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Thread: Magdalene Laundries: Compensation, Payment and Redress.....

  1. #16
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    Default Re: Magdalene Laundries: Compensation, Payment and Redress.....

    Hmm- I've been waiting to see the details on the proposed redress scheme without commenting too much as I knew the Magdalenes' legal advisors would be commenting sooner or later.

    Well done to Gerry Adams making the statement he did there in the Dail. Good questions- and to CF as well who points out that the issue of these orders holding on to records which might well contain information relevant to the Maggies is not bloody acceptable.

    I'd be tempted to put through an emergency legislatory instrument if required to bring them under data protection legislation and effectively seize them immediately as records of national importance.

    There must be a vehicle for the preservation of such records or signal documents- and leaving them in the grubby hands of the profiteers in clerical garb is not acceptable to my mind.
    Think National. Act Local. Oh- and superstition is just the dark matter of human history.

  2. #17
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    Default Re: Magdalene Laundries: Compensation, Payment and Redress.....

    Quote Originally Posted by captain con o'sullivan View Post
    hmm- i've been waiting to see the details on the proposed redress scheme without commenting too much as i knew the magdalenes' legal advisors would be commenting sooner or later.

    Well done to gerry adams making the statement he did there in the dail. Good questions- and to cf as well who points out that the issue of these orders holding on to records which might well contain information relevant to the maggies is not bloody acceptable.

    I'd be tempted to put through an emergency legislatory instrument if required to bring them under data protection legislation and effectively seize them immediately as records of national importance.

    There must be a vehicle for the preservation of such records or signal documents- and leaving them in the grubby hands of the profiteers in clerical garb is not acceptable to my mind.
    +100

  3. #18
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    Default Re: Magdalene Laundries: Compensation, Payment and Redress.....

    Nuns are kicking back.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/...10.html?via=mr

    I would like to know if the Government has met with the Orders this year and if any assurances were given by the Government.
    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
    — Jean-Paul Sartre

  4. #19
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    Default Re: Magdalene Laundries: Compensation, Payment and Redress.....

    We're getting no solid information from either party on any meetings.

    I don't like the way the Govt. (with the help of the lame-stream media) has turned the Magdalene story away from human rights abuse down to a mere matter of some State involvement in some laundries.
    Give me a misty day, pearly gray, silver, silky faced, wide-awake crescent-shaped smile

  5. #20
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    Default Re: Magdalene Laundries: Compensation, Payment and Redress.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew49 View Post
    We're getting no solid information from either party on any meetings.

    I don't like the way the Govt. (with the help of the lame-stream media) has turned the Magdalene story away from human rights abuse down to a mere matter of some State involvement in some laundries.
    That is certainly what they have tried to do.

    But getting over that first hurdle has given some of the women a lot more confidence and they are networking and talking to each other.

    I think that the sheer horror of what was done to people has had some impact on the wider population.

    The danger is that a wait and see approach over the 3 month period until the Judge reports will allow that perception to ebb away to some degree.

    Onward and upwards

    On the Orders side - a person associated with High Park was seen leaving the Dail on the afternoon that the report was launched.

    It seems unlikely that that was a coincidence.
    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
    — Jean-Paul Sartre

  6. #21
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    Default Re: Magdalene Laundries: Compensation, Payment and Redress.....

    Before the notorious indemnity deal there were several meetings between Govt. reps* and CORI reps - I wouldn't describe these meetings as 'secret' but no notes have come to light on them. When formal meetings did take place CORI played a blinder and made the indemnity deal offer on a 'take it or leave it' basis.

    NB The Govt. reps* - AFAIK - at the earlier meetings were not present at the formal meetings. Also the 'deal' was signed and sealed without any public or legal scrutiny!

    I'd wager something similar is going on now.

    * These Govt. reps were people friendly to 'both sides' of the abuse issue - and by both sides I mean Church & State as abuse victims/survivors were not involved in any of these shenanigans!
    Give me a misty day, pearly gray, silver, silky faced, wide-awake crescent-shaped smile

  7. #22
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    Default Re: Magdalene Laundries: Compensation, Payment and Redress.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew49 View Post
    Before the notorious indemnity deal there were several meetings between Govt. reps* and CORI reps - I wouldn't describe these meetings as 'secret' but no notes have come to light on them. When formal meetings did take place CORI played a blinder and made the indemnity deal offer on a 'take it or leave it' basis.

    NB The Govt. reps* - AFAIK - at the earlier meetings were not present at the formal meetings. Also the 'deal' was signed and sealed without any public or legal scrutiny!

    I'd wager something similar is going on now.

    * These Govt. reps were people friendly to 'both sides' of the abuse issue - and by both sides I mean Church & State as abuse victims/survivors were not involved in any of these shenanigans!
    Perhaps Sinn Fein would ask a question, or Clare Daly.

    I've given up hoping anyone else on the Left will show any interest.
    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
    — Jean-Paul Sartre

  8. #23
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    Default Re: Magdalene Laundries: Compensation, Payment and Redress.....

    Of course there will be some hole in the corner attempt at a bent deal between the government and the religious orders.

    That is the known modus operandi of Irish governments when it comes to religious orders. Kenny and Gilmore referred to a 'twisted psychology' with reference to the now notorious affairs in social policy but what they didn't say was that it was still around and certainly in civil service and public administrative circles.
    Think National. Act Local. Oh- and superstition is just the dark matter of human history.

  9. #24
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    Default Re: Magdalene Laundries: Compensation, Payment and Redress.....

    Women very upset by the nuns interview read out on RTE radio last night.

    RTE's the "God-Slot" programme

    http://www.rte.ie/radio1/the-god-slot/

    http://www.thejournal.ie/magdalene-s...25633-Mar2013/

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magdalene_asylum
    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
    — Jean-Paul Sartre

  10. #25
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    Default Re: Magdalene Laundries: Compensation, Payment and Redress.....

    Quote Originally Posted by C. Flower View Post
    Women very upset by the nuns interview read out on RTE radio last night.

    RTE's the "God-Slot" programme

    http://www.rte.ie/radio1/the-god-slot/

    http://www.thejournal.ie/magdalene-s...25633-Mar2013/

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magdalene_asylum
    I watched the 'Sex in a Cold Climate' documentary again the other day, there can be no possible excuse for the behaviour of the nuns right down to the 'they were keeping the girls for nothing' crap. The laundries were hugely successful who if they had enough money wouldn't send their laundry to the nuns rather than a mere profit making business?

    I think the survivors are right to be upset. A right of reply is fine a pack lies to add to the rest is not.

  11. #26
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    Default Re: Magdalene Laundries: Compensation, Payment and Redress.....

    Quote Originally Posted by bernadette View Post
    I watched the 'Sex in a Cold Climate' documentary again the other day, there can be no possible excuse for the behaviour of the nuns right down to the 'they were keeping the girls for nothing' crap. The laundries were hugely successful who if they had enough money wouldn't send their laundry to the nuns rather than a mere profit making business?

    I think the survivors are right to be upset. A right of reply is fine a pack lies to add to the rest is not.
    It's a short programme - I've just listened to it twice and am transcribing it.

    From the point of view of RTE's supposed balance, it is shocking. Eileen Dunne, the reporter, the nuns and Michael Kelly of a catholic newspaper - supposedly there to provide balance, all push the same Church line i.e. "that was what the era was like"

    Most women in Ireland in the 1970s, 80s, and 90s, were not locked up as slaves.

    It was really a shocking piece of pro-Church baloney, from start to finish, making excuses for the laundries.
    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
    — Jean-Paul Sartre

  12. #27
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    Default Re: Magdalene Laundries: Compensation, Payment and Redress.....

    Quote Originally Posted by C. Flower View Post
    It's a short programme - I've just listened to it twice and am transcribing it.

    From the point of view of RTE's supposed balance, it is shocking. Eileen Dunne, the reporter, the nuns and Michael Kelly of a catholic newspaper - supposedly there to provide balance, all push the same Church line i.e. "that was what the era was like"

    Most women in Ireland in the 1970s, 80s, and 90s, were not locked up as slaves.

    It was really a shocking piece of pro-Church baloney, from start to finish, making excuses for the laundries.
    +10

  13. #28
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    Default Re: Magdalene Laundries: Compensation, Payment and Redress.....

    'We're all normal it is the rest of the world that is mad'.



    The exquisite entertainment to be had from watching the swivel-eyed try to find a way to portray their psychology as 'healthy'.

    Boy oh boy. Ireland. Leading the world in mental health since the 6th century.
    Think National. Act Local. Oh- and superstition is just the dark matter of human history.

  14. #29
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    Default Re: Magdalene Laundries: Compensation, Payment and Redress.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Con O'Sullivan View Post
    'We're all normal it is the rest of the world that is mad'.



    The exquisite entertainment to be had from watching the swivel-eyed try to find a way to portray their psychology as 'healthy'.

    Boy oh boy. Ireland. Leading the world in mental health since the 6th century.
    What data is that based on ?
    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
    — Jean-Paul Sartre

  15. #30
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    Default Re: Magdalene Laundries: Compensation, Payment and Redress.....

    The penitentials were handbooks for priests used in private confession throughout western Europe from the early sixth through the eleventh centuries composed of lists of sins and their corresponding recommended penances. Through the penitentials it is possible to gain a glimpse into the daily lives of early medieval people through the sins they confessed to and which were eventually included in the handbooks. This study will examine how the penitentials were used as teaching tools for the Christianization of sexual morality and as an apparatus for maintaining the separateness between the carnal and the spiritual necessary for the holy to coexist with the sexual. This study will take the form of a closer examination of smaller specific categories of deviance: the nocturnal emissions of clerics, sexual relations during menstruation and pregnancy, homosexuality, bestiality, incest, and adultery. What the penitentials have to say regarding each of these topics will be systematically analyzed for patterns both geographically and temporally as well as being placed within its medieval context.

    LINK Pdf - Transgressing the Boundaries of Holiness: Sexual Deviance in
    the Early Medieval Penitential Handbooks of Ireland, England
    and France 500-1000
    Give me a misty day, pearly gray, silver, silky faced, wide-awake crescent-shaped smile

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