Should we change the law on abortion? ( may contain graphic images )

[PaddyJoe]

When was there last a story with 'Belfast' in the title that dominated the media 'down here'?
Not recently.
Apart from anything else you have to agree that the Maire Stopes people have got a lot of guts.

[bernadette]

When was there last a story with 'Belfast' in the title that dominated the media 'down here'?
Not recently.
Apart from anything else you have to agree that the Maire Stopes people have got a lot of guts.

The right to abortion is inevitable in Ireland, here the EU has said it must be introduced and in the north I'm not sure the Brit government would win a case if a woman decided to sue because her rights in one part of the UK are less than another, even if that part is self governing.

[PaddyJoe]

The right to abortion is inevitable in Ireland, here the EU has said it must be introduced and in the north I'm not sure the Brit government would win a case if a woman decided to sue because her rights in one part of the UK are less than another, even if that part is self governing.

Good point. The 1967 Abortion Act doesn't cover NI and maybe there is a legal case to be made as to why it shouldn't.

[bernadette]

Good point. The 1967 Abortion Act doesn't cover NI and maybe there is a legal case to be made as to why it shouldn't.

The different laws for devolved parliaments are not, as far as I know , usually challenged, but there has been catastrophic failure in the past (NI) and now most laws are subsidiary to EU laws anyway. I think there might be a case.

[fluffybiscuits]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-19930422

The Shinners mask slipped for a moment, we thought they were liberal left but no, denying a womans right to choose. Maguinness has denied this is as a result of pressure from the RCC to maintain its position. Maguinness has said this position they are maintaining is for the good of the people, since when do Shinners know what is good for the people, seriously? They whine about the POW not being given right (I agree with them on this) and then on one hand want to deny women their rights? Would be interested to see how Shaadi and S G Deo defend this position...

[fluffybiscuits]

The polarized nature of the debate has really clouded the issue and left untold damage hasn't it? I dont think I have ever come across anything like it all the years it's been hoovering in and out of the agenda. That subtle & not so subtle cage that usually governs every aspect of discourse in this country just goes out the window. A sure sign of how much is at stake for a number of different interests. The more and more stories we hear the more we understand the the variety and complexity of people's situations and I think it holds up a very uncomfortable mirror for some who would rather not acknowledge some fairly fundamental imbalances in how we run society.

The amount of disingenious info floating about is coming from a lot of quarters on the right. Just this morning there was people nattering on facebook about how some girl knew four girls who had twenty eight abortions between them. I cant think of any doctor who would allow a woman to have that many abortions and they not be put off. Its this disinformation that is scaring people, inferring abortion is birth control The other arguemnt being peddled by anti abortionists is that the pro choice industry is worth billions,someone commented on facebook on YD's page that god has more money (*sniggers*) to fight them. Agree with you and bernadette. Abortion is going to come about at some time in the very near future.

[fluffybiscuits]

http://www.facebook.com/events/51447...9&notif_t=like

UCD poster debate on abortion..

[bernadette]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-19930422

The Shinners mask slipped for a moment, we thought they were liberal left but no, denying a womans right to choose. Maguinness has denied this is as a result of pressure from the RCC to maintain its position. Maguinness has said this position they are maintaining is for the good of the people, since when do Shinners know what is good for the people, seriously? They whine about the POW not being given right (I agree with them on this) and then on one hand want to deny women their rights? Would be interested to see how Shaadi and S G Deo defend this position...

That's almost funny. McGuinness in favour of the right to life!! I'm amazed the creature sleeps.

Now there's someone to have on your side. I wonder when the Brit Stormont Council breaks for Christmas.

[fluffybiscuits]

That's almost funny. McGuinness in favour of the right to life!! I'm amazed the creature sleeps.

Now there's someone to have on your side. I wonder when the Brit Stormont Council breaks for Christmas.

Carlsberg dont do Irony but if they did ....

[bernadette]

Carlsberg dont do Irony but if they did ....

+10

[5intheface]

Carlsberg dont do Irony but if they did ....

+10

Seems a bit odd to waste time attacking the Shinners specifically on this one. Their policy is indeed what is strangely termed, 'pro-life' but amongst the bigger parties, it's really only them and Alliance that allow any debate on the topic which is why they sometimes send out mixed messages. They are definitely on the soft end of the anti-abortion lobby and many spokespeople have voiced their unhappiness with the party's position.

McGuinnesss is a 'devout' type with old fashioned Catholic attitudes compared to the average SF voter. He'll have to realise pretty soon that his personal faith can't shape his party's policy if they want to grow.

If I was wanting to change Politician's attitude to the law, I wouldn't spend my time whinging at the Shinners who have recognised that change is inevitable but work on the DUP, UUP, SDLP and TUV who are about as reasonable as Bernie Smyth on the matter. Check out her website which lists all the candidates for elections and assures us the Shinners 'will not protect the unborn child'.

As for south of the border?

[fluffybiscuits]

Seems a bit odd to waste time attacking the Shinners specifically on this one. Their policy is indeed what is strangely termed, 'pro-life' but amongst the bigger parties, it's really only them and Alliance that allow any debate on the topic which is why they sometimes send out mixed messages. They are definitely on the soft end of the anti-abortion lobby and many spokespeople have voiced their unhappiness with the party's position.

McGuinnesss is a 'devout' type with old fashioned Catholic attitudes compared to the average SF voter. He'll have to realise pretty soon that his personal faith can't shape his party's policy if they want to grow.

If I was wanting to change Politician's attitude to the law, I wouldn't spend my time whinging at the Shinners who have recognised that change is inevitable but work on the DUP, UUP, SDLP and TUV who are about as reasonable as Bernie Smyth on the matter. Check out her website which lists all the candidates for elections and assures us the Shinners 'will not protect the unborn child'.

As for south of the border?

There is a lot of talk among the younger Shinners members that I know that they want such a stance changed and reversal on the policy. The reason for me that it is odd that for a party with such a liberal stance there seems to be a lot of knee bending and ring kissing for the RCC hierarchy as if they change their position they lose a lot of votes. As for the unionists, groups which proclaim the earth to e 4000 years old are deserving only of contempt, we should start by educating the younger people across this island of what the issues are today and then over time the nature of the parties will change !

[bernadette]

There is a lot of talk among the younger Shinners members that I know that they want such a stance changed and reversal on the policy. The reason for me that it is odd that for a party with such a liberal stance there seems to be a lot of knee bending and ring kissing for the RCC hierarchy as if they change their position they lose a lot of votes. As for the unionists, groups which proclaim the earth to e 4000 years old are deserving only of contempt, we should start by educating the younger people across this island of what the issues are today and then over time the nature of the parties will change !

Sinn Fein has lived off its allegiance to the RCC for decades its a hard habit to break with potential loss of votes from the older electorate and I think that is where the real problem for all political parties is on this subject.

I don't think a political party today has ideals they have ambition and they are not sure supporting the right to abortion assists their ambitions.

[fluffybiscuits]

Sinn Fein has lived off its allegiance to the RCC for decades its a hard habit to break with potential loss of votes from the older electorate and I think that is where the real problem for all political parties is on this subject.

I don't think a political party today has ideals they have ambition and they are not sure supporting the right to abortion assists their ambitions.

They wont evolve . +10

[5intheface]

The north's Attorney General, John Larkin has got himself in a corner over the Marie Stopes Centre. Yesterday he weighed in to the controversy by writing to advise the Stormont Justice Committee that they launch an investigation in to its operation.

He went on to offer his assistance with any investigation including acting as counsel and questioning witnesses.

However, today it emerged that he was very far from being a neutral arbiter when a debate he had with the Marie Stopes Director, Dawn Purvis 4 years ago was highlighted again.

During the discussion, Larkin said,

"If one is prepared to contemplate the destruction of a highly disabled, unborn child in the womb, one should also be prepared to contemplate, I think, putting a bullet in the back of the head of the child two days after it's born."

Purvis described the comment as disgusting and disgraceful but Larkin continued,

"Help me out Dawn, tell me the logical distinction between destroying the unborn child in the womb, seconds before birth and putting a bullet in the head of the child two days after it's born."

No comment as yet from the DUP but both the SDLP leader and senior member and barrister Alban Maguinness have defended Larkin's right to personal opinions as he wasn't AG at the time.

UUP leader Mike Nesbitt and Alliance's Anna Lo have called on Larkin to 'take a step back' from the debate.

Sinn Féin have been stronger in their condemantion describing the comments and Larkin's intervention as 'wholly inappropriate',


The hysteria is breathtaking.