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View Full Version : Video of Police Sergeant assaulting a woman in custody



mutley
05-09-2010, 05:24 PM
This woman was arrested after falling asleep in her car after a row with her partner.
The sergeant was found guilty of assault though he pleaded not guilty, he was informed on by another police officer.
It is pretty disgusting the way he manhandled her



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7cqF4IHdcw&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Full story here

http://m.guardian.co.uk/?id=102202&story=http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/sep/05/police-sergeant-suspended-assault-woman

TotalMayhem
05-09-2010, 05:25 PM
YouTube- Wiltshire police assault

mutley
05-09-2010, 05:28 PM
YouTube- Wiltshire police assault (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7cqF4IHdcw)



Cheers total, was being a bit to flashy with this phone :-)

TotalMayhem
05-09-2010, 05:30 PM
Cheers total, was being a bit to flashy with this phone :-)

This bit killed it for ya ;)


&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Seán Ryan
05-09-2010, 05:48 PM
There were a number of officers present when that woman was dragged along the floor. Each and every one of them should be sacked and charged.

Every now and then, it's the same over here, a token 'bad apple' is made an example of. The scumbags in uniform who witness this, do nothing and say nothing are never considered to have done anything wrong - it never even gets discussed publicly. This needs to change and it needs to do so yesterday.

It's time to fit each and every police officer with a camera and to make them accountable for each and every second that they're on duty.

Also remember, if you are assaulted, you have a right to defend yourself, regardless as to whether the thug is wearing a uniform or not. When some of these thugs end up in hospital or on a postmortem table, we'll see some action then.

C. Flower
05-09-2010, 05:53 PM
It still concerns me that Irish police are clearly trained to use truncheons in a manner that is life-threatening and that is not permitted in other forces. Seán's video shows Gardai with truncheons at the ready held back over the shoulder apparently ready to bring down on heads, as they did at the Dail gates not too many weeks ago.

Blows to the head with a steel truncheon are potentially mortal. If there is ever need for a Guard to restrain or stop someone, there are a lot of much safer ways of doing it.

Is there no civil liberties group in Ireland that would take this issue on?

Seán Ryan
05-09-2010, 06:04 PM
It still concerns me that Irish police are clearly trained to use truncheons in a manner that is life-threatening and that is not permitted in other forces. Seán's video shows Gardai with truncheons at the ready held back over the shoulder apparently ready to bring down on heads, as they did at the Dail gates not too many weeks ago.

Blows to the head with a steel truncheon are potentially mortal. If there is ever need for a Guard to restrain or stop someone, there are a lot of much safer ways of doing it.

Is there no civil liberties group in Ireland that would take this issue on?

There is no civil liberties group in this country that have either the power or the stomach to do anything about this presently. There has been some incredible stuff going on in this country and it's a disgrace. I'm in court a number of times every month and folks I help end up having to prove their innocence, contrary to Irish law. The Judiciary and the DPP (who often, if not all the time, isn't even familiar with the evidence) are a hindrance to achieving justice.

Even in the case this thread is concerned with, it took more than 2 years to have this creep found guilty. What's the betting that he gets a very lenient sentence, possibly a suspended one. To boot, this criminal is a sergeant. Others answered to him, were indoctrinated by him and quite probably look up to him.

Our whole culture is conditioned to look the other way when thugs in uniform set a persons rights to naught. We even glorify and encourage it as can be seen in the movies and TV.

Christy Walsh
05-09-2010, 06:34 PM
It still concerns me that Irish police are clearly trained to use truncheons in a manner that is life-threatening and that is not permitted in other forces. Seán's video shows Gardai with truncheons at the ready held back over the shoulder apparently ready to bring down on heads, as they did at the Dail gates not too many weeks ago.

Blows to the head with a steel truncheon are potentially mortal. If there is ever need for a Guard to restrain or stop someone, there are a lot of much safer ways of doing it.

Is there no civil liberties group in Ireland that would take this issue on?

There is a Irish Human Rights Commission but I think it is generally like its northern counterpart and is a perk to be a commissioner -and that is as far as it goes.

mutley
05-09-2010, 06:44 PM
It still concerns me that Irish police are clearly trained to use truncheons in a manner that is life-threatening and that is not permitted in other forces. Seán's video shows Gardai with truncheons at the ready held back over the shoulder apparently ready to bring down on heads, as they did at the Dail gates not too many weeks ago.

Blows to the head with a steel truncheon are potentially mortal. If there is ever need for a Guard to restrain or stop someone, there are a lot of much safer ways of doing it.

Is there no civil liberties group in Ireland that would take this issue on?



If there were no mechanisms in place to prevent the systematic abuse of children in Ireland, it is doubtful, that there are any checks and balances to prevent Garda misdeeds

C. Flower
05-09-2010, 06:46 PM
There is a Irish Human Rights Commission but I think it is generally like its northern counterpart and is a perk to be a commissioner -and that is as far as it goes.

Is there anything called the National Council for Civil Liberties, or is that a dead duck ?

TaxProtester
05-09-2010, 06:49 PM
Its not nearly as bad as some of the police assaults that have been videoed in the USA. This one sickened me.
YouTube- Denver Police Brutality
The cop wasnt even fired, never mind prosecuted.

Or this assault on a random cyclist.
YouTube- NYPD Assault Cyclist In Times Square - 29 July 2008

Christy Walsh
05-09-2010, 06:57 PM
Is there anything called the National Council for Civil Liberties, or is that a dead duck ?

Fell to the wayside yonks ago -Amnesty is another joke --Amnesty members cannot get involved in issues relating to their own country (usually for good reason in Russia and China and the like) What I always found f***ed up was its London offices were partly funded by the UK Gov (there goes independance) and any issues relating to NI was handled by the London office and Amnesty Ireland could not get involved even though NI was tecnically out of their 'jurisdiction' but not Amnesty UK.

Sam Lord
05-09-2010, 07:02 PM
Also remember, if you are assaulted, you have a right to defend yourself, regardless as to whether the thug is wearing a uniform or not. When some of these thugs end up in hospital or on a postmortem table, we'll see some action then.

While appreciating the sentiment I am not too sure how sound this advice is. If you are held in a Garda Station for example you will be well outnumbered and they will not hold back if in their view you are "resisting". They are also fairly confident that they can act with impunity ... and I can not ever recall anyone breaking ranks on a cover story. The best thing, as much as I hate to say it, is probably to take your hiding. You will at least probably live to tell the tale. In saying this I am recalling a most shocking case in Kilmainham Garda Station in the early 90's which seems to have been expunged from history as I cannot find anything at all on line. It involved, in my recollection, the liberal use of batons, a great deal of blood and one dead young man.

Summerday Sands
05-09-2010, 07:05 PM
I think some of this goes back to the miners strike. Thatcher politicised the police & they became her boys in blue allowed to attack without impunity.

Since then there has been a disturbing , reactionary strain within the British police force that on far to many occasions has risen & the results have been tragic.

The full scale cavalry & baton charges against unarmed miners, the shooting of the Brazilian Jean Charles de Menezes 7 times in the head whilst he sat on an underground train, the death of Ian Tomlinson as he walked home through London passing the G20 protests.

All of these were perpetrated by the police, it's troubling.

Christy Walsh
05-09-2010, 07:13 PM
Also remember, if you are assaulted, you have a right to defend yourself, regardless as to whether the thug is wearing a uniform or not. When some of these thugs end up in hospital or on a postmortem table, we'll see some action then.

I got a bad beating myself in Castlereagh and the temptation to clock either scumbag was strong. One RUC Detective was called Doyle (from Dublin) both stunk of stale beer --after the beating both were made to wash and shower --a haebus corpus was issued that I had to be returned to Crumlin Road prison.

My point is that trying t prove who threw the first punch would be impossible because if they assault you first then it is reasonable to assume they will lie about it if they have too. A black and blue prisoner makes for persuasive argument that illtreatment was involved.

C. Flower
05-09-2010, 07:13 PM
Fell to the wayside yonks ago -Amnesty is another joke --Amnesty members cannot get involved in issues relating to their own country (usually for good reason in Russia and China and the like) What I always found f***ed up was its London offices were partly funded by the UK Gov (there goes independance) and any issues relating to NI was handled by the London office and Amnesty Ireland could not get involved even though NI was tecnically out of their 'jurisdiction' but not Amnesty UK.

Same happens here -- they buy out the independence of groups.

Look at the CDPs here - a lot of them were independent community organisations, then they were systematically funded and "professionalised".
Now they are being closed down "in the cuts".

As though it was anything to do with saving money.

The same with the Unions. Bought off.

There's no reason why an organisation can't be built without taking State money.

Seán Ryan
05-09-2010, 07:23 PM
While appreciating the sentiment I am not too sure how sound this advice is. If you are held in a Garda Station for example you will be well outnumbered and they will not hold back if in their view you are "resisting". They are also fairly confident that they can act with impunity ... and I can not ever recall anyone breaking ranks on a cover story. The best thing, as much as I hate to say it, is probably to take your hiding. You will at least probably live to tell the tale. In saying this I am recalling a most shocking case in Kilmainham Garda Station in the early 90's which seems to have been expunged from history as I cannot find anything at all on line. It involved, in my recollection, the liberal use of batons, a great deal of blood and one dead young man.

I hear what you're saying and appreciate it. Most things I say should come with a health warning :)

But, there's always a but, you run the risk of being severly hurt anytime you defend yourself against someone assaulting you. You run the same risk if you don't too. I'm afraid that I should have qualified what I said a bit more. If you defend yourself against a garda, it will probably do you little or no good and his or her buddies will most likely wade in, to make your life even more miserable. On the other hand, you might teach a very valuable lesson, that might for one reason or another make it into the public domain and cause some positive change.

Personally speaking, my body's a temple, a pretty messed up one. But I'll suffer no assault that will not be answered to. I'd prefer to die first. Of course that doesn't mean one has to be stupid. Taking on multiple scumbags at the same time is not wise and is very unhealthy. Much better to introduce Mr Scumbag to Mr Baseball Bat at some later and convenient opportunity.

Seán Ryan
05-09-2010, 07:25 PM
I got a bad beating myself in Castlereagh and the temptation to clock either scumbag was strong. One RUC Detective was called Doyle (from Dublin) both stunk of stale beer --after the beating both were made to wash and shower --a haebus corpus was issued that I had to be returned to Crumlin Road prison.

My point is that trying t prove who threw the first punch would be impossible because if they assault you first then it is reasonable to assume they will lie about it if they have too. A black and blue prisoner makes for persuasive argument that illtreatment was involved.

Was either of them charged and convicted Christy?

Christy Walsh
05-09-2010, 07:36 PM
Was either of them charged and convicted Christy?

Of course not. Though I was given compensation.

Seán Ryan
05-09-2010, 07:41 PM
Of course not. Though I was given compensation.

I suppose that was a given. You did well to receive compensation. You did even better not to be tied to a gag order.

Seán Ryan
07-09-2010, 02:54 PM
It seems that the scumbag got six months for the assault: http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/video/2010/sep/07/police-cell-assault-jailing-officer

tea drinker
07-09-2010, 03:39 PM
Good news. Amazing though that this generates less headlines or vengeance than throwing puppies in a river.

TaxProtester
07-09-2010, 03:44 PM
I know nobody here is going to agree with me, but I dont think the assault was a particularly bad one. It brings up the whole question of how much force should a policeman be allowed to use on someone who resists arrest.

We cant expect the police to be really aggressive in dealing with gangland criminals or ASBO thugs tearing up the town, and simultaneously expect them to be patient and courteous when dealing with a stroppy citizen who has been caught drunk in a car and refuses to take a breath test. She might well have knocked someone down on the way home, if she hadnt been arrested.

tea drinker
07-09-2010, 03:59 PM
If police abuse happened on one or two occasions - then I might agree. But rightly or wrongly, I had an "ah ha" moment when I simply couldn't keep explaining away these things to protect the cops reputation. Too many things require me to keep inventing explanations for the behaviour, at some point, you have to say he committed a crime, he should go down like you or me. The judge won't care it if I cut the legs of a murderer to prevent a probably further crime, or worse as atonement for another.
Lets just say sometimes a price has to be paid to do the right thing - frequently higher than the easy way - but that's his/your/my decision to risk all for it. It has no connection to the legal system.

Seán Ryan
07-09-2010, 05:19 PM
I know nobody here is going to agree with me, but I dont think the assault was a particularly bad one. It brings up the whole question of how much force should a policeman be allowed to use on someone who resists arrest.

We cant expect the police to be really aggressive in dealing with gangland criminals or ASBO thugs tearing up the town, and simultaneously expect them to be patient and courteous when dealing with a stroppy citizen who has been caught drunk in a car and refuses to take a breath test. She might well have knocked someone down on the way home, if she hadnt been arrested.

Reasonable force is well defined in law. Not only can we expect the police to use it, we should demand it.

I can recognise the difference between someone "tearing up the town" and someone being "stroppy." I expect you can too. And I most certainly expect the police to tell the difference and act accordingly and appropriately.

The woman "might" have done lots of things, including bringing about the destruction of the universe. She didn't though. Focussing on what she did do is a more appropriate way of judging her, I think.

Seán Ryan
07-09-2010, 05:25 PM
This scumbag's victim says that she was never asked to take a breath test. She was found asleep in the car, so there's no indication that she was going to drive it whatsoever. And there's nothing to say that she was drunk.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-wiltshire-11214217

TaxProtester
07-09-2010, 05:37 PM
This scumbag's victim says that she was never asked to take a breath test.People say a lot of things when involved in a dispute. Most people will try to lie their way out, if caught drink driving, because the penalties are so severe.


She was found asleep in the car, so there's no indication that she was going to drive it whatsoever.Incorrect. There is every indication. Maybe you think she had the car towed to that spot before sleeping in it. I dont. I would have breathalysed her too.


And there's nothing to say that she was drunk.So why refuse the breath test then? Its only a breath test. Its not a feckin cavity search.

This kind of stuff happens a lot in Ireland too. People refuse to take breath tests and then get stroppy when they are arrested. Those are the rules. They are not difficult to understand. If you want to change them, you are free to run for office on that issue, or lobby your TD. I dont think youd get much public support.

Seán Ryan
07-09-2010, 05:48 PM
People say a lot of things when involved in a dispute. Most people will try to lie their way out, if caught drink driving, because the penalties are so severe.

Incorrect. There is every indication. Maybe you think she had the car towed to that spot before sleeping in it. I dont. I would have breathalysed her too.

So why refuse the breath test then? Its only a breath test. Its not a feckin cavity search.

This kind of stuff happens a lot in Ireland too. People refuse to take breath tests and then get stroppy when they are arrested. Those are the rules. They are not difficult to understand. If you want to change them, you are free to run for office on that issue, or lobby your TD. I dont think youd get much public support.

She is 59 years of age and 5 2', her attacker is 6 3'

She says that she was driving to her daughter's and that her car broke down. She says that she fell asleep. There's nothing that disputes this.

She says that she was never asked to take a breath test. The police who arrested her under a suspicion (even though they did not catch her driving - there's plenty of case law that would have had this thrown out had it gone to court) say they did make the demand. It's now a moot issue - the charge was dropped later. Anyway, she provided plenty of blood that they could have tested, had they been inclined to do so.

TaxProtester
07-09-2010, 06:00 PM
She is 59 years of age and 5 2', her attacker is 6 3'Thats irrelevant. Are you saying that only police of equal size to the suspect, should be allowed to arrest someone?


even though they did not catch her driving - there's plenty of case law that would have had this thrown out had it gone to court)I dont think that is true. The law forbids not only driving while drunk but also "being in control of a vehicle". Again, I think the police were right to request a breath test in that situation.


she provided plenty of blood that they could have tested, had they been inclined to do so.Youre full of crap. Theres no way a standard blood alcohol test could be done on blood samples recoved from a floor.

Seán Ryan
07-09-2010, 09:34 PM
There's no need to get defensive. If you're unable to argue your position just get lost, I won't mind. Your opinion weighed against facts has no merit and I don't appreciate your transference of your inadequacies into insulting me.

Move along and find someone who has a better sense of humour than I.

mutley
18-11-2010, 09:17 PM
Just saw on the BBC news that the
Police officer has had his conviction overturned, and that the judge was satisfied that he had not intended to throw the woman into a cell.

Total disgrace