Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 74

Thread: British/RUC/Loyalist collusion

  1. #31
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Rockall
    Posts
    78,617

    Default Re: British/RUC/Loyalist collusion

    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewinder View Post
    Nobody interested? Pretty much as I expected.
    No more than they are interested in thousands of people in Iraq, or Afghanistan, blown to bits in the streets, tortured, murdered in front of their families.

    People hope and expect that "this kind of thing" will not affect them, or is exaggerated, and they put the fingers in their ears.

    By and large, it is the immediate families of people killed or dismembered in the service of "hegemonic" agendas who are interested.

    So long as people delude themselves, and hope, that the system is here to look after them, and to serve their needs, they will suck up the idea of these thousands of unfortunate dead as collateral damage to their personal project of a quiet and well-fed life.
    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
    — Jean-Paul Sartre

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Derry
    Posts
    2,050

    Default Re: British/RUC/Loyalist collusion

    You can trot out trite pseudo-justifications to assuage your stunted consciences all you like, but the harsh truth is that the southern populace are a broken shower of snivelling lapdogs to Power and Authority who would rather rat on their own mothers than risk "rocking the boat".

    And not just on the north. The way the entire populace have rolled over without even a whimper over the last 8 years is just pathetic.

    Not a people deserving of any respect.

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    1,029

    Default Re: British/RUC/Loyalist collusion

    RTE were complicit themselves in the Dirty War as they now call it. Eoghan Harris and Myers and that crowd. They never made programmes like this during the conflict.

    They'll be sure to bring out more documentaries attacking the Provos and Sinn Fein in the lead up to the General Election to "balance" out this one documentary they've made here.

    Mchael Mates says the collusion wasn't systemic and then next time he appears on screen he says if the Loyalist paramilataries wanted to act like vigilantes they would turn a blind eye to that. Brazen.

  4. #34
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Rockall
    Posts
    78,617

    Default Re: British/RUC/Loyalist collusion

    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewinder View Post
    You can trot out trite pseudo-justifications to assuage your stunted consciences all you like, but the harsh truth is that the southern populace are a broken shower of snivelling lapdogs to Power and Authority who would rather rat on their own mothers than risk "rocking the boat".

    And not just on the north. The way the entire populace have rolled over without even a whimper over the last 8 years is just pathetic.

    Not a people deserving of any respect.
    It was a long time coming, but the anti Water Charge campaign is a boat - rocker.
    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
    — Jean-Paul Sartre

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    in the national interest
    Posts
    17,680

    Default Re: British/RUC/Loyalist collusion


  6. #36
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Rockall
    Posts
    78,617

    Default Re: British/RUC/Loyalist collusion

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. FIVE View Post
    The British State has locked away information on colonial suppression going back to the 1950s, probably much longer. Trade secrets. Less used by them now the Empire is gone, but passed on to the US.
    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
    — Jean-Paul Sartre

  7. #37
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Kilmainham
    Posts
    4,892

    Default Re: British/RUC/Loyalist collusion

    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewinder View Post
    Nobody interested? Pretty much as I expected.
    Its an old story now Sidewinder ...... those who cared ...... knew it was going on at the time ...... those who turned a blind eye ..... will never admit they were wrong.
    Last edited by riposte; 17-06-2015 at 08:46 PM.
    "Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, misdiagnosing it, and then misapplying the wrong remedies.”

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    The Grove
    Posts
    3,908

    Default Re: British/RUC/Loyalist collusion

    Quote Originally Posted by riposte View Post
    Its an old story now Sidewinder ...... those who cared ...... knew it was going on at the time ...... those who turned a blind eye ..... will never admit they were wrong.
    In my youth there was a slogan...''For those who understand no explanation is necessary, for those who do not understand no explanation is possible.''
    Seems as relevant today.
    Happiness is an inside job.

  9. #39
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Derry
    Posts
    2,050

    Default Re: British/RUC/Loyalist collusion

    Quote Originally Posted by Trow View Post
    In my youth there was a slogan...''For those who understand no explanation is necessary, for those who do not understand no explanation is possible.''
    Seems as relevant today.
    Indeed. It's been...interesting...watching the response to this online.

    There is a determined effort by many to refuse to mention it at all. Especially the more vocal FF/FG/L heads who are forever yelping about Jean McConville - deafening silence from those tools. They are clearly hoping this completely disappears. But as we've noted, this process of disclosure is being driven by London so "hoping it is all going to go away if we keep schtum" seems a bit of a mindlessly unaware response. But then we are talking FF/FG/L drooling inbred gombeens here.

    Then there are those determined to drown it in a wave of faux-apathy "meh who cares I don't care about the north nobody cares about the north move on bored now more important things to be worrying about blah blah". The fact that these idiots are swarming all over the story going to great pains to bleat about how little they care clearly shows this is just a defence mechanism, or a kneejerk effort to bury the story.

    And then there are the lunatic Harrisite psychopaths who are sticking to the original script no matter what, and in total defiance of all facts and reason - The Provos beamed down from Mars one day, there was only some minor discrimination and it was "all sorted out" magically by 1970, no justification, mindless savages, regrettable measures taken to protect civilisation itself from Provo barbarism, I deplore all violence but curiously will always make excuses for and defend British and Unionist violence...blah blah blah" and these nutter scumbags will never admit that they are nothing but cowards and fascists - apologists for State terror and a State casually murdering its own citizens. Might Makes Right, Lawful Authority Is Always Right, Rebels Deserve To Die.

    And then you have the WhatAboutTheIRA obsessive trolls who just have to turn every single subject under the sun into a foam-flecked rant about the pernicious evils of "SF/IRA".

    I find it disappointing that a forum full of people who would profess themselves to be left-leaning champions of equal rights and opposed to abuses of State power and corruption, are so cowed and/or ideologically-imprisoned that they feel unable to comment on mass murder of civilians by State jackbooted goons. If this was a story about identical carry-on in Ukraine or Burma or somewhere youse would be all over it. And don't try to deny it.

    See just how much 40 years of Harrisite propaganda has messed with your heads? You've been subtly conditioned for decades to be terrified of proferring any comment on the north and especially any comment critical of British and Unionist scumbaggery. The psychological conditioning runs very very deep. A broken people.

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    3,613

    Default Re: British/RUC/Loyalist collusion

    Haven't seen the documentary, don't need to see it to know what went on. The Brits were 100% onside with the Unionists and fighting a filthy colonial war. Seen enough cases of pure innocents being blown away by the security forces up there to know that killing Taigs was like shooting vermin to them. I remember well Rosemary Nelson and Pat Finucane being set up for assassination when the Tories were openly calling them IRA lawyers.

    As I said before the Brits never left the South, the Southern security forces and Civil Service have always been riddled with their fellow-travellers and agents.

    It shouldn't be underestimated the size and ferocity of the anti-republican operation in the south. I don't think people in the south have been brainwashed, they adopted positions for political reasons and they could see through the BS of the media. For the Gaelers it was their politics to be anti-republican and apologists for the Brits, the same was true of Labour. For the FFers it was more a case of a silent shame at the impotence of the Irish state in the face of threats from the UK Govt and a desire to suppress any potential Republican challenge to the southern state.

    There was a ferocious anti-republican security operation in the south. I grew up in a town far from the border and yet there was 1 guard per 80 people there and their main focus was on keeping a boot on the throat of any republican activity. I also remember at the height of the hunger strikes seeing a very large dark green troop carrier type chopper passing nearby and thinking to myself that it had to be a Brit Army supplied or operated helicopter because we didn't have anything remotely like that then as far as I knew.

  11. #41
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Dun Laoghaire-Rathdown
    Posts
    8,498

    Default Re: British/RUC/Loyalist collusion

    I have to echo Shaadi here; I wasn't able to watch the doc, although I'm hoping to catch up on RTE player if I've any free time. But I know what the Brits were up to in the North, no arguments there.
    Re the major parties, again, Shaadi is right. FG is full of Redmondite apologists and deniers, true. Labour is just not interested in the North at all. FF did try; remember Haughey? He did start the peace process talks going, after being accused of arms smuggling to the 'RA. And Reynolds made huge efforts. I think the analysis of silent shame, is bang on for FF, but you can add covert efforts to help some Republicans to that list. This is now well documented, but was top secret back in the day. That is not to say they weren't guilty of all sorts of **** re big business, re zoning etc, but lining them up with FG on this issue alone is unfair.

    I would agree that not enough was done, though, but then, would more action have fixed anything, or would it have led to outright civil war? The Brits vastly out gun us on a military level, so conventional warfare wasn't an option. However, the Southside Provisional book did make it very clear that some high level support did exist. I do also remember that many of the Blackrock College old boys I went to college with were very nationalist leaning, I don't know if that was the school ethos or their parents etc, but you had to be wealthy to send your kids there.

    In a funny kind of a way, it's harder to convince the middle classes of this sort of carry on now than it was at the height of the troubles when it was staring us all in the face.

    I also don't think it's fair to accuse people on here of lack of engagement with the issue. Speaking personally, any lack of comment from me is simply because I have known about this sort of dirty tricks stuff for ages....it ain't news. I appreciate any attempts to bring it back into view though; FGs Redmondite **** is giving me a pain...
    "The floggings will continue until morale improves "

  12. #42
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    1,029

    Default Re: British/RUC/Loyalist collusion

    "The secret state is the main factor ensuring that much of our past will remain shrouded in darkness. Why should the Provos, or equivalent loyalist groups, spell out what they did and why to any "truth recovery" body when the Government systematically works to prevent the recovery of the truth about the role of its own agents?"

    This from Eamon McCann's article is useful to Sinn Fein, when they come under pressure prior to next years General Election, to elaborate on incidents that occurred in the past during the conflict. They can just say it was a Dirty War and a lot that happened will remain concealed.

    I haven't heard this documentary discussed much on the various radio stations post the programme. Maybe I just missed it, but I haven't heard Newstalk or Radio 1 discuss it in detail in the way they have discussed documentaries about the IRA disappeared or sexual assault cases connected with PIRA members in recent times. Will Myers or Harris et al have anything to say about it?

  13. #43
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    2,788

    Default Re: British/RUC/Loyalist collusion

    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewinder View Post
    But as we've noted, this process of disclosure is being driven by London so "hoping it is all going to go away if we keep schtum" seems a bit of a mindlessly unaware response.
    Might have to do with the disclosures of high level 'VIP' child abusers being protected by intelligence.

    Or as Queen Elisabeth allegedly once put it to Diana's butler: "there are powers at work in this country".

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...nas-death.html

  14. #44
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    2,788

    Default Re: British/RUC/Loyalist collusion

    Quote Originally Posted by goatstoe View Post
    I haven't heard this documentary discussed much on the various radio stations post the programme. Maybe I just missed it, but I haven't heard Newstalk or Radio 1 discuss it in detail in the way they have discussed documentaries about the IRA disappeared or sexual assault cases connected with PIRA members in recent times.
    I'm struggling to understand why anyone would be surprised at this.

    Quote Originally Posted by goatstoe View Post
    Will Myers or Harris et al have anything to say about it?
    Lol.

  15. #45
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    2,788

    Default Re: British/RUC/Loyalist collusion

    Limited hangout
    From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    A limited hangout or partial hangout is, according to Victor Marchetti, former special assistant to the Deputy Director of the Central Intelligence Agency, "spy jargon for a favorite and frequently used gimmick of the clandestine professionals. When their veil of secrecy is shredded and they can no longer rely on a phony cover story to misinform the public, they resort to admitting—sometimes even volunteering—some of the truth while still managing to withhold the key and damaging facts in the case. The public, however, is usually so intrigued by the new information that it never thinks to pursue the matter further."[1][2]
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limited_hangout

Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Share us
Follow Us