,000, and that almost every "official" publication on the issue of empties ever since the 2006 census first brought them to light has been pure obscurantist bullcrap.

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    Default Re: National Survey of Ongoing Housing Developments: Dealing with Unfinished and Ghost Estates

    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewinder View Post
    Hence NAMA. By the very nature of building loans. Builder goes to bank, gets loan, buys land, builds houses, sells at profit, repays loan. Identifies next project, approaches bank, gets loan.....

    While builders loans like this might have a nominal life of 20 years, in practice during the bubble the interest would be rolled up over the lifetime of the project and the entire loan + interest cleared off when the project was built & sold, maybe 2-3 years later.

    Therefore pretty much every NAMA loan is absolute crud. Unsold, half-built or never-started projects like these from the very peak of the bubble. I always find it mind-boggling that we are four years into the housing bust and well over 2 years I think since NAMA was first mentioned, and still most people don't seem to realise this, and the meeja are certainly in no hurry to enlighten them!

    BTW on the Pin 2Pack has long been tracking empties and is convinced the true figure is much closer to 300,000, and that almost every "official" publication on the issue of empties ever since the 2006 census first brought them to light has been pure obscurantist bullcrap.
    Yes, the "empties" in this survey would only be a small proportion of overall empties, which are spread right though the housing stock.

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    Default Re: National Survey of Ongoing Housing Developments: Dealing with Unfinished and Ghost Estates

    Quote Originally Posted by C. Flower View Post
    Senator Phil Prenderghast, (Labour spokesperson on older people) has ripped into the survey of South Tipp and says that sewerage and lighting problems have been overlooked. In fact, it must be very difficult to know what has and hasn't been done undergrounds once the builder and possibly architect and engineering companies have gone.
    Depends on how thorough investigations were and the personnel engaged in conducting them. Were they simple walk arounds and notes taken or comprehensive surveys, eg using sophisticated equipment where the presence/absence of underground items can be checked. I presume the former occurred.

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    Default Re: National Survey of Ongoing Housing Developments: Dealing with Unfinished and Ghost Estates

    Some useful comments on the survey by Namawinelake

    COMMENT: Remember this is a partial survey of vacant property. Originally its remit was only to look as estates commenced post 2007 and of course it excludes one-off housing. Approximately 14,000 homes will be completed this year (though this year’s completions will be lowest in a decade). Matching housing to population change is a challenge and immediate forecasts for population growth tend to be modest with high levels of emigration.
    A summary report has been produced which is available here. In summary 2,846 developments in the State were examined of which 357 were in Dublin. Planning permission was granted for approximately 179,273 dwellings but having reviewed the estates on the ground, it seems that only 121,248 have had any work undertaken at all, and there are a further 58,025 on which no work whatsoever has been undertaken. Of the 121,248 complete or partly complete dwellings 78,195 are occupied. Of the remaining 43,053 remaining dwellings 23,250 are complete and vacant. That leaves 20,003 that are incomplete and obviously vacant. Of those about half are nearly complete.
    Regionally, Dublin accounts for just under a third of all vacant and completed dwellings. And its four local authorities each have about average national vacancy rates (comparing with 2006 census results). Longford has the highest completed vacancy rate in the State closely followed by Leitrim. Waterford City has the lowest, followed by Limerick County and City. By the way the title above is tongue in cheek – the survey published today excludes one-off housing and estates started pre-2007. Hopefully when the full report is published which lists the estates, we will get a better idea of what is missing.

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    http://namawinelake.wordpress.com/

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    Default Re: National Survey of Ongoing Housing Developments: Dealing with Unfinished and Ghost Estates

    Here’s a piece from today’s Atlantic on what some people are doing to combat the blight of the Ghost Estates.

    http://www.theatlanticcities.com/hou...-estates/1648/
    The fallout from the global economic crisis has left a haunting mark on the landscape of Ireland in the form of what are known colloquially as “ghost estates,” housing developments that in some cases were never completed, or completed but never occupied.

    The country’s Department of the Environment estimated in 2010 there are 2,800 such sites. Tens of thousands of new homes were built in sprawling suburbs for tenants who never materialized. The people who actually do live in these desolate places deal not just with the pain of a bad investment and lack of community, but also with real risks - a situation dramatized by the recent death of a toddler who wandered through an unsecured fence and drowned in a puddle near an open drain. Sites with no residents at all are a blot on the countryside.
    As a general rule the most successful man in life is the man who has the best information.

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    Default Re: National Survey of Ongoing Housing Developments: Dealing with Unfinished and Ghost Estates

    If successful this is probably coming to a hood near you eventually. With 650,000 foreclosed homes sitting on lenders books company plans to buy 15,000 homes over the next 18 months.

    Investors are planning large scale purchases of homes to turn into rentals. "With home prices down more than a third from their peak and the market swamped with foreclosures, large investors are salivating at the opportunity to buy perhaps thousands of homes at deep discounts and fill them with tenants. Nobody has ever tried this on such a large scale, and critics worry these new investors could face big challenges managing large portfolios of dispersed rental houses. Typically, landlords tend to be individuals or small firms that own just a handful of homes. But the new investors believe the rental income can deliver returns well above those offered by Treasury securities or stock dividends. At the same time, economists say, they could help areas hardest hit by the housing crash reach a bottom of the market...In February, the Federal Housing Finance Agency, which oversees the government-backed mortgage companies Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, announced that it would sell about 2,500 homes in a pilot program." Motoko Rich in The New York Times.
    As a general rule the most successful man in life is the man who has the best information.

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