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Thread: US Presidential Election 2020

  1. #31
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    Default Re: US Presidential Election 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewinder View Post
    Ah cheer up,

    People just have to try and hold the line and slow down/frustrate Trump's toxic agenda as much as possible for another 9 months. After that he'll be a hamstrung lame duck...and possibly on his way to prison.
    hope springs eternal - - especially last part of the sentence

  2. #32
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    Default Re: US Presidential Election 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewinder View Post
    Ah cheer up, things aren't that dark. The Republicans are accelerating off the cliff, big style. Trumpism is the last gasp of the Angry White 50s Dude.

    Sure they'll hang about like a bad smell for years to come, but they are a small minority of the electorate and they are going to get crushed in every election from here on out. Why do you think so many GOPers are running for the exits? The saner ones know what is coming and are bailing - let the cultists go down in flames after spending loads of money, time and stress trying to win against the tide. You might see the likes of Gowdy picking up their political career again in 6 or so years time, but right now people like him want nothing to do with the impending GOP trainwreck and subsequent recriminations.

    People just have to try and hold the line and slow down/frustrate Trump's toxic agenda as much as possible for another 9 months. After that he'll be a hamstrung lame duck...and possibly on his way to prison.
    That's exactly the kind of morally superior attitude that has caused the D's problems. Because demographics favor the Dems, fools have been making that prediction for years.
    As a general rule the most successful man in life is the man who has the best information.

  3. #33
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    Default Re: US Presidential Election 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Count Bobulescu View Post
    That's exactly the kind of morally superior attitude that has caused the D's problems. Because demographics favor the Dems, fools have been making that prediction for years.
    Meh. This reminds me of the demographics "argument" in Northern Ireland. Back in the 80s and 90s there were clear signs in the censuses etc that the unionist population was going to become top-heavy with older people, and the nationalist population was closing in on a majority of children. But for a long time there was only marginal differences in election results. Because, ya know, demographic shift take fecking decades to fully work through into election results, not least because a) you have to wait till the children reach voting age and b) young people tend not to vote much in comparison to the elderly who all vote.

    Yet now, after much chest-beating bravado and chortling from political unionism these last 20-30 years, we are in the situation where unionist has lost its outright electoral majority. And worse (and importantly in terms of the analogy with the US), because of their attitude, they have completely p1ssed off the centrist neutral Alliance/Green/never-usually-bother-voting chunk of the electorate.

    The GOP are in the exact same situation. They've spent decades being told the demographics are shifting and that concentrating on Old White Christians was not a sustainable strategy...but because demographic shifts take time and there was no immediate electoral disadvantage, instead of reaching out they've doubled- and tripled-down on nativism, racism, xenophobia, homophobia, sexism, religious fundamentalism and bonkers "trickle down" kleptocratic voodoonomics. In the process not just alienating Dem voters, but annoying the hell out of independents and non-voters too.

    But that demographic clock is still a-ticking, and the current far-right GOP clown car is about to run out of road.

    Even the minority of younger voters who still identify as Republicans are almost completely divorced from the lunacy that is Trumpism and have very different views from the current GOP platform. The GOP as it currently exists is dead...it just doesn't realise it yet.

  4. #34
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    Default Re: US Presidential Election 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewinder View Post
    Meh. This reminds me of the demographics "argument" in Northern Ireland. Back in the 80s and 90s there were clear signs in the censuses etc that the unionist population was going to become top-heavy with older people, and the nationalist population was closing in on a majority of children. But for a long time there was only marginal differences in election results. Because, ya know, demographic shift take fecking decades to fully work through into election results, not least because a) you have to wait till the children reach voting age and b) young people tend not to vote much in comparison to the elderly who all vote.

    Yet now, after much chest-beating bravado and chortling from political unionism these last 20-30 years, we are in the situation where unionist has lost its outright electoral majority. And worse (and importantly in terms of the analogy with the US), because of their attitude, they have completely p1ssed off the centrist neutral Alliance/Green/never-usually-bother-voting chunk of the electorate.

    The GOP are in the exact same situation. They've spent decades being told the demographics are shifting and that concentrating on Old White Christians was not a sustainable strategy...but because demographic shifts take time and there was no immediate electoral disadvantage, instead of reaching out they've doubled- and tripled-down on nativism, racism, xenophobia, homophobia, sexism, religious fundamentalism and bonkers "trickle down" kleptocratic voodoonomics. In the process not just alienating Dem voters, but annoying the hell out of independents and non-voters too.

    But that demographic clock is still a-ticking, and the current far-right GOP clown car is about to run out of road.

    Even the minority of younger voters who still identify as Republicans are almost completely divorced from the lunacy that is Trumpism and have very different views from the current GOP platform. The GOP as it currently exists is dead...it just doesn't realise it yet.
    What you're saying here is very different from what you said above, i.e....


    and they are going to get crushed in every election from here on out.


    Everyone expects the D's will do well in 2018. The surprise would be if they didn't. The President's party typically does badly at the first term midterms.
    But only a fool who doesn't understand US politics would make the claim that you made in blue above.


    As a general rule the most successful man in life is the man who has the best information.

  5. #35
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    Default Re: US Presidential Election 2020

    2020 WATCH -- "Julián Castro to test 2020 run with New Hampshire Young Democrats speech," by NBC News' Suzanne Gamboa: "Castro, 43, has been up front about his interest in a run for the nation's highest office. He formed the Opportunity First political action committee last year and publicly launched it this year. 'I have every interest in running' in 2020 for president, Castro told NBC News. 'Part of the process of figuring out whether I'm going to run is going to listen to folks and feel the temperature' of voters." http://nbcnews.to/2BaQwwa
    As a general rule the most successful man in life is the man who has the best information.

  6. #36
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    Default Re: US Presidential Election 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Count Bobulescu View Post
    What you're saying here is very different from what you said above, i.e....


    and they are going to get crushed in every election from here on out.


    Everyone expects the D's will do well in 2018. The surprise would be if they didn't. The President's party typically does badly at the first term midterms.
    But only a fool who doesn't understand US politics would make the claim that you made in blue above.


    I'm starting to think yer a wee bit on the old spectrum there horse.

    There simply isn't any viable future in Trump-style alt-reality far-right White Christian grievance politics. Oh sure there'll be pockets locally here and there where that sort of stuff goes down a storm among the three-thumbed slack-jawed yokels, but as any sort of national political stance its a dead duck. Pretty much every poll of voter demographics and attitudes spells that out pretty starkly.

    The Silents are dying out and the Boomers are starting to shuffle off the stage...in every sense. Once you back yourself into a position of depending on the elderly, and not just the old but old people with views completely alien to younger generations, then yer politically screwed.

    Trumpism is a fleeting phase in terms of national political power. Even just by 2020 enough of his base will have passed beyond since 2016 to render him completely unelectable.

  7. #37
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    Default Re: US Presidential Election 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewinder View Post
    I'm starting to think yer a wee bit on the old spectrum there horse.

    There simply isn't any viable future in Trump-style alt-reality far-right White Christian grievance politics. Oh sure there'll be pockets locally here and there where that sort of stuff goes down a storm among the three-thumbed slack-jawed yokels, but as any sort of national political stance its a dead duck. Pretty much every poll of voter demographics and attitudes spells that out pretty starkly.

    The Silents are dying out and the Boomers are starting to shuffle off the stage...in every sense. Once you back yourself into a position of depending on the elderly, and not just the old but old people with views completely alien to younger generations, then yer politically screwed.

    Trumpism is a fleeting phase in terms of national political power. Even just by 2020 enough of his base will have passed beyond since 2016 to render him completely unelectable.
    Conclusory statements such as you made are the province of the reckless, and are in direct conflict with immediate history. Despite the demographic trend toward D's, that's been evident for years, under Obama the D's lost more state legislature seats than under any two term president since WWII. Federal election district boundaries, that permit gerrymandering are set by state legislatures.


    https://ballotpedia.org/Changes_in_s...ama_presidency



    Coincidently, today.......


    IMPORTANT -- NYT, A15 -- "Democratic Group Targets All-G.O.P. States to Attack Gerrymandering," by Alex Burns: "A Democratic group backed by former President Barack Obama intends to pour millions of dollars into an eclectic array of elections in a dozen states, in an effort to block Republicans from single-handedly drawing congressional maps after 2020, officials leading the group said. The National Democratic Redistricting Committee, formed last year under the leadership of Eric H. Holder Jr., the former attorney general, has settled on a strategy to contest a combination of governorships, legislative seats and more obscure state offices to chip away at Republicans' sweeping control of the redistricting process. Mr. Holder said in an interview that the group was chiefly determined to deny Republicans so-called trifectas in state governments - places where a single party controls the governorship and an entire legislature, as Republicans do in Ohio and Florida, among other critical battlegrounds." http://nyti.ms/2sds4rf
    As a general rule the most successful man in life is the man who has the best information.

  8. #38
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    Default Re: US Presidential Election 2020

    Poor HRC. If she was President she could have stopped this coming to light

    Campbell says that Russian nuclear officials told him of a scheme to route millions of dollars to the Clinton Global Initiative (CGI) through lobbying firm ARPCO, which was expected to funnel a portion of its annual $3 million lobbying fee to the charity

    •The Obama FBI knew about the bribery scheme, yet the administration still approved the Uranium One deal.
    https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-...ussian-uranium
    Politics is the gentle art of getting votes from the poor and campaign funds from the rich, by promising to protect each from the other. ~Oscar Ameringer

  9. #39
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    Default Re: US Presidential Election 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by DCon View Post
    Poor HRC. If she was President she could have stopped this coming to light



    https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-...ussian-uranium
    For the life of me I cant figure out what this has to do with 2020. HRC has not announced, and if she did, few believe she would be viable. She has said she intends to keep active publicly in other ways, which implies she doesn't intend running.


    All the coverage of the Mueller investigation with Trump as Prez, and the R's in control of both houses should make it clear to you that HRC as Prez would not have been unable to cover this up, even if she wanted to.


    Neutral observers in the US are now mocking Trump, and Trumpian Trumpsters for their continued fixation on a defeated opponent now 15 months after the election, all the while making a general mess of government.


    As for your continued reliance on Zero Hedge........


    Zero Hedge is a batshit insane Austrian school finance blog run by two pseudonymous founders who post articles under the name "Tyler Durden," after the character from Fight Club. It's essentially apocalypse porn. It has accurately predicted 200 of the last 2 recessions.[citation NOT needed]

    https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Zero_Hedge




    Zero Hedge's content has been classified as "alt-right",[3] anti-establishment, conspiratorial, and economically pessimistic,[4][5] and has been criticized for presenting extreme and sometimes pro-Russian views.[1][6][7][1]
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero_Hedge
    As a general rule the most successful man in life is the man who has the best information.

  10. #40
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    Default Re: US Presidential Election 2020

    To put the R control of the Federal redistricting process in perspective check out this map of the political trifectas, states where one party controls both houses and the Governor's Mansion. 26 to 6 in favor of R's

    https://ballotpedia.org/State_government_trifectas
    As a general rule the most successful man in life is the man who has the best information.

  11. #41
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    Default Re: US Presidential Election 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Count Bobulescu View Post
    For the life of me I cant figure out what this has to do with 2020. HRC has not announced, and if she did, few believe she would be viable. She has said she intends to keep active publicly in other ways, which implies she doesn't intend running.


    All the coverage of the Mueller investigation with Trump as Prez, and the R's in control of both houses should make it clear to you that HRC as Prez would not have been unable to cover this up, even if she wanted to.


    Neutral observers in the US are now mocking Trump, and Trumpian Trumpsters for their continued fixation on a defeated opponent now 15 months after the election, all the while making a general mess of government.


    As for your continued reliance on Zero Hedge........


    https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Zero_Hedge





    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero_Hedge
    I'll "rely" on any source I deem fit. As you will. But thanks for the information

    The article in question is not an opinion piece by the way, likemuch of the "sources" you post here. It is heavily referenced. If you bothered to read it you would see this
    Politics is the gentle art of getting votes from the poor and campaign funds from the rich, by promising to protect each from the other. ~Oscar Ameringer

  12. #42
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    Default Re: US Presidential Election 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by DCon View Post
    I'll "rely" on any source I deem fit. As you will. But thanks for the information

    The article in question is not an opinion piece by the way, likemuch of the "sources" you post here. It is heavily referenced. If you bothered to read it you would see this
    Count's idea of a debate or political forum, to paraphrase what he told me, is us realising our opinions are not worth a warm lick of spit and just everyone posting media pieces of 'really important opinions' from serious types who have been 'more successful' in life.

    Basically he wants us all to f off so he can spam himself on his little pet thread here. The average length of his own posts almost seems designed to drown us all out with spam and put us off posting here at all because 'we do not understand Murica' like he does.

    It was pretty funny to get a lecture on the state of German and EU politics from him recently that Germany is some Oasis of stability in a troubled EU. Given that the AFD are now their main opposition party, his opinions were a few a years out of date on that one.

    He will spam us with his endless media nonsense, dispute other people's right to express themselves, attack others endlessly, cry foul whenever anyone calls out this nonsensical hit-and-run approach of his, and almost never actually voice an opinion of his own as we are not worthy of his 'precious time'.

    It's a ridiculous example of someone on an online ego trip, who just posts nonsense media opinions largely, never reads others' sources or debates what anything means, and just generally makes a nuisance of himself.

    I also find his regular accusations that I cannot possibly understand how media or the US media operates very funny considering I read a lot more opinions, articles and news pieces than he probably does, and in 4 languages from a number of EU countries. I could come on here and spam people in the same way in French, German and Polish with some translated versions of what I'm reading and act high and mighty but then I come here the odd time for a debate, not to drag this site down the google searches.
    Last edited by Apjp; 08-02-2018 at 06:42 PM.

  13. #43
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    Default Re: US Presidential Election 2020

    He's one seriously odd fish alright. Recently he's taken to following me around threads yapping away, seems to be holding some sort of grudge cos I'm a damnable Nordie Fenian who dared to robustly express an Unapproved Opinion LOL

    As you say Apjp, it increasingly looks like the online fantasy ego trip of a quite unhinged lonely soul. I'll just be ignoring it from now on.

  14. #44
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    Default Re: US Presidential Election 2020

    Meh, well, CB has a point about Zerohedge. Sometimes interesting for gossip market tidbits etc but it is not a reliable or proper news source.

    Incidentally, given the current state of the markets, I just trolled a few Trumpers on another site with this clip.

    "If you go far enough to either extreme of the political spectrum, Communist or fascist, you'll find hard-eyed men with guns who believe that anybody who doesn't think as they do should be incarcerated or exterminated. " - Jim Garrison, Former DA, New Orleans.

  15. #45
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    Default Re: US Presidential Election 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by DCon View Post
    I'll "rely" on any source I deem fit. As you will. But thanks for the information

    The article in question is not an opinion piece by the way, likemuch of the "sources" you post here. It is heavily referenced. If you bothered to read it you would see this
    Well, there's no law agin foolishness and stupidity, but you still haven't explained the relevance of your post to this thread. Are you struggling to stay relevant?


    Your attempt at deflection wont work. I made no claim that the article was or wasn't an opinion piece.
    As a general rule the most successful man in life is the man who has the best information.

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