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Thread: Germans and French Using Crisis to Push Arms Sales on Greece?

  1. #16
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    Default Re: Germans and French Using Crisis to Push Arms Sales on Greece?

    Max Keiser mentioned the Greek arms sales over the last week or so. Will root it out!
    "There are two ways to conquer and enslave a nation. One is by sword. The other is by debt." -- John Adams

  2. #17
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    Default Re: Germans and French Using Crisis to Push Arms Sales on Greece?

    Associated Press says they have sight of further EU/IMF austerity measures to be imposed on Greece at tomorrow's Eurogroup meeting. One of the demands, according to AP, is a further reduction of the military budget by 300 million. They have already agreed to a 400 million cut. Combined, this would about half our previous "defence" budget. I can't believe that the death merchants are just going to give up on such a willing partner as Greece always seemed to be. Mind you, the willingness was always directly related to the size of the bribe. After all, a submarine or 2 should be worth a hefty envelope under the table.

  3. #18
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    Default Re: Germans and French Using Crisis to Push Arms Sales on Greece?

    The Greeks "paid double" for German submarines with a couple of noughts tagged on to the end of every purchase and skimmed off by various Greek elites and German suppliers.

    Between 2002-04, Ferrostaal paid 7.5m euros to PDM and Zelan. No activity of any substance can be traced to this Cypriot-based duo, and all the record of directors have vapourised. But their job was to ‘facilitate contract awards’ by Greek ministries. ‘The complete lack of any documentation supporting performance by these companies raises serious concerns’, says a confidential German report. In 2004, Dusseldorf prosecutors fingered Sotiris Emmanouil, the head of Hellenic Shipyards, as the recipient of illegal bribes running into millions of euros by yet another intermediary – HDW – and a later report showed he had indeed received 2.2 million euros via an affiliate in October of that year. Again, no evidence of services supplied exists. In July 2007, 11 million euros were handed to shady ‘facilitators’ Dolmarton. No back-up of tasks performed.

    But when it comes to the Greek government’s purchase of four 214 Class submarines from Germany after 2000, you have to see the amounts syphoned off to believe them. Says the legal investigation referred to earlier:

    ‘The Project Archimedes [submarine supply] contract was signed in 2000. It was in the volume of 1.14bn euros…..the [German supplier] consortium incurred additional offset obligations of 1.53 billion euros.’

    So the price to the Greek taxpayer doubled….entirely due to corrupt payments made to the Greek governing elite.

    A fourth submarine supply contract was signed May 2002. The audit investigation quoted above states that it ‘had a volume of approximately 464.9m euros….and offset obligations of 563 million…’

    Again, backhanders doubled the price. And, say several Greek sources, even the ‘real’ price had been stuffed with additional items that represented profiteering by Ferrostaal and its associates.
    Read the whole lot. Very interesting

    http://hat4uk.wordpress.com/2012/03/...o-sink-greece/

  4. #19
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    Default Re: Germans and French Using Crisis to Push Arms Sales on Greece?

    The Greek politicians were bought, but it was the arms manufacturers/dealers who really milked it.

    PASOK up to the eyeballs in it.

    The fate of semi-colonial countries, to be ruled by a corrupt intermediary class of self-seeking sell-outs ?

    http://www.politicalworld.org/showpo...postcount=1181

    http://www.ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/_w...02/2012_426831
    Last edited by C. Flower; 12-03-2012 at 07:13 PM.

  5. #20
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    Default Re: Germans and French Using Crisis to Push Arms Sales on Greece?

    One major factor is that France and Germany's arms industries have greatly profited from this profligate military spending, leading their governments to put pressure on Greece not to cancel lucrative arms deals. In the five years up to 2010, Greece purchased more of Germany's arms exports than any other country, buying 15% of its weapons. Over the same period, Greece was the third-largest customer for France's military exports and its top buyer in Europe. Significantly, when the first bail-out package was being negotiated in 2010, Greece spent 7.1bn euros (£5.9bn) on its military, up from 6.24bn euros in 2007. A total of £1bn was spent on French and German weapons, plunging the country even further into debt in the same year that social spending was cut by 1.8bn euros. It has claimed by some that this was no coincidence, and that the EU bail-out was explicitly tied to burgeoning arms deals. In particular, there is alleged to have been concerted pressure from France to buy several stealth frigates. Meanwhile Germany sold 223 howitzers and completed a controversial deal on faulty submarines, leading to an investigation into accusations of bribes being given to Greek officials.
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...itary-spending

  6. #21
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    Default Re: Germans and French Using Crisis to Push Arms Sales on Greece?

    Portugal is Germany’s second largest arms purchaser.

    http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2012...-weaponry.html

  7. #22
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    Default Re: Germans and French Using Crisis to Push Arms Sales on Greece?

    What on earth does Portugal need a huge army for??

  8. #23
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    Default Re: Germans and French Using Crisis to Push Arms Sales on Greece?

    Castilians with long memories

  9. #24
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    Default Re: Germans and French Using Crisis to Push Arms Sales on Greece?

    Congratulations on your prize everyone



  10. #25
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    Default Re: Germans and French Using Crisis to Push Arms Sales on Greece?

    ATHENS — When Antonis Kantas, a deputy in the Defense Ministry here, spoke up against the purchase of expensive German-made tanks in 2001, a representative of the tank’s manufacturer stopped by his office to leave a satchel on his sofa. It contained 600,000 euros, about $814,000. Other arms manufacturers eager to make deals came by, too, some guiding him through the ins and outs of international banking and then paying him off with deposits to his overseas accounts.

    At the time, Mr. Kantas, a wiry former military officer, did not actually have the authority to decide much of anything on his own. But corruption was so rampant inside the Greek equivalent of the Pentagon that even a man of his relatively modest rank, he testified recently, was able to amass nearly $19 million in just five years on the job.

    Greeks are hardened to stories of corruption. But even they have been transfixed by Mr. Kantas’s confessions since he was arrested recently on a litany of charges including money laundering and behavior that was detrimental to the Greek state. Never before has an official opened such a wide window on the eye-popping system of payoffs at work inside a Greek government ministry. At various points, Mr. Kantas, who returned to testify again last week, told prosecutors he had taken so many bribes he could not possibly remember the details.

    Mr. Kantas’s admissions, prompted by his hope that if he tells all he will be eligible for leniency under a new law, has left many Greeks hoping that they are finally witnessing the beginning of the end of the unchecked graft that helped plunge Greece into its current crisis. In the past, few officials have been convicted of corruption related charges and those who were went to jail without saying a word. There was no benefit in doing otherwise.

    But as details of his back-room deals emerge, Mr. Kantas is also fueling a broader outrage here, particularly toward Germany, which has berated Greece for the financial mess it finds itself in. Mr. Kantas’s testimony, if accurate, illustrates how arms makers from Germany, France, Sweden and Russia passed out bribes liberally, often through Greek representatives, to sell the government weaponry that it could ill afford and that experts say was in many cases overpriced and subpar.

    The €600,000, for instance, bought Mr. Kantas’s silence on the tanks, which were deemed of little value in any wars Greece might fight, according to Constantinos P. Fraggos, an expert on the Greek military who has written several books on the subject. Greece went ahead and bought 170 of the tanks for about $2.3 billion.

    Adding to the absurdity of the purchase (almost all of it on credit), the ministry bought virtually no ammunition for them, Mr. Fraggos said. It also bought fighter planes without electronic guidance systems and paid more than $4 billion for troubled, noisy submarines that are not yet finished and sit today virtually abandoned in a shipyard outside Athens. At the height of the crisis, when it was unclear whether Greece would be thrown out of the euro zone and long before the submarines were finished, the Greek Parliament approved a final $407 million payment for the German submarines.

    “First, you have to blame the rotten Greek system,” Mr. Fraggos said. “But the sellers bear a very big part. They were bribing officials and lending money to an almost bankrupt country so they could sell their products.”

    The Defense Ministry is hardly the only ministry suspected of being a hotbed of corruption. But the Defense Ministry makes a particularly rich target for investigators because Greece went on a huge spending spree after 1996 when it got into a low-level skirmish with Turkey over the Imia islets in the Aegean Sea.
    NYT: more here.

    So Many Bribes, a Greek Official Can't Recall Them All By SUZANNE DALEY

    The testimony by a deputy in the Defense Ministry, if accurate, illustrates how arms makers from Germany, France, Sweden and Russia passed out payoffs to sell Greece weaponry that it could ill afford.
    As a general rule the most successful man in life is the man who has the best information.

  11. #26
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    Default Re: Germans and French Using Crisis to Push Arms Sales on Greece?

    Quote Originally Posted by Count Bobulescu View Post
    NYT: more here.

    So Many Bribes, a Greek Official Can't Recall Them All By SUZANNE DALEY

    The testimony by a deputy in the Defense Ministry, if accurate, illustrates how arms makers from Germany, France, Sweden and Russia passed out payoffs to sell Greece weaponry that it could ill afford.
    The arms industry is notorious for bribery and corruption. The manufacturers and the countries they are based in have the advantage of power and wealth.

    Greece seems to have been tipped over the edge by arms purchases and the Olympics.
    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
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  12. #27
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    Default Re: Germans and French Using Crisis to Push Arms Sales on Greece?

    The full story of this is followed from day one (and updated as it unfolds) in the Thread "Hanging out the Dirty Laundry". There is however a lot more to this than what meets the eye, as the various bits and pieces that do reach the public clearly show. The arms scandal is only one tentacle of the whole sorry corrupt system that seems to rule Europe, which found a willing partner in the successive corrupt Greek governments who seem to have had as their prime objective to be more corrupt than their predecessors. And now that you mention the Olympics...guess who was minister in charge of that sorry collection of bribery and corruption? Indeed, none other than our current minister for foreign affairs, Veni... The show must go on.

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