Ireland and Britain are Indivisible

[Holly]

This day in history: 1 August 1800
Passed by the Parliament of Ireland, the Act of Union created the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland. This union came into effect on 1 January 1801.
The flag, created as a consequence of the union of the Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland in 1800, still remains the flag of the United Kingdom. Called the Union Flag, it combined the flags of England (which included Wales) and Scotland with a "St Patrick's Cross" to represent Ireland.
The union remained until the recognition of the Irish Free State (excluding the Six Counties) by the Anglo-Irish treaty concluded on Dec. 6, 1921. The union officially ended on Jan. 15, 1922, when it was ratified by the Provisional Government led by Michael Collins in Ireland.

http://i1087.photobucket.com/albums/j480/rogerduke1/Flag_of_the_United_Kingdom.jpg

[Fraxinus]

Unfortunately this Union is still partially in place.
The notion seems to have been that Ireland was a wild untamed place, too far removed from the rest of Britian, where seeds of dissent and lawlessness could easily spread and lead to another 1798 resulting in a possible backdoor invasion of Britannia.
The main reason was geopolitical, to keep Ireland under a watchful eye with direct rule from Westminister for fear of another attempted French invasion. The follow on from that was the notion that Ireland was a spawning ground for dissent and revolution because of gross misgovernance by the Irish parliment and under a new union, Ireland would become an equal partner within the kingdom and grow as prosperous as Britain. With that the Irish, according to British thinking, would have no more grievances and no more need to rise against the Crown. It was accepted that Ireland in the new union would adopt British values and industry becoming an integral part of the empire. This of course never happened and the union's failure was especially evident only 40 or so years later.

[Captain Con O'Sullivan]

I'm pretty sure that we never gained effective independence and there is an odd little crew in the Pale which I think may be centred around the freemasonry lot which emerged blinking in the media sunlight recently extolling the virtues of closer union with the island next door- smelled horribly like a pre-planned series of Westminster mooings around the visit of Betty Two.

It is only recently when trying to figure out what was the connecting factor behind the sudden appearance of England friendly media mooings and noticeably online as well that I realised it was coming from the 'business community' in Dublin and in particular from the freemason lot- Prince Philip of course is the senior freemason in ceremonial terms in the UK.

I've been banging on about it a bit but two or three of the 'cultural heritage' organisations are stuffed with the 'ascendancy' Irish mob as well and it is really noticeable how well connected they are with the English establishment. Not a Murphy for miles.

It makes me uneasy when I realise that there is a certain mob in Dublin who are quite prepared to promote the idea of union again and they are identifiable a little more since they emerged around the Betty visit.

Like I've said before the smell around the supposed independence of Ireland gets very fishy at times when you examine the legal undercarriage of the supposed Repubic, notice the protective barriers around ascendancy holdings in terms of land and property to this day and get a whiff of a certain contingent of board sitters in Dublin.

I've a feeling this stuff is going to be leveraged again in the near future as England once again licks its lips and examines Irish land. If there is another attempt at takeover I suggest this time we clear out the fifth columnists first. Once and for all because they were left in place in Ireland the last time and that to my mind was a bad mistake.

[BockTheRobber]

What colour shirts will you be ordering?

[Apjp]

I'm pretty sure that we never gained effective independence and there is an odd little crew in the Pale which I think may be centred around the freemasonry lot which emerged blinking in the media sunlight recently extolling the virtues of closer union with the island next door- smelled horribly like a pre-planned series of Westminster mooings around the visit of Betty Two.

It is only recently when trying to figure out what was the connecting factor behind the sudden appearance of England friendly media mooings and noticeably online as well that I realised it was coming from the 'business community' in Dublin and in particular from the freemason lot- Prince Philip of course is the senior freemason in ceremonial terms in the UK.

I've been banging on about it a bit but two or three of the 'cultural heritage' organisations are stuffed with the 'ascendancy' Irish mob as well and it is really noticeable how well connected they are with the English establishment. Not a Murphy for miles.

It makes me uneasy when I realise that there is a certain mob in Dublin who are quite prepared to promote the idea of union again and they are identifiable a little more since they emerged around the Betty visit.

Like I've said before the smell around the supposed independence of Ireland gets very fishy at times when you examine the legal undercarriage of the supposed Repubic, notice the protective barriers around ascendancy holdings in terms of land and property to this day and get a whiff of a certain contingent of board sitters in Dublin.

I've a feeling this stuff is going to be leveraged again in the near future as England once again licks its lips and examines Irish land. If there is another attempt at takeover I suggest this time we clear out the fifth columnists first. Once and for all because they were left in place in Ireland the last time and that to my mind was a bad mistake.

Agree but please explain the 5th columnists phrasing.

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[Captain Con O'Sullivan]

Basically people like Eoghan Harris who are ostensibly Irish but in fact are permanently trying to promote the idea that Ireland should be part of Britain.

I suspect some of the freemason organisations around Dublin are of the same view and of course I don't think the freemasons lot see the separation of the two states.

Fifth columnists being people who try to promote sedition as a good idea. In my preferred world these people would learn the wisdom of not openly advocating a form of treason in public.

[Apjp]

Basically people like Eoghan Harris who are ostensibly Irish but in fact are permanently trying to promote the idea that Ireland should be part of Britain.

I suspect some of the freemason organisations around Dublin are of the same view and of course I don't think the freemasons lot see the separation of the two states.

Fifth columnists being people who try to promote sedition as a good idea. In my preferred world these people would learn the wisdom of not openly advocating a form of treason in public.

And lets not forget how the same class of shysters use gaeilge as an elitist stick to bate our heads with cos we should all be more irish like them. They have a vested interest in not teaching it properly as its their plaything


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[Sam Lord]

It was a consequence of fear on the part of the Brits relating to the 1798 uprising and the French Revolution and a desire to have greater direct control.

It was done in the face of popular opposition and was essentially bought from the Irish aristocracy who extracted a high price in ranks, advances in position, money, and so forth. One Irish Lord who was criticised for selling his country out replied, "I thank God I had a country to sell."




For the remainder of the year the government had to work unremittingly to build a decent majority for the union. This task fell primarily to Lord Castlereagh, appointed Chief Secretary in November 1798, and to the viceroy, Lord Cornwallis. Parliamentary seats were bought and attention was concentrated on major borough owners and particularly those who had abstained in the January voting. Pensions, places (jobs for MPs and peers and their relatives), promotions in the peerage, and other enticements were promised. This lavish use of patronage was denounced in later times as ‘bribery and corruption’ but it was legal and (just about) within the conventions of the time. ‘My occupation is now of the most unpleasant nature’, Cornwallis wrote, ‘negotiating and jobbing with the most corrupt people under heaven’. What was illegal was Pitt’s diversion of secret service funds, unknown even to members of the cabinet, to support newspapers and pamphlets favourable to the union. The Bank of England notes were cut in half for safety and sent by two separate messengers to Castlereagh, who had to join them together again.

THE UNION PASSES

'The mass of the people do not care one farthing about the Union', Cornwallis remarked and there was much truth in this statement. The bad harvest of 1799 was of much greater concern. The Presbyterians of Antrim and Down, who had been in rebellion in 1798, were not going to lose sleep over the loss of a corrupt Ascendancy assembly. The Orange Order grand lodge in Dublin attempted to be neutral on the issue but thirty-six lodges, from Armagh and Louth alone, petitioned against the Union. The fear was that Catholic emancipation would immediately follow the Union - indeed that was Pitt's intention. Cornwallis came very close to promising emancipation forthwith and, for that reason, most educated Catholics - with the noted exception of the lawyer Daniel O'Connell - were in favour of the Union. Merchants and artisans in Dublin feared the loss of business if there was no longer a parliament in College Green. The fierce pamphlet warfare shows that feelings ran high but only amongst a relatively confined circle of Protestants.

The level of passion was revealed when the Irish Parliament opened on 15 January 1800. Sir Laurence Parsons, in proposing an amendment pledging the House to maintain a free and independent parliament accused Castlereagh of ‘prostituting the prerogative of appointment to places in order to pack a parliament’. Angry speeches were delivered on both sides through the night. At midnight Henry Grattan (who had not been an MP for several years) bought Wicklow borough for £1,200 and, dressed in his old blue Volunteer uniform, arrived in the Commons at 7 a.m. Exhausted and ill, he was allowed to speak sitting down. In his two-hour declamation Grattan pointed at Castlereagh saying that the Chief Secretary proposed to ‘buy what cannot be sold – liberty…Against such a proposition, were I expiring on the floor, I should beg to utter my last breath and record my dying testimony’. It was to no avail. The motion was defeated by 138 votes to 96 and resolutions in favour of the Union obtained consistent majorities both in the Commons and the Lords. To maintain its supporters’ morale lavish dinners were held every day for twenty or thirty members until, as Sir Jonah Barrington recalled, ‘every man became in a prosperous state of official pregnancy…fully resolved to eat, drink, speak, and fight for Lord Castlereagh’. More secret service money – in total £30,850 – crossed the Irish Sea. The Bill for Union passed its third reading on 7 June and received the royal assent on 2 July 1800. An identical Bill passed with overwhelming support through Westminster.

Generous compensation for boroughs which would no longer be represented helped to weaken opposition to the Union. Compensation totalled £1,260,000 and was paid to supporters and opponents alike – the Marquis of Downshire, against the Union, got £57,000 for 7 seats he controlled. Examples of ‘Union engagements’ include: for Sir John Blaquiere (the promise to make him a peer was not kept) £1,000 a year for his wife and daughter, £700 annual pension for himself and another £300 a year from 1803; sinecures of between £250 and £800 a year for 27 MPs; eleven MPs who were lawyers were promoted or were given other judicial rewards; and £300 a year for Theobald McKenna, a pamphleteer, for his literary services.



http://www.actofunion.ac.uk/actofunion.htm

[Captain Con O'Sullivan]

I am not so certain that the Crown patronage and pension system is not still in operation either. Wasn't there some story doing the rounds a few years ago that De Valera was in receipt of a Crown pension?

I hate the idea of that little creep Ahern being a member of a papal order which is headed by a member of the House of Lords. There is something creepy about the way that English landed interests in Ireland remained after the birth of that uncertain child the Irish Republic and I really don't like the look of one or two so-called 'irish' institutions in the county which seem to spend an inordinate amount of time and Irish money on protecting UK interests and connections.

Not enough land changed hands and not half enough heads rolled for my liking around the 1916 rebellion and after the civil war.

I noticed an announcement by the judiciary in ireland five or six years ago that the Irish statute book was now cleared of all remnants of the UK statue book which to my mind was a fake statement and I wonder why this eery pretence that Ireland is independent of ascendancy interests when I know that it is not.

One of these days we'll have to have a proper Republic- in law, in theory and in practise. i don't think we've seen an Irish Republic yet and am left with an uncomfortable feeling that all we've had so far is a quiet form of Home Rule.

[Holly]

....

I've been banging on about it a bit but two or three of the 'cultural heritage' organisations are stuffed with the 'ascendancy' Irish mob as well and it is really noticeable how well connected they are with the English establishment. Not a Murphy for miles.

You are not suggesting that harmless verbiage such as used by the Royal Dublin Society or the Honorable Society of King's Inns implies that any Irish man or woman would want to kow-tow to English royalty, surely.

[Apjp]

I am not so certain that the Crown patronage and pension system is not still in operation either. Wasn't there some story doing the rounds a few years ago that De Valera was in receipt of a Crown pension?

I hate the idea of that little creep Ahern being a member of a papal order which is headed by a member of the House of Lords. There is something creepy about the way that English landed interests in Ireland remained after the birth of that uncertain child the Irish Republic and I really don't like the look of one or two so-called 'irish' institutions in the county which seem to spend an inordinate amount of time and Irish money on protecting UK interests and connections.

Not enough land changed hands and not half enough heads rolled for my liking around the 1916 rebellion and after the civil war.

I noticed an announcement by the judiciary in ireland five or six years ago that the Irish statute book was now cleared of all remnants of the UK statue book which to my mind was a fake statement and I wonder why this eery pretence that Ireland is independent of ascendancy interests when I know that it is not.

One of these days we'll have to have a proper Republic- in law, in theory and in practise. i don't think we've seen an Irish Republic yet and am left with an uncomfortable feeling that all we've had so far is a quiet form of Home Rule.

Would you ever come back and politicise yourself to achieve it? Id imagine not just socialist parties will fish up the anti eu feeling and hatred of diktats that break ordinary people, even killing them.

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[Captain Con O'Sullivan]

I see any sign at all of proper direct actionagainst the criminal oligarchy in Ireland and I'd support it with anything I've got.

I'm not convinced though that even if the vulture capitalists are handed everything by the criminal class in Ireland that the people will do anything about it.

[DCon]

What colour shirts will you be ordering?

BocktheRobber!!

I love your blog

[Captain Con O'Sullivan]

What colour shirts will you be ordering?

Green.

[Captain Con O'Sullivan]

You are not suggesting that harmless verbiage such as used by the Royal Dublin Society or the Honorable Society of King's Inns implies that any Irish man or woman would want to kow-tow to English royalty, surely.

'Honorable' is indeed harmless verbiage...

[Captain Con O'Sullivan]

Would you ever come back and politicise yourself to achieve it? Id imagine not just socialist parties will fish up the anti eu feeling and hatred of diktats that break ordinary people, even killing them.

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You deserve a better answer than the one I gave you APJP and I find your posts quite heartening as I think I'm right in saying you are a young lad or lass starting out?

I politicised myself in Ireland when I was 16/17 although was politically aware a bit earlier with the usual naivete of that age. I did the door to door stuff on rainy nights although a bit shy and picking up the ropes and listening and learning- still the best political education you can possibly get I reckon going from door to door and the more hopeless cause the better because you'll develop the shell of not taking occasional abuse personally and learning how to stay polite even in the face of an amount of scorn.

In a strange way the thing that made me realise that there was no way back in the eighties there was going to be any kind of change was because of the very things that a lot of people realise now- not challenging the Fianna Fail/Church/ dead weight of social conservatism that comes with a people not really that long off the land (not intended as an insult but an analysis- it takes more than two or three generations to shrug off rural conservatism).

In a way the whole country is getting a huge wake up call now to the perils of assuming the political dynasties have it all under control. As for going back to Ireland to go through the same system and ask for votes I don't think I'd be able to stand the same old responses around the parish.

I'll be home if there's to be a proper fight. I wouldn't mind going to jail if it was in a good cause. I don't have any faith in the current political system.

In a way I wish the Gardai or cops would threaten me of arrest me or something because then I could go wholeheartedly into the radical side of things.

There's probably a lot more lads like me I'd say.

[Apjp]

You deserve a better answer than the one I gave you APJP and I find your posts quite heartening as I think I'm right in saying you are a young lad or lass starting out?

I politicised myself in Ireland when I was 16/17 although was politically aware a bit earlier with the usual naivete of that age. I did the door to door stuff on rainy nights although a bit shy and picking up the ropes and listening and learning- still the best political education you can possibly get I reckon going from door to door and the more hopeless cause the better because you'll develop the shell of not taking occasional abuse personally and learning how to stay polite even in the face of an amount of scorn.

In a strange way the thing that made me realise that there was no way back in the eighties there was going to be any kind of change was because of the very things that a lot of people realise now- not challenging the Fianna Fail/Church/ dead weight of social conservatism that comes with a people not really that long off the land (not intended as an insult but an analysis- it takes more than two or three generations to shrug off rural conservatism).

In a way the whole country is getting a huge wake up call now to the perils of assuming the political dynasties have it all under control. As for going back to Ireland to go through the same system and ask for votes I don't think I'd be able to stand the same old responses around the parish.

I'll be home if there's to be a proper fight. I wouldn't mind going to jail if it was in a good cause. I don't have any faith in the current political system.

In a way I wish the Gardai or cops would threaten me of arrest me or something because then I could go wholeheartedly into the radical side of things.

There's probably a lot more lads like me I'd say.

You're right im 19. I found that my experience in the wp led to thought crimes if you didnt want to agree with all they thought, and it fcuking annoyed me. You might say im still a communist and an atheist, but im a cynic of revolutionary proportions. I will join eirigi when I return home next year from france as they're the only irish revolutionary party. I harbour similar desires for stalin like justice to you, a desire for the abolition of religion, and strong social justice. We'd differ on what a republic should be exactly I feel, but id sooner negotiate that after a 1793 with the likes of you than keep things as are.

In reality my dad will kick me out when I graduate(with 2 years notice lol), so you might say I have any one of a dozen destinations in mind for june 2013 as I will not wait 16 weeks to lead a lifestyle choice on 56e a week. What gets me is hearing 60 year olds at work say if we cut a young mans dole well create jobs, and we need a national govt. And sanjeev on 8.65 In centra is why we're all fcuked.

If we got rid of that mentality, implemented peoples democracy by abolishing parliament, and scourged this isle of about 1500 crooks we'd have a chance. Then the likes of us could debate alternatives rather than theorize. I just get the feeling if not now when?!!

As for the ubers on both isles perhaps the english should cromwell out westminster and canary wharf?

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