Balfour Declaration

[Holly]

Today in history: 2 November 1917

The Balfour Declaration (dated 2 November 1917) was a letter from the United Kingdom's Foreign Secretary Arthur James Balfour to Walter Rothschild (Second Baron Rothschild), a leader of the British Jewish community, for transmission to the Zionist Federation of Great Britain and Ireland.

The document made clear the support of the British government for a Jewish homeland in Palestine. It is suggested that it was used by the English to persuade the Jewish Bolshevik leaders to remain in the Great War and also to persuade the Americans to join in as Zionists were well-placed in the Woodrow Wilson administration.



Zionism was based on the desire of Jews to have their own country as a place where they would be safe from anti-Semitism but they had never expected to have it miraculously handed to them in such a fashion as in the Balfour Declaration. Although the letter mentions a Jewish "home" as distinct from a country, the Zionists always intended that a Jewish state would be established as soon as Jews made-up the majority of the population of Palestine and this is what happened in 1948.

[fluffybiscuits]

Today in history: 2 November 1917

The Balfour Declaration (dated 2 November 1917) was a letter from the United Kingdom's Foreign Secretary Arthur James Balfour to Walter Rothschild (Second Baron Rothschild), a leader of the British Jewish community, for transmission to the Zionist Federation of Great Britain and Ireland.

The document made clear the support of the British government for a Jewish homeland in Palestine. It is suggested that it was used by the English to persuade the Jewish Bolshevik leaders to remain in the Great War and also to persuade the Americans to join in as Zionists were well-placed in the Woodrow Wilson administration.



Zionism was based on the desire of Jews to have their own country as a place where they would be safe from anti-Semitism but they had never expected to have it miraculously handed to them in such a fashion as in the Balfour Declaration. Although the letter mentions a Jewish "home" as distinct from a country, the Zionists always intended that a Jewish state would be established as soon as Jews made-up the majority of the population of Palestine and this is what happened in 1948.

And since then this is what sowed the seeds of discontent in the area and was responsible for the divisions that we see now. A bi state solution should have been sought to deal with displaced Palestinians who were bullied off the land. Unusually there was some oppostion from the Zionists in Britian and this is detailed in the Wikipedia article

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balfour_Declaration

The phrase "national home" was intentionally used instead of "state" because of opposition to the Zionist program within the British Cabinet. Following discussion of the initial draft the Cabinet Secretary, Mark Sykes, met with the Zionist negotiators to clarify their aims. His official report back to the Cabinet categorically stated that the Zionists did not want "to set up a Jewish Republic or any other form of state in Palestine or in any part of Palestine"

[Holly]

Israel, being a Jewish state, brought into existence by the English, has turned-out to be a Frankenstein racist country, indistinguishable from its, now defunct, ally, Apartheid South Africa. It even wants to set-up Bantustans in the Occupied Palestinian Territories.


The Ramallah Bantustan

[fluffybiscuits]

Israel, being a Jewish state, brought into existence by the English, has turned-out to be a Frankenstein racist country, indistinguishable from its, now defunct, ally, Apartheid South Africa. It even wants to set-up Bantustans in the Occupied Palestinian Territories.


The Ramallah Bantustan

Forgive my ignorance but what is a Bantustan?

[C. Flower]

Germany's large numbers of Jewish people used to consider themselves as German. Zionism went along with the Nazi view that Jews should live separately.

Bloody Brits as usual stirring up trouble.

[Holly]

Forgive my ignorance but what is a Bantustan?

South African whites called the natives Bantu and made reservations for them which were termed Bantustans.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bantustan

[Saoirse go Deo]

I vaguely recall a recent survey which revealed widespread racist prejudice among Israeli Jews.

Does anyone know what I'm talking about? I just saw the headline at the time and would like to read more.

[Lapsedmethodist]

Germany's large numbers of Jewish people used to consider themselves as German. Zionism went along with the Nazi view that Jews should live separately.

Bloody Brits as usual stirring up trouble.

Firstly, and let's get it out of the way, Balfour was an anti-semite. His committment to a Jewish homeland was a trade-off for getting the Aliens Act passed - the purpose of which was to stop immigration of Jews from Eastern Europe who were at the time undergoing pogroms. At this time Zionism had been a Jewish political philosophy for some 40 or so years , but for every Zionist there were 1000 assimilationists. Anyone claiming to be an anti-Zionist has an intellectual and moral responsibility to explain what happened to the 1000 assimilationists, and what, if they deem the Jews unfit or un-whatever to have a homeland, makes assimilation today different from the past.

[TotalMayhem]

Israel, being a Jewish state, brought into existence by the English

Do me one better, Holly.

A cretinous British government minister promised Baron Rothschild, who only needed to wave a few IOUs to get what he wanted (mind you, back then the Rothschild's weren't the "now defunct" banker dynasty turned grape growing philanthropists, they owned the British economy), a patch of land which wasn't even rightfully theirs. A win-win situation for everyone, except maybe the Ottomans and a few local ragheads, which was nothing more really than a minor inconvenience. But it certainly wasn't "the English" who brought into existence the State of Israel.

[Holly]

I vaguely recall a recent survey which revealed widespread racist prejudice among Israeli Jews.

Does anyone know what I'm talking about? I just saw the headline at the time and would like to read more.

Perhaps you are referring to the survey published in September by Prof. Camil Fuchs, one of Israel’s leading pollsters.
It concluded that anti-Arab racism and support for Apartheid are fed by the stalling of negotiations to solve the conflict with the Palestinians over statehood, with settlement construction a major factor. The wish for separation is well understood in the context of a two state solution; but there is no solution in sight, and annexation trends are increasing. if Israel has to control the 2.5 million Palestinians in the territories, the wish for separation could lead to institutionalized Apartheid.

[Apjp]

Firstly, and let's get it out of the way, Balfour was an anti-semite. His committment to a Jewish homeland was a trade-off for getting the Aliens Act passed - the purpose of which was to stop immigration of Jews from Eastern Europe who were at the time undergoing pogroms. At this time Zionism had been a Jewish political philosophy for some 40 or so years , but for every Zionist there were 1000 assimilationists. Anyone claiming to be an anti-Zionist has an intellectual and moral responsibility to explain what happened to the 1000 assimilationists, and what, if they deem the Jews unfit or un-whatever to have a homeland, makes assimilation today different from the past.

Why should one religious group have its own country? The Jews stole that land from the Arabs and they commit the same injustices on arabs that the nazis committed on them, only we have not quite reached the final solution stage yet for the palestinians. This is essentially the same bigoted argument that Paisley and his fore bearers had against Irish unity to force republicans to flee their homes whilst the Orange state treated the Republicans and Catholics as second class citizens. Steal land and don't share it with the natives. Great claim to a bigoted homeland.

[Lapsedmethodist]

Why should one religious group have its own country? The Jews stole that land from the Arabs and they commit the same injustices on arabs that the nazis committed on them, only we have not quite reached the final solution stage yet for the palestinians. This is essentially the same bigoted argument that Paisley and his fore bearers had against Irish unity to force republicans to flee their homes whilst the Orange state treated the Republicans and Catholics as second class citizens. Steal land and don't share it with the natives. Great claim to a bigoted homeland.

So you have no answer then to the question that I put; why would assimilationism work today, given its abject failure for over a century ? Instead you post a garbled screed which can be found on any so-called pro-Palestinian website.

[Sam Lord]

So you have no answer then to the question that I put; why would assimilationism work today, given its abject failure for over a century ? Instead you post a garbled screed which can be found on any so-called pro-Palestinian website.

What do you mean by assimilationism?

[Shaadi]

Firstly, and let's get it out of the way, Balfour was an anti-semite. His committment to a Jewish homeland was a trade-off for getting the Aliens Act passed - the purpose of which was to stop immigration of Jews from Eastern Europe who were at the time undergoing pogroms. At this time Zionism had been a Jewish political philosophy for some 40 or so years , but for every Zionist there were 1000 assimilationists. Anyone claiming to be an anti-Zionist has an intellectual and moral responsibility to explain what happened to the 1000 assimilationists, and what, if they deem the Jews unfit or un-whatever to have a homeland, makes assimilation today different from the past.

Anyone claiming to be pro-Zionist has an intellectual and moral responsibility to explain why they support the Eretz Israel project and they do, despite whatever sophistry they deploy to deflect from it. Israel exists, most reasonable people accept that an Israel which ceased expanding would be an acceptable entity. Israel has no intention of ceasing to expand, all the sophistry in the world can't cover the basic facts that Israel is using religious fundamentalist settlers to create Eretz Israel. All the bull about terrorism is bull. Israel uses the conflict as fig leaf, not that it needs a fig leaf with big brother paying Israel's way.

All the yapping about Israel's security is just a cover for support for colonialism. If you're in favour of colonialism, just spit it out.

[Ogiol]

Very fascinating thread. I'd just like to add/recommend Umberto Eco's book, the prague cemetery. Its a fictional work but it treats anti-semetism during the middle and second half of the 19th century. It is really a fascinating account of how anti-semetism was stirred up and at the end there is a big shocker.

I suppose that the jews were a much easier target back then, in the sense that all sorts of conspiracy theory could be made up because the jewish situation (a religion but also a people dispersed) really permitted the idea of world-wide infiltration by jews, etc. I think that one belief is what marked them out for such sigularly harsh treatment.