View Poll Results: Should Abortion be Legislated For in Ireland ?

Voters
98. You may not vote on this poll
  • The Woman Should Choose

    43 43.88%
  • The Woman Should Choose Up to a Time Limit

    35 35.71%
  • No Abortion Law Should be Passed

    3 3.06%
  • The Bill as Proposed Should Be Passed

    5 5.10%
  • Abortion Should Not Be Allowed

    2 2.04%
  • A Team of Experts Should Decide

    1 1.02%
  • One medical practitioner should decide

    4 4.08%
  • Abortion Should be Allowed If there is No Chance of the Baby Surviving

    16 16.33%
  • A Referendum is Needed: I would vote Yes

    10 10.20%
  • A Referendum is Needed: I would vote No

    5 5.10%
  • Time Limits Should Be Considered

    10 10.20%
  • Suicide Risk Should Not Be an Eligible Reason for Abortion

    14 14.29%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill 2013 and Referendum on 8th Amendment

  1. #466

    Default Re: Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill 2013

    I'm making the assumption that this is where the Referendum is being discussed.

    One thing I'm interested in is the allegations of removal and defacement of posters. The Yes side is casting a lot of aspersions at the No side on this one. Does anyone have any experience? The No side seem a tad messianic to me, one of their number was recorded in Tallaght at the weekend threatening to take a local TD up thr mountains in a van.

  2. #467
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    Default Re: Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Gerd Muller View Post
    I'm making the assumption that this is where the Referendum is being discussed.

    One thing I'm interested in is the allegations of removal and defacement of posters. The Yes side is casting a lot of aspersions at the No side on this one. Does anyone have any experience? The No side seem a tad messianic to me, one of their number was recorded in Tallaght at the weekend threatening to take a local TD up thr mountains in a van.
    Hi Gerd, I think if any side is guilty of being fanatic and tearing down the other sides posters it is the yes side. For example, in Dunlaoghaire there is this mural:




    It has remained unmarked and unvandalised, in fact it is still in pristine condition weeks after it was painted. I have no doubt that if that was a Love Both mural it would have been defaced in no time.

  3. #468
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    Default Re: Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill 2013

    I think there's no doubt people on both sides would deface each other's poster's but calling people on the Yes side fanatics while most No material contains pictures of dead babies is mental. I'd love to see a break down of financial backing. I drove from Galway to Cork last week and I counted No posters outnumbered Yes about 4:1 including four massive billboards on the way into Limerick that Frances McDormond would be proud of... Maybe not the content though. I've also noted a higher percentage of people canvassing for the No side and last night there was 6 people at the end of Shop Street with flyers.. I haven't seen anything like that on the Yes side.

    Recently, travelling between Mayo, Galway, Roscommon and from Galway to Cork, already mentioned, No poster's overwhelmingly outnumber Yes. I'm guessing the Paisleyite fanatics from the US Bible belt are shipping money into Ireland big time for this vote.

  4. #469
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    Default Re: Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill 2013

    I am gobsmacked that this forum still has no thread on the referendum to repeal 8th amendment, and that the referendum is being discussed on a revived 5 year old thread. How is it that a supposedly with-it forum on Irish politics has, up to this very late stage, ignored the top political issue in the country?

  5. #470
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    Default Re: Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Richardbouvet View Post
    I am gobsmacked that this forum still has no thread on the referendum to repeal 8th amendment, and that the referendum is being discussed on a revived 5 year old thread. How is it that a supposedly with-it forum on Irish politics has, up to this very late stage, ignored the top political issue in the country?
    At any stage, Richard Bouvet, it was/is open to you to start a thread. You're welcome to go right ahead. In my view, by the way, Brexit is a bigger issue by far.

    There has been discussion going on here since 2012 on abortion.

    http://www.politicalworld.org/showth...2#.WwBTE6QvwdU
    Last edited by C. Flower; 19-05-2018 at 11:08 PM.
    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
    — Jean-Paul Sartre

  6. #471
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    Default Re: Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Fraxinus View Post
    I think there's no doubt people on both sides would deface each other's poster's but calling people on the Yes side fanatics while most No material contains pictures of dead babies is mental.
    Well I suppose you are right insofar as there are fanatics as well as reasonable people on both sides. However, the retain the 8th posters around Dublin do not show dead Babies. They show live Babies who would very much like to stay alive.
    Maybe it is different in other places around Ireland, but I have seen no dead Baby posters around Dublin.


    Quote Originally Posted by Fraxinus View Post
    I'd love to see a break down of financial backing. I drove from Galway to Cork last week and I counted No posters outnumbered Yes about 4:1 including four massive billboards on the way into Limerick that Frances McDormond would be proud of... Maybe not the content though. I've also noted a higher percentage of people canvassing for the No side and last night there was 6 people at the end of Shop Street with flyers.. I haven't seen anything like that on the Yes side.
    I had to google Frances McDormond, which shows why I am no good at pub quizzes. Regarding the canvassers, that more people seem to be canvasing for the retain side shows the dept of feeling on this vital matter.
    The government has badly mis-calculated.
    Leo is in the process of discrediting his party in the eyes of many of its supporters. That is good imo, but as things stand those disaffected voters will stay at home or gravitate towards Fianna Fáil
    If there was a serious left-wing party who believed in, and canvassed for, retaining the 8th until and unless a better proposal was put forward they would find themselves representing a large section of the population.



    Quote Originally Posted by Fraxinus View Post
    Recently, travelling between Mayo, Galway, Roscommon and from Galway to Cork, already mentioned, No poster's overwhelmingly outnumber Yes. I'm guessing the Paisleyite fanatics from the US Bible belt are shipping money into Ireland big time for this vote.
    Well I am guessing that there are many international organisations in the starting blocks so they don't miss the opportunity presented by the opening of a new market should this referendum pass. As for the money trail, I recon both sides have support from abroad.

    And in case it is not yet obvious, I will be voting "NO", and mine is the taxi with the "save lives, save the 8th" sticker on it.

    Needless to say I speak only for myself.

  7. #472
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    Default Re: Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill 2013

    As I said, Leo has miscalculated and is getting desperate.


    Government members panicking, seem prepared to say anything to secure the repeal

    Today, Taoiseach Leo Varadkar made a series of statements during an interview on Today with Sean O’Rourke on RTÉ. In one statement he said: “If there is a ‘No’ on Friday it is only time before someone hemorrhages or bleeds to death.”
    Commenting on his remarks, Dr Ruth Cullen of the Love Both campaign said: “This latest statement by the Taoiseach has to be the most outrageous and disgraceful remark made by any member of the Government so far in this campaign. It’s clear that some members of government are starting to panic over the fact that the ‘No’ side might win and these same members of government seem prepared to say almost anything take away the right to life from unborn babies.”

    “The Taoiseach is in effect saying that if people reject the Government’s abortion on demand proposals they will be responsible for someone bleeding to death. His remarks are so vile the Taoiseach should immediately apologise and retract them. This marks a new low, even for a Government that has engaged in such widespread scaremongering and misinformation.”

    She continued:

    “The Taoiseach also used the interview to tell a series of mistruths to the Irish people including the suggestion that removing the Eighth amendment is the only way to deal with difficult cases, and his claim that there are so-called “restrictions” in the section of the proposed bill which allows abortion without any reason whatsoever up to 12 weeks of pregnancy.”

    She concluded:

    “I think many people will be absolutely disgusted by the Taoiseach’s statements today, he has completely ignored the fact that Ireland without abortion is one of the safest countries in the world for pregnant women. Instead he is deliberately seeking to emotionally bully those opposed to abortion with the suggestion that they will have blood on their hands if they vote ‘No’ to his abortion proposal. We must remember that only five years ago he was completely opposed to abortion on demand, now today he uses his position to throw exaggerated and insulting language at people who hold the same position he, until recently held. This shows again that politicians cannot be trusted with the rights in the Eighth Amendment, it is also why people are increasingly planning to vote ‘No’ on the 25th of May.”

    ENDS
    from here: https://loveboth.ie/vile-remark-by-taoiseach/

  8. #473
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    Default Re: Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill 2013

    I got 2 "No" flyers in my post this morning. Going through Dublin I would say it is 2 thirds No posters to one third Yes. I've seen a lot of evidence of Yes meetings. Maybe they are preaching to the converted in these meetings, but 1,000 plus doctors have come out for Yes. This is they say on the basis of what they see happening day to day. I think it will go down to "will the young come out and vote ? ". Varadkar makes an ass of himself every time he opens his mouth: the topic is not relevant.
    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
    — Jean-Paul Sartre

  9. #474
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    Default Re: Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill 2013

    Seeing more or less 50/50 between yes and no canvassing/posters here in SCD.

    Incidentally, all campaigners on the ground seem to be female. I reckon both sides seem to have made a decision to keep the blokes out of it? Probably makes sense.
    "If you go far enough to either extreme of the political spectrum, Communist or fascist, you'll find hard-eyed men with guns who believe that anybody who doesn't think as they do should be incarcerated or exterminated. " - Jim Garrison, Former DA, New Orleans.

  10. #475
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    Default Re: Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by C. Flower View Post
    Varadkar makes an ass of himself every time he opens his mouth: the topic is not relevant.
    Interesting that, unlike our Sainted Leader Leo, some of the outspoken gays in the meeja are fanatically right wing on social as well as economic issues.
    "If you go far enough to either extreme of the political spectrum, Communist or fascist, you'll find hard-eyed men with guns who believe that anybody who doesn't think as they do should be incarcerated or exterminated. " - Jim Garrison, Former DA, New Orleans.

  11. #476
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    Default Re: Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by eamo View Post
    As I said, Leo has miscalculated and is getting desperate.




    from here: https://loveboth.ie/vile-remark-by-taoiseach/
    As I understand it, the referendum is about whether Article 8 should be retained or deleted. I will vote for deletion, as I believe that legislation is the better way to deal with these complicated issues. I do not believe that Article 8 should ever have been in Bunreacht, and it has been shown that the 1983 campaign, which unfortunately was successful, was entirely a tool of various right wing Catholic and other fundamentalist groups.

    Incidentally, I wonder how many of those born from unplanned pregnancies after 1983 have since emigrated? Perhaps I should ask Opus Dei or Iona Institute for an estimate. I jest, of course, the reich wing rosary bead clutching brigade don't give a damn about you once you are born.
    "If you go far enough to either extreme of the political spectrum, Communist or fascist, you'll find hard-eyed men with guns who believe that anybody who doesn't think as they do should be incarcerated or exterminated. " - Jim Garrison, Former DA, New Orleans.

  12. #477
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    Default Re: Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill 2013

    There's a bit of a Brexit/Trump/Irish GE vibe to the current opinion polling on this issue.

    Regards...jmcc

  13. #478
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    Default Re: Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill 2013 and Referendum on 8th Amendment

    There is a discussion of suicide and abortion ongoing. I vividly remember the woman who threw herself off the cliff in Howth a couple of years ago as she was pregnant with twins and did not want to have them. Woman, and twins, dead.

    Earlier today, the heads of two maternity hospitals gave a press statement that was briefly relayed by RTE. I can't find a link to it - I wonder was it written up at all? They stated unequivocally that women in Ireland are being put at risk by the 8th amendment as decisions are delayed that should not be, because the woman is pregnant. Irish doctors who deal day in day out with life and death issues for women seem in very many cases to favour Repeal.
    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
    — Jean-Paul Sartre

  14. #479
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    Default Re: Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill 2013 and Referendum on 8th Amendment

    Case of a Wexford woman in 2010 who was refused an abortion although she had terminal cancer. She had to wait two weeks for an "ethics" decision, and then had to travel to the U.K. The law has not changed since then.

    http://www.politicalworld.org/showth...e#.WwMFu6QvwdU
    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
    — Jean-Paul Sartre

  15. #480
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    Default Re: Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill 2013 and Referendum on 8th Amendment

    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
    — Jean-Paul Sartre

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