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Thread: The Cavalry of the Household Charge

  1. #991
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    Default Re: The Cavalry of the Household Charge

    Paddy Healy on the campaign.

    Having Damaged the CAHWT Campaign by Imposing Suicidal Policies
    SP and SWP Move in to Pick UP the Recruits!
    Thousands of activists participated in the Campaign Against Household and Water Charges. Trojan work was done. Activists in many areas distinguished themselves. But now the boycott campaign has failed. This must be recognised. In national terms , a small minority of the population who followed the advice of the SP and the SWP have been isolated. There are also many who cannot pay. Some have registered and some have not. The CAHWT website contains no advice to these determined fighters (SEE below for content of Website as I write). None of the motions tabled for the National Steering Committee next Saturday, June 8, address the problem of those who have been isolated by the leaders. This is a shameful abdication of leadership by SP and SWP. It brings back echoes of the end of the bin tax campaign. In that case the leaders also walked away leaving the most determined supporters high and dry.
    In my document “after-Ultraleft destruction” (of the ULA) I said one month ago: “The number of people attending meetings, rallies and marches of CAHWT is dwindling as the two “Marxist” groups advocate policies which are impossible for ordinary people and their dependents to follow. Despite the destruction of the campaign, the two groups will feel justified if they get some recruits out of it and ,if above all, they get more recruits than each other!” It is now clear competitive ultra-leftism between SP and SWP has seriously damaged the campaign.
    When the government brought in legislation to extract the charges plus fines from pay and welfare, they refused to make any tactical adjustment. They were calling on people who were struggling to put bread on the table to leave themselves liable to double the charge and more. Neither group could be seen to be less “revolutionary” than the other! Myself and many others told them that this policy would inevitably lead defeat of the campasign and demoralisation of supporters and activists. It was playing into the hands of the government. But they wouldn’t/ couldn’t listen. Like many other activists, WUA refused to go along with this self-defeating policy in Tipperary. As Workers and Unemployed Action is actually part of the working class itself, it contains many hard-pressed people on the one hand and experienced shop-stewards and community leaders on the other! Those who wished to continue the boycott and those who felt they had no choice but to register were invited to join an intensified campaign against politicians, local authorities and compliant trade union leaders. I understand this happened in branches in several areas where SP/SWP were not dominant.
    Unfortunately, the setback in the campaign bears out my earlier contention that competitive ultra-leftism is a huge problem for the left in Ireland and the UK. In the final days of the campaign the SP divided the campaign on the issue of standing candidates in the local elections next year, more than 12 months away. Irrespective of the merits of the issue itself, why was the campaign divided on this issue, with registration day only weeks away and SP continuing to insist that non-registration was the main focus of the campaign? Had SP already decided that the boycott campaign was doomed and were already moving to maximise their own gains? I hope that the damage to the confidence of those mobilised by the campaign is limited but I fear this may not be the case and there may be a negative effect on the forthcoming campaign against the introduction of water taxes.
    And what are the SP and SWP leaders doing now? Many great activists have been left without a campaign or with a much weakened campaign due to their policies. Now they are moving in to recruit the remaining activists as dues paying members to the SP and SWP/People before Profit. Joe Higgins(SP) has addressed a meeting in Tallaght (not a CAHWT Meeting) to garner support for SP candidates in the local elections. Cllr Mick Barry(SP) has divided the very successful Cork campaign by pushing a primarily electoralist approach. Richard Boyd Barrett has addressed meetings of People Before Profit in Letterkenny and Cork. This is a deeply cynical exercise. It happens again and again and again in Ireland and the UK. The modus operandi is set out in the infamous leaked internal bulletin of SWP:
    SWP Internal Bulletin 06/02/2012
    “Remember: campaigns don’t last forever and there is a limited window of
    opportunity to start the process of targeting key individuals who want to
    take the fight further for recruitment to the SWP. The stronger the SWP the
    stronger the voice for a bottom up dynamic and radical campaign will be and
    the more will remain when the campaign comes to a lull.”


    It is true that the rank and file of the SP and SWP are very committed decent people. This is the tragedy. The SP invested everything in the campaign. On leaving ULA it said: “For the Socialist Party, the battle against the household and property taxes is a priority, and it will take more of our focus and work and as mentioned, in that context we will be diminishing our participation in the ULA.”
    It is widely known that many decent SP members are traumatized by the collapse of the campaign. Hence the rescue operation attempted through the Tallaght meeting which, tellingly, was not called in the name of the CAHWT.
    ULTRA-LEFT DESTRUCTION OF CAMPAIGNS MUST BE STOPPED
    Many unaligned activists are polite and comradely. SP and SWP take advantage of this when pushing their destructive policies. Thankfully many unaligned activists are now learning to stand up to them.
    Unless trade union and anti-austerity activists take a strong stand against the manipulations of these groups and their London head-quartered “internationals” future campaigns will also be damaged.
    NO2CrokePark2 may be next in their sights!
    CAHWT Website To-Day June 3, 2013
    Keep up the Boycott
    More to the failure of CAHWT surely than the presence of parties who want to recruit ??
    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
    — Jean-Paul Sartre

  2. #992
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    Default Re: The Cavalry of the Household Charge

    Quote Originally Posted by fluffybiscuits View Post
    http://www.thejournal.ie/property-ta...40560-Jun2013/

    Revenue sending out new letters to remind people they will deduct at source...
    More Revenue bullsh1te, we all know of and there are miriad apocryphal stories of wrong addresses, wrong people, wrong building, etc., etc. Rev cannot deduct at source unless they know FOR CERTAIN, who you are, where you work, whether you are paye, etc. Even if you are pensioned they need to know that, liaise with Dept., ensure they have the right person (like the correct Michael Ryan and/or he Jim Murphys.... in the right townland.

    No, just more scare tactics. The compliant meja have bought in to the Rev as scary mary, The Rev bottom line is, only know who has paid tax and how much and the address they use for sending you tax docs, which may not be the one liable for LPT.

    This exercise, as I've said before, is a Rev move to get even more internal power, information is power. I'll be very surprised if e hear anything about data sharing if and when the Rev get a proper dataset together.

  3. #993
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    Default Maidir Le: Re: The Cavalry of the Household Charge

    Quote Originally Posted by C. Flower View Post
    Paddy Healy on the campaign.



    More to the failure of CAHWT surely than the presence of parties who want to recruit ??
    Just to comment on recruiting and competive leftism as paddy described it-I attended both protests to the fine gael and labour party conferences last year-before both protests begun there were activists from both sp and swp trying to sell their newspapers and give people recruitment forms to join their parties-quite a few people who I attended with were annoyed by this and felt it was almost like a political party recruitment fair- if a march is called against an issue why cant sp and swp activists just leave their politics at the door stick to the protest the issue was called over and stop trying to sell newspapers and hand out recruitment forms- the day in galway prior to marching on the labour conference everyone who came to protest were subject to an hour of listening and hearing speeches- joe higgins; luke ming flanagan spoke and so did richard boyd barrett which I have no problem as they are all elected tds- after the three of them gave their speeches the crowd were subjected to hearing speeches from sp and swp activists for the rest of the hour which bored the SH... out of most people in the crowd-- it was almost like the swp and the sp were trying to compete and outdo the other with political speeches-because of subjecting people to an hour of political speeches a lot of people I know wont be so inclined to attend any protest in the future that may be organised by the sp or the swp.

  4. #994
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    Default Re: The Cavalry of the Household Charge

    Mixed messages on whether or not to continue the boycott, from the CAHWT and the Socialist Party.

    Ruth Coppinger on Face Book saying not, and a couple of days later, no decision and a concern for "optics" at the Steering Committee.

    People left adrift with increased charges on their hands.

    Not good enough.
    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
    — Jean-Paul Sartre

  5. #995
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    Default Re: The Cavalry of the Household Charge

    Quote Originally Posted by barrym View Post
    More Revenue bullsh1te, we all know of and there are miriad apocryphal stories of wrong addresses, wrong people, wrong building, etc., etc. Rev cannot deduct at source unless they know FOR CERTAIN, who you are, where you work, whether you are paye, etc. Even if you are pensioned they need to know that, liaise with Dept., ensure they have the right person (like the correct Michael Ryan and/or he Jim Murphys.... in the right townland.

    No, just more scare tactics. The compliant meja have bought in to the Rev as scary mary, The Rev bottom line is, only know who has paid tax and how much and the address they use for sending you tax docs, which may not be the one liable for LPT.

    This exercise, as I've said before, is a Rev move to get even more internal power, information is power. I'll be very surprised if e hear anything about data sharing if and when the Rev get a proper dataset together.
    Very good points.

    It has however worked.

    For people to have continued with a boycott, they would have needed to feel passionately about it, and for that information to have been spelled out very clearly by the Campaign. Also to have been organised strongly in local communities, so that they could get together and support anyone under pressure from the Revenue.
    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
    — Jean-Paul Sartre

  6. #996
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    Default Re: The Cavalry of the Household Charge

    Offaly died down after folk realised it was inevitable, and that the tactic was to frustrate to process and make it unworkable. When we see the Trotskyites are the ones PROTECTING property rights in Ireland, it shows just how far off the Richter scale FF/FG are.

    As for Sinn Féin... well the recently deceased Ruiari O Bradiagh put it well when he said acceptace of the Dail was the first of a thousand sell outs PSF would do.

    And it so came to pass.

  7. #997
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    Default Re: The Cavalry of the Household Charge

    Quote Originally Posted by tomasocarthaigh View Post
    Offaly died down after folk realised it was inevitable, and that the tactic was to frustrate to process and make it unworkable. When we see the Trotskyites are the ones PROTECTING property rights in Ireland, it shows just how far off the Richter scale FF/FG are.

    As for Sinn Féin... well the recently deceased Ruiari O Bradiagh put it well when he said acceptace of the Dail was the first of a thousand sell outs PSF would do.

    And it so came to pass.
    On the contrary, I think it shows how far off the Richter scale the "Trotskyists" are.
    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
    — Jean-Paul Sartre

  8. #998
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    Default Re: The Cavalry of the Household Charge

    Quote Originally Posted by tomasocarthaigh View Post
    Offaly died down after folk realised it was inevitable, and that the tactic was to frustrate to process and make it unworkable. When we see the Trotskyites are the ones PROTECTING property rights in Ireland, it shows just how far off the Richter scale FF/FG are.

    As for Sinn Féin... well the recently deceased Ruiari O Bradiagh put it well when he said acceptace of the Dail was the first of a thousand sell outs PSF would do.

    And it so came to pass.
    You know there has been almost a hundred years of independence in the south during which time the voters have voted as they see fit. The govt in power today and all the previous years were voted in democratically. Basically you're saying that none of that counts and the decisions made by the people of today have no influence or right set against the decisions of a hundred years ago.

  9. #999
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    Default Re: The Cavalry of the Household Charge

    Quote Originally Posted by bernadette View Post
    You know there has been almost a hundred years of independence in the south during which time the voters have voted as they see fit. The govt in power today and all the previous years were voted in democratically. Basically you're saying that none of that counts and the decisions made by the people of today have no influence or right set against the decisions of a hundred years ago.
    Sure why dont we rejoin the UK then? Its the same agenda!!! ;-D

    PSF I would not trust to hold on to any of their policies, they will twist any way to suit their agenda, and even that shifts. A new FF in the making, and the bad wing of that at that. That is not to say the grassroots are not good people, they are, as are grassroots in FF and FG... but at the top are slimey charachters, and the heritage they have in land issues they should have been leading from the front.

    Theres more to independence and unity than a line on a map, and PSF failed the first hurdle.

  10. #1000
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    Default Re: The Cavalry of the Household Charge

    Quote Originally Posted by tomasocarthaigh View Post
    Sure why dont we rejoin the UK then? Its the same agenda!!! ;-D

    PSF I would not trust to hold on to any of their policies, they will twist any way to suit their agenda, and even that shifts. A new FF in the making, and the bad wing of that at that. That is not to say the grassroots are not good people, they are, as are grassroots in FF and FG... but at the top are slimey charachters, and the heritage they have in land issues they should have been leading from the front.

    Theres more to independence and unity than a line on a map, and PSF failed the first hurdle.
    What does it have to do with the UK? Can we never get passed what they do. You're not dealing with or talking about the early days of independence, the civil war or even the north, this is about a property charge here its being introduced against the wishes of the majority but on the instruction of the EU and it is being pushed through regardless of opposition. By the time of the next election it may well be totally accepted by the vast majority or it may not in which case those of us with long memories will weigh it against what's on offer and vote accordingly.

    Slimy characters are in every party here, its not much comfort but they are also in every party in every other country we're no different except perhaps that almost everything anyone does is judged by what someone a hundred years ago may have intended. I dislike SF intensely but its got nothing to do with them except how they campaign for/against here. It may have taken them longer than any other party but they are here now and actively pursuing their own policies and as long as they do so within the law there is nothing anyone could or should do about it. Its got even less to do with the Brits. In fact its a purely Irish action that will probably stay but if it doesn't it will be a purely Irish decision that changes it.

  11. #1001
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    Default Re: The Cavalry of the Household Charge

    Extent of SFs revolutionary activity these days is submitting futile private members bills. The attempt to get people exited about stuff like that is just cringe-worthy, it's doomed to fail. I don't think the average person even cares about Private Members bills because they never get passed.
    The United Irishman. Updated 5/2/14

  12. #1002
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    Default Re: The Cavalry of the Household Charge

    Cork CAWHT protesting outside the home of an SP councillor, can someone clarify? http://corkindependent.com/20130613/...ed-S67060.html

  13. #1003
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    Default Re: The Cavalry of the Household Charge

    Quote Originally Posted by Gerard View Post
    Cork CAWHT protesting outside the home of an SP councillor, can someone clarify? http://corkindependent.com/20130613/...ed-S67060.html
    There are people here who know the situation in Cork: I would not be one of them.

    The Socialist Party envisaged the CAHWT as a rerun of the British Poll tax campaign, which was an entirely different issue in a very different economic and political era.

    It is very clear though that every notion the Socialist Party had about this campaign has been incorrect: to the extent that their whole social and political analysis of the current situation in Ireland must be out of kilter.

    I have just been reading Direct Democracy Ireland's newspaper the "Sovereign Independent," which takes an anti-Party and anti-Socialist Party stance, criticising the Socialist Party as being a "controlled opposition" that only carries out lip service campaigns and marches people up and down O'Connell Street. It seems to be a distant cousin of "Occupy" in that it opposes organisational forms that have been tried and tested in favour of an individualist anti-organisation approach. Ben Gilmore, much discussed here, is involved. DDI is supporting groups who were expelled from or who broke away from CAHWT. Other very similar people are undoubtedly still in the CAHWT.

    The situation is likely to get messier and messier due to the predictable failure of the mass boycott, lack of political direction within the CAHWt Campaign, political opportunism and the very big misjudgement of putting most of their energies into an anti-property tax campaign, without a balancing campaign to nationalise empty and NAMAd housing to provide social housing, and to prevent evictions, or indeed without a socialist programme for housing and infrastructure,

    http://corkindependent.com/20130613/...ed-S67060.html

    All that could be quickly turned around.
    “ We cannot withdraw our cards from the game. Were we as silent and mute as stones, our very passivity would be an act. ”
    — Jean-Paul Sartre

  14. #1004
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    Default Re: The Cavalry of the Household Charge

    The movement needed and as far as I know didn't have the support of the big groups like the pensioners who can mobilise big numbers. It was from the start more of single issue thing which in fact it is not. It is part of a whole range of cuts and tax increases.

  15. #1005
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    Default Re: The Cavalry of the Household Charge

    Quote Originally Posted by Gerard View Post
    Cork CAWHT protesting outside the home of an SP councillor, can someone clarify? http://corkindependent.com/20130613/...ed-S67060.html
    This reflects the first split in the Cork CAHWT by a couple of branches on the south side of the city who have come under the influence of the People's Convention (a less overtly right-wing version of DDI).

    The Cork AGM last Saturday overwhelmingly passed an emergency motion condemning this protest outside Mick Barry's house.

    The two sides in the split are organising two separate demos on Friday this week to protest at the inauguration of the new Lord Mayor of Cork - it would be funny if it wasn't such a tragic waste of the potential this campaign had a year or so ago.

    Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2

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