Roisin Shortall has resigned as junior minister for Health

[rebellin]

Green Goddess' "bilious tuppence" comment which has a link to her column on a wealth tax, also links to her previous column; "We Must Only Stay in Coalition if We Can Uphold Labour Values", which is very much to the point

[fluffybiscuits]

The reason Róisín Shortall’s resignation was inevitable was that any Labour TD with any integrity could never really go along with the policies of the majority party in the government. This could be papered over since the government took power, but now that the Troika dictated budget is up for debate in the Dail the whole veneer of coalition unity is breaking down fast.

+1

If Shortall could not stand by the descisions that Reilly was making then what does it say for the rest of the Labour members. Most of Labour now have no backbone and are not interested in doing anything other than furthering their own interests like the rest of the county.

[rebellin]

+1

If Shortall could not stand by the decisions that Reilly was making then what does it say for the rest of the Labour members. Most of Labour now have no backbone and are not interested in doing anything other than furthering their own interests like the rest of the county.

I would say that the Greens had no backbone last January, but we all remember that when pushed to the limit on policies they held dear they brought down the government coaltion.

There is ferment throughout Europe against the very austerity policies the present Irish government is acquiescing to , and that will influence political affairs in Ireland at least as much as the little inter party squabbles and fiefdom we all react to.. Look to the SPD challenge to Merkel in Germany.Look to the rumours that Monti will quit in Italy. Look to the Greek, Spanish and Portuguese demonstrations.Many of the players in all these communicate with some of the more principled Labour TDs and activists.

[C. Flower]

What did Sheehan say about Shortall?

Curious how Sheehan was given so much air time to rant on this, as though speaking for Gilmore. And Rita Duffy was moderated in this Indo comment

Rita Duffy
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Mr. Sheehan it is long time journalists like you got in contact with the people of this country as you certainly do not represent public opinion out here. There is such thing as "principles" and doing what is "right" has that ever occured to you ????????. It is obvious you have spent too long behind the gates of Leinster House talking to like minded people who do nothing for this country except feather their own nests and play the Party Game. There needs to be a change in the political system also a major change in some journalists in this country who also have badly let down people over the last number of years.

(Edited by a moderator)

The level of discussion on this on RTE and amongst politicians was very much out of touch with the Labour voters' view of these things.

[C. Flower]

I would say that the Greens had no backbone last January, but we all remember that when pushed to the limit on policies they held dear they brought down the government coaltion.

There is ferment throughout Europe against the very austerity policies the present Irish government is acquiescing to , and that will influence political affairs in Ireland at least as much as the little inter party squabbles and fiefdom we all react to.. Look to the SPD challenge to Merkel in Germany.Look to the rumours that Monti will quit in Italy. Look to the Greek, Spanish and Portuguese demonstrations.Many of the players in all these communicate with some of the more principled Labour TDs and activists.

After a lot of huffing and puffing, the Greens did not bring the Government down, although they did exert some pressure, after it was too late to stop most of the damage.

But I think that Labour is different to the Greens, in that there is some party base in the working class and Trade Unions. Even though not by nature radical, the nature of the current crisis will push some people out of their comfort zone. An important minority of the party.

[Baron von Biffo]

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/co...s-3242004.html

The VB show on Monday is also worth a look.

After reading the article and listening to him on TV3 player, I can't see anything that would merit the description 'venomous'. He was critical of her but no more than she deserved.

If we were looking at this as a business rather than a political affair what would we see? Someone who couldn't get on with the senior manager in her department who resigned having failed to achieve her targets. I think the appropriate conclusion would be that Shortall was promoted a step beyond her ability.

[Baron von Biffo]

I would say that the Greens had no backbone last January, but we all remember that when pushed to the limit on policies they held dear they brought down the government coaltion.

What issue that they held dear did the Greens bring down the government on?

[Baron von Biffo]

Curious how Sheehan was given so much air time to rant on this, as though speaking for Gilmore. And Rita Duffy was moderated in this Indo comment

I'm not watching it again with a stopwatch to measure who got the most time

The level of discussion on this on RTE and amongst politicians was very much out of touch with the Labour voters' view of these things.

Labour politicians have been out of touch with Labour voters since the GE.

[Greengoddess]

After reading the article and listening to him on TV3 player, I can't see anything that would merit the description 'venomous'. He was critical of her but no more than she deserved.

If we were looking at this as a business rather than a political affair what would we see? Someone who couldn't get on with the senior manager in her department who resigned having failed to achieve her targets. I think the appropriate conclusion would be that Shortall was promoted a step beyond her ability.

I Disagree

[Baron von Biffo]

I Disagree

[Jolly Red Giant]

But I think that Labour is different to the Greens, in that there is some party base in the working class and Trade Unions.

There is zero working class membership of the LP and the only trade unionists invovled are highly paid bureaucrats. The active membership of the LP (what little there is) is primarily made up of liberal professionals like Alex White.

[C. Flower]

There is zero working class membership of the LP and the only trade unionists invovled are highly paid bureaucrats. The active membership of the LP (what little there is) is primarily made up of liberal professionals like Alex White.

To clarify - I am talking about the overall social and class basis for the party - voters and source of funding - not merely party members, activists and leaders.

Shortall, who White replaced, was a teacher.

Any teachers in the Socialist Party ? Any reason why there shouldn't be ?

The Labour Party will be forced into crisis by the melt-down of the type of economy that has supported both the White and Shorthall and by assault on unionised labour. There is no saying quite how far to the right the likes of Gilmore will travel, given how he has moved consistently from left to right through his career.

The implication is a degree of disintegration or split, as not all will travel with him. Within the Labour vote, there are far more people who will be forced to oppose the line of this government and many new Labour voters looking for an authentic and serious voice.

The Labour Party as presently formed is not going to do a volte face and turn against the establishment, but in the political maelstrom that is brewing up, there are many cracks and fissures ahead. The people who break from it to the left, no matter how small in number, should not be ignored.

[MPB]

Curious how Sheehan was given so much air time to rant on this, as though speaking for Gilmore. And Rita Duffy was moderated in this Indo comment



The level of discussion on this on RTE and amongst politicians was very much out of touch with the Labour voters' view of these things.

Fionnans marriage is enough reason for him to be over critical of Labour, as his wife being a FF senator is in direct competition with Lab.

FG are untouchable by other political parties at the moment, but their destruction will come from the economy, the Troika and their arrogance.

All mainstream journalists are afraid of not having FG/FF/LAB in charge.

Their livlihoods depend on the status quo. Especially Fionnans.

[Dr. FIVE]

Suzy Byrne has an email from Gilmore

http://www.mamanpoulet.com/a-bad-week/

[fluffybiscuits]

There is zero working class membership of the LP and the only trade unionists invovled are highly paid bureaucrats. The active membership of the LP (what little there is) is primarily made up of liberal professionals like Alex White.

Agree with you on that point. There are a lot of turn coats in Labour in what was a movement from roots in the working rights and trade union movement to now promoting an agenda of hitting on the working class. This can be no more evident than the cuts coming down the line which Joan the Moan is going to dish out on to the working class. All that is left is a few champagne socialists with their heads just above the parapet bleating on about human rights (they cant even get us gay marriage as half of the antiques in FG seem opposed to it). If they really wanted to show they have some bite here is my advice. Crash the government and de rail it and start from scratch before their reputation is damaged beynd repair (assuming it has been damaged beyond repair already).