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eamo
17-08-2018, 02:33 PM
The ludicrously situated sex offenders clinic which was arrogantly imposed on the people of Sallynoggin has been occupied by the local group "Sallynoggin Concerned Community". Well done them. More details can be found on the Lampposts thread.

Here is the statment from the group announcing the action:



Statement:
Our group Sallynoggin Concerned community has tonight taken a 3 story building at 10a church place, Sallynoggin. We have been forced to take direct action to keep our community safe from sexual preditors. The landlord Paul Murphy, Dr Patrick Randall and the Garda have collaborated to secretly setup a sex offenders clinic without planning permission, without community consent in the heart of our community with schools, colleges and creches within meters.

Dr Patrick Randall has continuously lied to our community since we have engaged with him in July. We picketed and took direct action to force the closure of the clinic and on the 16th of July Randall backed up by 30 garda cut our community locks, and evacuated 2 lorry loads of client files and told us he was moving out. We removed our picket, in good faith, to facilitate his unhindered departure. On the 16th of July in a recorded conversation Randall backtracked, telling us he intended to stay at 10a, to apply for planning permission etc, that he had a 10 year lease that he could not get out of with landlord Paul Murphy of Killiney.
Again we were forced to escalate our direct action, applying locks to to keep him out and his clinic closed, and further, to our action today, taking the building to put it to good use as Sallynoggin social center, a safe space, to organise and to support our community.
We refuse to beg or plead with the state, the council, the cops or ALL the politicians who have failed our community. We have empowered ourselves to take direct action and to solve of own problems and to provide a positive solutions.
We thanks comrades for leaving the door open to facilitate our occupation, solidarity, we have caused no damage to this building and have no intent to create damage, this a peaceful occupation.

Friday the 17th August 2018
Sallynoggin social center

Count Bobulescu
17-08-2018, 03:12 PM
I agree that the location is, to put it delicately, sub-optimal, and the Dr. shouldn't have signed a lease until he had planning in the bag, but the protestors are poorly served by issuing a statement that includes the sentence.....


We refuse to beg or plead with the state, the council, the cops or ALL the politicians who have failed our community

If planning is granted and they end up in court, they could easily lose because of it.

eamo
17-08-2018, 10:02 PM
I agree that the location is, to put it delicately, sub-optimal, and the Dr. shouldn't have signed a lease until he had planning in the bag, but the protestors are poorly served by issuing a statement that includes the sentence.....



If planning is granted and they end up in court, they could easily lose because of it.


Well......sub-optimal is a VERY polite way of putting it. What the hell was he thinking!

With regard to the planning permission aspect. I don't think Dr. Randall originally had any intention to apply for planning permission. Maybe he did not know it was necessary or maybe he was given a "nod and wink" by someone in authority to go ahead without permission so as not to draw attention to the stupid venture.
It is only now when according to himself he cannot back out of a 10 year lease that he is looking for planning permission which will almost certainly be denied.
He is between a rock and a very sharp and hard place.

I wonder was he walked into this situation by some smart-alec. If so his his best option is to make common cause with the locals. The Concerned Community people have offered to make representation to the land-lord. They could make it clear that a sex offenders clinic will not open on his property. If s/he has any sense they will withdraw from the agreement with Dr. Randall and look for another tenant. Then the matter would be forgotten and the new tenant would have local good will.

Remember when Stringfellows tried to open a lap dancing place on Parnell St. The people of nearby Dominic St. led by the mothers shut the place down after only 5 months. This despite the Stringfellows organisation saying they were there to stay.

Here is a link to the story: https://www.irishtimes.com/news/stringfellows-to-close-after-just-five-months-1.790354

Now if the locals could rightfully close down Stringfellows who really thinks Dr Randalls Ridiculous Emporium would last. FFS! Just think....how many perverts are going to run the gauntlet of local mothers to attend there weekly chat with Dr Randall.

Gods sake Doctor......give it up and work with the locals to try and get some good out of this fiasco. They are actually quite a reasonable bunch.

eamo
17-08-2018, 10:42 PM
98fm did a piece on the occupation this morning.

Here is a link to the podcast:

https://www.98fm.com/podcasts/Dublin_Talks/98FMs_Dublin_Talks/69507/Sex_Offenders_In_Sallynoggin__Locals_Are_Taking_Ac tion

pluralist
17-08-2018, 11:18 PM
I think we need to be careful with this stuff.

There is a risk of encouraging vigilantism. There have been recent cases in the UK where allegations made against high profile figures, while initially taken seriously by the police, have now been refuted. We have also seen cases of people being attacked just because they bore a physical resemblance to sex offenders.

From what I can see regarding a search on Dr Patrick Randall on the net, he seems to be a respected psychologist. Eamo, I question your choice of language above with your use of phrases like 'stupid venture', 'Dr Randall's Ridiculous Emporium', etc. Is rehabilitating sex offenders not a good thing, in the public interest?

eamo
18-08-2018, 12:33 PM
I think we need to be careful with this stuff.

There is a risk of encouraging vigilantism. There have been recent cases in the UK where allegations made against high profile figures, while initially taken seriously by the police, have now been refuted. We have also seen cases of people being attacked just because they bore a physical resemblance to sex offenders.

From what I can see regarding a search on Dr Patrick Randall on the net, he seems to be a respected psychologist. Eamo, I question your choice of language above with your use of phrases like 'stupid venture', 'Dr Randall's Ridiculous Emporium', etc. Is rehabilitating sex offenders not a good thing, in the public interest?

You are right. "Stupid venture" was a silly thing to say. It is the location which is stupid, the venture which is, I presume, designed to stop re-offending is very honorable and not stupid in any way.
The "Dr. Randalls's Ridiculous Emporium" thing was an attempt to bring a little humor to the situation. It was a take off of "DR.Querkeys Good Time Emporium" on O'Connells St. YEA...I know..not funny at all, but God I thought it was hilarious last night. You know Hemingway's advice about how it is fine to write drunk, but always be sure to edit sober, well I can tell you it is bloody good advice:o

pluralist
18-08-2018, 09:33 PM
Ah ok fair enough. I agree the location is totally unsuitable given there are a lot of kids and families in the area.

Count Bobulescu
18-08-2018, 10:09 PM
Eamo, you should be ashamed of yourself. You know full well that I am waaay too young to remember anything to do with Stringfellows, or anything else that happened in the aughties.:)


I'll play devil's advocate for a moment. Agree with Pluralist's concern over vigilantism. This is not the same as protesting drug dealers engaged in illegal activity. It could be argued here that the protestors are depriving people of needed healthcare. No known illegal activity has yet taken place, and it should be easier to "police" the facility.
School and facility schedules are well known. A couple of "boys in blue" on patrol can likely keep matters under control.


Is the facility connected to, or feeding off, the National Rehabilitation Center on Rochestown Ave? Does the doc also work at the NRC?

pluralist
19-08-2018, 12:05 AM
All fair points, Count Bob.

Not sure if this facility is connected to the NRC, if so the choice of location might make sense.

eamo
19-08-2018, 10:19 AM
Eamo, you should be ashamed of yourself. You know full well that I am waaay too young to remember anything to do with Stringfellows, or anything else that happened in the aughties.:)


I'll play devil's advocate for a moment. Agree with Pluralist's concern over vigilantism. This is not the same as protesting drug dealers engaged in illegal activity. It could be argued here that the protestors are depriving people of needed healthcare. No known illegal activity has yet taken place, and it should be easier to "police" the facility.
School and facility schedules are well known. A couple of "boys in blue" on patrol can likely keep matters under control.


Is the facility connected to, or feeding off, the National Rehabilitation Center on Rochestown Ave? Does the doc also work at the NRC?


All fair points, Count Bob.

Not sure if this facility is connected to the NRC, if so the choice of location might make sense.

The National Rehabilitation Hospital (http://www.nrh.ie/) on nearby Rochestown Ave does not treat sex offenders. It treats people with spinal and other debilitating injuries. Also stroke rehabilitation. It is undergoing a major extension at present.

A more suitable place might be found in the part of Sandyford Industrial estate near the Luas line and away from any schools.
Or, the St. John Of God brothers have a very secluded and discreet place with land on Burton Hall Rd. Sandyford ind. est. beside the Luas and bus routs and again well away from any schools.

Dr Randall had a clinic somewhere around Dunlaoghaire and/or Shankill before attempting to move into Sallynoggin. Maybe by coincidence and maybe not there were several attacks on women in the area including one at the Dart station in Shankill. These were reported in the papers and for a while the Gardaí increased patrols to try and stop them.

The authorities would promise the sun moon and stars if they wanted this clinic in Sallynoggin. Cops on every corner and patrols around the clock.
People are not so foolish as to believe them.
The clinic will not be allowed to be set up in its present location, that is for sure. Dr. Randall and the land-lord should sit down with the locals and see what solutions can be found.

Count Bobulescu
19-08-2018, 04:44 PM
The National Rehabilitation Hospital (http://www.nrh.ie/) on nearby Rochestown Ave does not treat sex offenders. It treats people with spinal and other debilitating injuries. Also stroke rehabilitation. It is undergoing a major extension at present.

A more suitable place might be found in the part of Sandyford Industrial estate near the Luas line and away from any schools.
Or, the St. John Of God brothers have a very secluded and discreet place with land on Burton Hall Rd. Sandyford ind. est. beside the Luas and bus routs and again well away from any schools.

Dr Randall had a clinic somewhere around Dunlaoghaire and/or Shankill before attempting to move into Sallynoggin. Maybe by coincidence and maybe not there were several attacks on women in the area including one at the Dart station in Shankill. These were reported in the papers and for a while the Gardaí increased patrols to try and stop them.

The authorities would promise the sun moon and stars if they wanted this clinic in Sallynoggin. Cops on every corner and patrols around the clock.
People are not so foolish as to believe them.
The clinic will not be allowed to be set up in its present location, that is for sure. Dr. Randall and the land-lord should sit down with the locals and see what solutions can be found.
Thanks for adding context eamo, it always helps. John O' God's seems like a good fit.

eamo
19-08-2018, 07:13 PM
Thanks for adding context eamo, it always helps. John O' God's seems like a good fit.

It does indeed seem ideal. The St John Of Gods Burton Hall Campus contain administration offices but also, crucially, some mental health services.

It is believed the lease on 10a Church Place Sallynoggin is 1,000 euro a week. The good Brothers could put that to better use supplying their excellent mental health services to adults, children and young people.

From their web site (http://www.lucenaclinic.ie/psychiatry)(Lucena is part of St. John O'Gods :




Psychiatry Department
Child and Adolescent Psychiatry
Lucena Clinic Services have 10 Consultant Psychiatrists across the 5 Lucena Clinics in Dublin and Wicklow.


Each Consultant leads a team of specialists made up of several different disciplines. Child Psychiatrists are medically qualified doctors who have specialised in working in mental health with young people. Their expertise lies in understanding and working with children who have mental health difficulties. Child Psychiatrists can diagnose specific mental illnesses and advise on treatment options. They also have training in pharmacology and are able to prescribe medication when appropriate.

An approach should be made to see if that is a possible alternative.

pluralist
19-08-2018, 09:50 PM
A more suitable place might be found in the part of Sandyford Industrial estate near the Luas line and away from any schools.
Or, the St. John Of God brothers have a very secluded and discreet place with land on Burton Hall Rd. Sandyford ind. est. beside the Luas and bus routs and again well away from any schools.



There's a primary school in Balally, no more than a 20 minute walk (if even that) from the centre of the industrial estate. Which demonstrates the problem with finding suitable locations for such facilities, in urban areas there is always going to be a school somewhere nearby. The second suggestion, the land near Burton Hall Rd, might make sense.

eamo
23-08-2018, 02:52 PM
A while ago three local women met Dr Randall and one of his staff. The discussion was very civil. To be fair he seems like a reasonable person who means well and should have been forewarned by the Leasing company and land lord about the unsuitability of the premises for the purpose proposed. As I have said before, it seems to me that Dr Randall might have been walked into this mess. Maybe there were not any other takers for the building. He seems like he is in a bind now having signed the 10 year lease. At one point in the interview he says he would pass on the lease if that were possible.
The Land lord and letting agency with their local knowledge have as much responsibility, maybe more, for this mess. They are managing to keep a very low profile.


Here is the interview in 3 parts:


https://www.facebook.com/groups/198064574189079/permalink/227466904582179/

Count Bobulescu
23-08-2018, 03:08 PM
A while ago three local women met Dr Randall and one of his staff. The discussion was very civil. To be fair he seems like a reasonable person who means well and should have been forewarned by the Leasing company and land lord about the unsuitability of the premises for the purpose proposed. As I have said before, it seems to me that Dr Randall might have been walked into this mess. Maybe there were not any other takers for the building. He seems like he is in a bind now having signed the 10 year lease. At one point in the interview he says he would pass on the lease if that were possible.
The Land lord and letting agency with their local knowledge have as much responsibility, maybe more, for this mess. They are managing to keep a very low profile.


Here is the interview in 3 parts:


https://www.facebook.com/groups/198064574189079/permalink/227466904582179/

eamo, your sleuthing skills may be needed. He says he operated a similar facility at 4 Haddington Terrace DL, near a school, for nine years without complaint and with full knowledge of Gardai.

C. Flower
23-08-2018, 04:29 PM
A number of "Sisters of Charity" have been arrested in Scotland for historic child abuse at an orphanage.

https://www.msn.com/en-ie/news/crime/nuns-among-12-held-over-historical-abuse-at-orphanage/ar-BBMkt2w?li=BBr5KbJ&ocid=mailsignout

C. Flower
23-08-2018, 04:30 PM
Just to place this discussion in wider context, schools have not exactly always been a place of safety for children in Ireland.

C. Flower
23-08-2018, 04:31 PM
There's a primary school in Balally, no more than a 20 minute walk (if even that) from the centre of the industrial estate. Which demonstrates the problem with finding suitable locations for such facilities, in urban areas there is always going to be a school somewhere nearby. The second suggestion, the land near Burton Hall Rd, might make sense.

It is also the home of the STAG Travellers Community Centre, where there are activities for children.

eamo
23-08-2018, 07:28 PM
Just to place this discussion in wider context, schools have not exactly always been a place of safety for children in Ireland.

Yes indeed. But putting a sex-offenders clinic opposite any school will not enhance safety.

I know all about how bad and abusive some teachers were. One of the lay teachers in our lay National School should not have been let anywhere near kids, and relations of mine who went to a Christian Brothers school have horror stories about what they saw happen.
Needless to say, there were also great and dedicated teachers. One of our teachers was really great and as straight as a dye. He trained the hurling, football and running teams. He could not do that now as he was often the only teacher with the teams and so the kids will loose out.



eamo, your sleuthing skills may be needed. He says he operated a similar facility at 4 Haddington Terrace DL, near a school, for nine years without complaint and with full knowledge of Gardai.

Later in the interview he says the school was next door and was a montessori school. Well it is not ideal but the children are very young and at no time are they left unsupervised. They are also left to and collected from school.
There is a major Garda station is only a stones throw away on Corrig Ave. Maybe they liked to be able to keep an eye on the place.


This is 4 Haddington tce (not 5 as the caption says)

]https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1853/30353402648_0bd844b441_z.jpg

Haddington Tce is a quiet Cul-de-sac.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1870/30353403668_3f9e112162_z.jpg

And this is what it faces, not a house between it and the sea:

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1816/30353403248_cff3b4dfae_z.jpg


This is 10a Church Place in the center of a residential area:

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1885/44172842862_dec5b1ab60_z.jpg


and this is the school which it is directly opposite:

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1865/44172843502_696eb035c2_z.jpg

There is another school beside that then a Church and about 50 yards up the road from that a College.

It is just about as bad a situation for a sex offenders clinic as you could find.

eamo
26-08-2018, 11:44 PM
This letter has been posted on the Sallynoggin Concerned Community facebook page. Looks like a good result but some people are reluctant to take it at face value. I think the protests should now end. It is obvious to everyone that the sex-offenders clinic will not be allowed operate in Sallynoggin. Sometimes it is difficult to see just at what point a battle has been won. Well this battle has been won by the people of Sallynoggin. Now is the time to be gracious and withdraw while remaining vigilant.

One thing is sure. A lot more thought will be put into the selection and suitability of the next site for such a clinic.

Well done Sallynoggin:D

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1875/43570793314_feb566601f_z.jpg

pluralist
27-08-2018, 12:55 AM
Purely anecodotal, but as an example of how small Dublin is, I have dealt with John Fahy & Co (and found them very good) and also one of my second cousins is a primary school teacher in Sallynoggin.

Count Bobulescu
27-08-2018, 02:29 PM
This letter has been posted on the Sallynoggin Concerned Community facebook page. Looks like a good result but some people are reluctant to take it at face value. I think the protests should now end. It is obvious to everyone that the sex-offenders clinic will not be allowed operate in Sallynoggin. Sometimes it is difficult to see just at what point a battle has been won. Well this battle has been won by the people of Sallynoggin. Now is the time to be gracious and withdraw while remaining vigilant.

One thing is sure. A lot more thought will be put into the selection and suitability of the next site for such a clinic.

Well done Sallynoggin:D

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1875/43570793314_feb566601f_z.jpg


I'm confused. I heard the Dr. say the landlord was refusing to accept termination of the lease. Either someone had a change of heart, or someone was telling porky pies.

eamo
27-08-2018, 04:53 PM
I'm confused. I heard the Dr. say the landlord was refusing to accept termination of the lease. Either someone had a change of heart, or someone was telling porky pies.

My gut feeling is that the landlord changed his position. Having seen the video of Dr Randall I think he would be pleased to back out of the situation.

The Concerned Residence group are getting their lawyers to look over the documentation today, and there seems to be more documents than that one letter.
I hope the landlord is not trying to get the Doctor to guarantee that a new tenant can be found or some other onerous provision. I have not been up there recently and am just going on what is on their facebook page.

Here is their facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1831138996922492&set=gm.239217200073816&type=3&ifg=1

eamo
01-09-2018, 04:07 PM
Standoff at present at 10a Church Place Sallynoggin.

Gardaí raided about 12,30 today. Stephen went out onto the roof where he still is. Legality of Gardaí action questionable as there is no court order in effect. This is afaik a civil matter not a criminal matter and as such the Gardaí should only be intrested in keeping the peace.

From talking to people there it seems the only breach of the peace so far was when one of the Garda pushed a girl in the back and another Garda drew his batton. The girl has been taken away, presumably arrested , by the Gardaí. No one else arrested.

About 50 supporters outside, all peaceful but concerned locals parents. . Five Garda cars and earlier the Garda van.

Stephen on the roof:

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1876/44405252781_a26f1846f7_z.jpg
.
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1855/30536092858_4df0fd2a47_z.jpg
.

Garda cars outside the schools.
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1892/30536093078_d4bc529a66_z.jpg


Stopping local women from entering to talk with Stephen.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1871/43497096855_f18cd29561_z.jpg

Count Bobulescu
01-09-2018, 10:15 PM
Who, or what, does Stephen not believe?

eamo
02-09-2018, 09:57 PM
Who, or what, does Stephen not believe?

Some people believe that the promise not to operate the sex offenders clinic from 10a is not as definite as first thought.

Some of the documentation suggests that Dr Randall reserves that option.

Personally I think it is done and dusted. No clinic will or should open there, what is more no clinic will be allowed to open there.
In fact even without local opposition it would now be impossible for a "sex offenders clinic" to operate there. No offender in their right mind would stroll through Sallynoggin on their way to and from their weekly session with Dr Randall.

But the local people are right to remain vigilant.

I called over again today to show support and to hear about the latest developments. A watching vigil is been kept outside 10a by the locals and a squad car with some very bored Gardaí is also parked outside the entrance.

Yesterday evening Stephen said he would come off the roof if the local Garda Superintendent was present. This was to try and insure he would not be attacked by the Gardaí or that they would not try to frame him with attacking them. A very wise move on Stephens part.

At about 11,30 the Super arrived, Stephen came in. It was very civilized by all accounts, they had coffee and talked for half an hour before Stephen was taken to Dunlaoghaire Garda Station where he is been held until court tomorrow.

Feelings and anger were running high when the land-lord emerged and at that time a large crowd had gathered. He had to be surrounded by 5 Gardaí and whisked to safety.

It is about time the attention was placed on the Land lord. It seems increasingly likely that he duped Dr Randall into taking a 10 year lease on 10a Church place. The Concerned Residences people seem to have good information even from some Gardaí who can see how unsuitable it is for a sex-offenders clinic.
Word is that the Doctor put down a 21k deposit which the Landlord is refusing to refund or even discuss. That is not the way to make progress.

I don't live in the area but I work mostly around there. I am going on what I am told. If there is anyone with more information please fill us in.
It is my opinion that this clinic was going to be dumped in the heart of a largely working class area full of young families. I suspect the thinking was they would or could not resist and as if that was not bad enough, to add injury to insult, it was going to be placed opposite two schools and around the corner from a college, youth club, creche and up the road from St. Josephs FC with hundreds of kids as members.
JASUS....talk about pissing down from a great height on people.

eamo
05-09-2018, 08:13 PM
All over:D

Lorry took away all of Dr Randalls stuff yesterday. Building is now empty and the Concerned Community people are now satisfied that the threat of a sex offenders clinic opening at 10a is now a thing of the past.

Well done to all involved. Great campaign. Brilliant result.


Concerned Community facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/groups/198064574189079/?ref=bookmarks