Motor insurance costs

[Aspro]

Just curious - has anyone else found that despite shopping around they are being hit with large increases in their premiums this year?

Despite having no penalty points and an extra years no claims and full licence - I can't get a quote anywhere that is not at minimum 30% more expensive than last year. And I'd be in what they would consider a "safe" category.

"Cover their own arses" cover, I call it.

[C. Flower]

Just curious - has anyone else found that despite shopping around they are being hit with large increases in their premiums this year?

Despite having no penalty points and an extra years no claims and full licence - I can't get a quote anywhere that is not at minimum 30% more expensive than last year. And I'd be in what they would consider a "safe" category.

"Cover their own arses" cover, I call it.

They must have lost a lot of business. Traffic is right down - particularly commercial, with the collapse of the construction sector.

[TotalMayhem]

The usual symptoms of a market where all prices are rigged.

Rather than having the insurers compete freely for the fewer customers, they make those who can still pay their demands pay more to cover their losses.

That's what the "Financial Regulator" is for: to ensure their profits, not to cut the best deal for consumers.

[Gruffalo]

I am in my 30's and have never driven simply because the associated costs are disgraceful in this country.

[Baron von Biffo]

The insurance industry here seems to be run to the same standards as the banks. Greedy, incompetent managers raking in massive salaries, failing at their job and making the customer carry the can.

We need to take away their protected market and allow motorists to enjoy their right as EU citizens to buy products and services from other EU countries.

[Graham]

The usual symptoms of a market where all prices are rigged.

Rather than having the insurers compete freely for the fewer customers, they make those who can still pay their demands pay more to cover their losses.

That's what the "Financial Regulator" is for: to ensure their profits, not to cut the best deal for consumers.

What nonsense. Do you:

a) have any evidence that there is price-rigging going on in the insurance market or

b) understand that the basic principle of insurance is that when there are losses everyone else has to pay for them?


The insurance industry here seems to be run to the same standards as the banks. Greedy, incompetent managers raking in massive salaries, failing at their job and making the customer carry the can.

We need to take away their protected market and allow motorists to enjoy their right as EU citizens to buy products and services from other EU countries.

Again, both of your points are evidently untrue.

a) the insurance industry (falling profits aside) has thus far survived the financial crisis more or less intact (with the obvious exception of AIG and their downfall was a result of their foray into creative banking and not their insurance business, which was and remains one of the best managed in the industry). Does that support the idea of greedy, incompetent managers?

b) If you take the time to check you'll find that most of the major insurers in Ireland are subsidiaries of European insurers and, conversely, that most of the major insurers in Europe are already here in one form or another. If you were to buy your insurance in Europe, you'd be buying from the same people. The only difference would be that our entire motor insurance market would be little more than a blip on the profits radar. Do you think that would help matters?

[TotalMayhem]

What nonsense. Do you:

a) have any evidence that there is price-rigging going on in the insurance market

Zurich, 9 States Settle Bid-Rigging Case for $171 Million (http://www.insurancejournal.com/news/national/2006/03/19/66587.htm)

And the list goes on and on, in Germany Allianz, Axa (http://www.manager-magazin.de/unternehmen/artikel/0,2828,303099,00.html) and others were involved in price rigging cases over fire insurances.

And don't tell me there isn't anything like this going on in the Irish insurance market. Just because their practices are approved by the Financial Regulator, it doesn't make them any less despicable.


understand that the basic principle of insurance is that when there are losses everyone else has to pay for them?

I'm not talking about losses through claims, I'm talking about losses caused by reckless financial management.

[Baron von Biffo]

Again, both of your points are evidently untrue.

a) the insurance industry (falling profits aside) has thus far survived the financial crisis more or less intact (with the obvious exception of AIG and their downfall was a result of their foray into creative banking and not their insurance business, which was and remains one of the best managed in the industry). Does that support the idea of greedy, incompetent managers?

Easy to survive when you're one of a protected cosy club that consumers are forced to deal with.


b) If you take the time to check you'll find that most of the major insurers in Ireland are subsidiaries of European insurers and, conversely, that most of the major insurers in Europe are already here in one form or another. If you were to buy your insurance in Europe, you'd be buying from the same people. The only difference would be that our entire motor insurance market would be little more than a blip on the profits radar. Do you think that would help matters?

Can I go online and buy my car insurance from a Belgian or a Spanish broker if they're offering better deals than those available here? No I can't. I'm an EU citizen with theoretical access to the free market but the state refuses to allow me to take the best deal in that market. The law of the land forces me to deal with the cosy club even when that's against my interests.

[Graham]

Easy to survive when you're one of a protected cosy club that consumers are forced to deal with.

Can I go online and buy my car insurance from a Belgian or a Spanish broker if they're offering better deals than those available here? No I can't. I'm an EU citizen with theoretical access to the free market but the state refuses to allow me to take the best deal in that market. The law of the land forces me to deal with the cosy club even when that's against my interests.

You're not listening. I already told you that the insurers we have in Ireland are more or less the exact same insurers they have in Europe.

Pretty much the only companies that aren't are FBD and Quinn. It's somewhat ironic that you'd probably get a better (better meaning cheaper from your point of view apparently) deal from either of those companies than you would from the European insurers you're so fond of (in a "the grass is always greener" kind of way).

[Graham]

Zurich, 9 States Settle Bid-Rigging Case for $171 Million (http://www.insurancejournal.com/news/national/2006/03/19/66587.htm)

And the list goes on and on, in Germany Allianz, Axa (http://www.manager-magazin.de/unternehmen/artikel/0,2828,303099,00.html) and others were involved in price rigging cases over fire insurances.

And don't tell me there isn't anything like this going on in the Irish insurance market. Just because their practices are approved by the Financial Regulator, it doesn't make them any less despicable.

Two cases relating to things that happened ten years ago and more? In the US and mainland Europe? That's the best you've got?



I'm not talking about losses through claims, I'm talking about losses caused by reckless financial management.

Neither of the cases you refer to above are issues of financial management. If that's your issue then provide evidence of that.

[Baron von Biffo]

You're not listening. I already told you that the insurers we have in Ireland are more or less the exact same insurers they have in Europe.

Pretty much the only companies that aren't are FBD and Quinn. It's somewhat ironic that you'd probably get a better (better meaning cheaper from your point of view apparently) deal from either of those companies than you would from the European insurers you're so fond of (in a "the grass is always greener" kind of way).

No you're not listening. Irish motorists are denied access to the free market. It doesn't matter where the insurance companies that operate here hail from. We are not allowed to buy better insurance products if we find them elsewhere.

We can buy books or cameras or birdseed or wellingtons anywhere we want but the insurance market is rigged against the consumer.

[Nollaig MacSeoin]

Have to agree with Aspro here. Premiums are definitely up this year although I have been seeing more like 20%. Despite being in a similar position, 1 year extra NCB , and being classed in a safe category, my current insurer Quinn Direct has come in roughly 22% up on last year. This despite no material changes, 2 points gone off my licence and reduction of €2.5K to the value of my car. Sean Quinn states in this mornings papers that he intends to pay back "every cent" of the €2.5 billion that he owes to Anglo from projected profits over the next seven years. Profits depend on customers, keep on ******** them in this manner and you wont have many left.