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C. Flower
14-06-2017, 08:42 AM
An appalling and unprecedented fire overnight has killed an unknown people at Latimer Road, in the Ladbroke Grove area of west London. It is one of many similar blocks of social housing constructed across London in the 1970s. It is too soon to know the cause. Reports on RTE are saying that residents had been advised not to leave their flats in a fire as the block was 1 hour fire proofed. It had recently been reclad.

Terrible event. The Mayor of London Sadiq Khan is belatedly saying that tower blocks may have been under-maintained and bad fire safety advice given.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sUenV46uyeY

C. Flower
14-06-2017, 09:17 AM
The residents association blog has been warning of fire hazard for years, and recently specifically about the building's refit.

https://grenfellactiongroup.wordpress.com/2016/11/20/kctmo-playing-with-fire/amp/
https://grenfellactiongroup.wordpress.com/2016/01/24/grenfell-tower-still-a-fire-risk/



In October 2015 a fire ripped through another KCTMO property, the 14 storey Adair Tower in North Kensington, causing mass panic and resulting in a number of residents taken to hospital suffering from smoke inhalation. It is reported that had it not been for the swift actions of the London Fire Brigade the consequences of this fire and potential loss of life could have been much worse.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/11967592/50-rescued-from-burning-flats-in-Kensington.html



In the aftermath of the Adair Tower fire the London Fire Brigade found that the KCTMO had not been looking after the safety of residents properly and issued an Enforcement Order compelling them to improve the fire safety in the escape staircases and to provide self closing devices to all the tower block’s front doors. A further audit by the London Fire Brigade of the neighbouring Hazelwood Tower (located alongside Adair Tower) found similar breaches of health and safety legislation and an Enforcement Order was also issued for this property forcing the TMO to address the serious concerns of the Fire Brigade’s inspectors. What is shocking is that a decade ago a fatality occurred due to a fire at Hazelwood Tower and the Fire Investigation Team ordered that the grills on the fire escape staircase be covered over. This never happened and it is believed that the uncovered grills at Adair House (Hazelwood Tower’s twin block) acted like a chimney and were responsible for the accelerated spread of the fire and smoke damage.

https://grenfellactiongroup.wordpress.com/2016/01/24/grenfell-tower-still-a-fire-risk/

Kensington and Chelsea Tenant Management Organisation (KCTMO) , whatever that it, is the landlord - it would previously have been run by the local authority.

I know this building well from years back, and the others around it. Even without smoke, to get from top to bottom via the emergency stairs was a challenge. Dreadful to think of people trapped there.

Donal Og
14-06-2017, 09:58 AM
Appalling. I remember the Ronan Point gas explosion too. Wonder why helicopters are not used in fire fighting more often?

TotalMayhem
14-06-2017, 10:35 AM
Wonder why helicopters are not used in fire fighting more often?

Very tricky... main argument against using helicopters would be the rotor wash fanning the flames. Another reason being that there is no guarantee that a helicopter can approach the roof again to retrieve a previously inserted helo high-rise team of firefighters when things get out of control (making it a virtual suicide mission).

C. Flower
14-06-2017, 10:45 AM
Very tricky... main argument against using helicopters would be the rotor wash fanning the flames. Another reason being that there is no guarantee that a helicopter can approach the roof again to retrieve a previously inserted helo high-rise team of firefighters when things get out of control (making it a virtual suicide mission).

There should be some form of evacuation plan.

TotalMayhem
14-06-2017, 11:21 AM
People living in high-rises don't want to hear about evacuation plans and regular fire drills as it only makes them too aware of being stuck in a potential death trap.

C. Flower
14-06-2017, 12:55 PM
People living in high-rises don't want to hear about evacuation plans and regular fire drills as it only makes them too aware of being stuck in a potential death trap.

The residents seem to have been kicking up about fire safety for years.

TotalMayhem
14-06-2017, 01:10 PM
That they did but they were more concerned of health and safety standards rather than the lack of "evacuation plans".

Trow
14-06-2017, 01:28 PM
Tragic.

C. Flower
14-06-2017, 04:43 PM
That they did but they were more concerned of health and safety standards rather than the lack of "evacuation plans".

Both are needed. The cladding seems to have gone up like a firework. What ever happened to Building Regs and British Safety Standards ? Not in tune with Austerity ?

C. Flower
14-06-2017, 06:15 PM
These old tower blocks are being externally clad with combustible materials to increase thermal insulation to meet modern standards.

There are apparently alternatives that would not burn.


Arnold Tarling, a chartered surveyor at Hindwoods and a fire safety expert, says the elephant in the room is the flammability of insulation panels that are being used to clad postwar buildings to bring them up to date with today’s thermal standards. A recent £8.7m refurbishment of Grenfell Tower saw the building clad with “ACM cassette rainscreen” panels, an aluminium composite material covering insulation panels, which could have caused the fire to spread more quickly up the facade of the tower.
https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/cf8e468d31b222c903b3d212a1297a5d9d1e05f5/0_113_1600_960/master/1600.jpg?w=460&q=55&auto=format&usm=12&fit=max&
Southwark council pleads guilty over worst ever tower block fire


Read more



“The issue is that, under building regulations, only the surface of the cladding has to be fire-proofed to class 0, which is about surface spread,” says Tarling. “The stuff behind it doesn’t, and it’s this which has burned.” He says he recently inspected a new-build eight storey block in south-east London where there was no fire protection in the external cavity walls. “The insulation behind the external cladding is flammable polyurethane. I know because I took a chunk out and burned it.”

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/jun/14/disaster-waiting-to-happen-fire-expert-slams-uk-tower-blocks?CMP=fb_gu

pluralist
15-06-2017, 11:48 AM
The richest borough, in the richest city in the fifth richest country in the world.

Shaadi
15-06-2017, 12:52 PM
Such a horrible mess and tragedy. Hard to know why they went ahead with such dangerous cladding and against the wishes of the occupants. In this day and age the way it went ahead seems more corrupt than accidental.

Trow
15-06-2017, 01:21 PM
Such a horrible mess and tragedy. Hard to know why they went ahead with such dangerous cladding and against the wishes of the occupants. In this day and age the way it went ahead seems more corrupt than accidental.

'An exercise in vanity.'' So said one local of the external cladding. Designed it seems to beautify/disguise social housing.

More of an eyesore now i imagine in full view of ''the rich mans blocks''
Peaky Saku interview...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3d-oYLZJsWI

Richardbouvet
15-06-2017, 02:47 PM
One stairwell, one exit, no fire-escapes. That arises from the belief that alternative staircases would become hang-outs for drug dealers etc.

pluralist
15-06-2017, 03:49 PM
Protests near the tower now, one man arrested.

Spectabilis
15-06-2017, 04:03 PM
Protests near the tower now, one man arrested.

And protest needed. There are so many issues of defective management of the building, so many contributing factors from the cladding to on-going pipe installation, but one stands out for me, given reports from more than one resident of someone's fridge going on fire on Tuesday night.

Power surges were among the many complaints made since 2013 by the residents

On 11th May 2013 at 9:05pm we had numerous power surges in the space of a minute, and in that process my computer and monitor literally exploded with smoke seeping out from the back and the smell of burnt electronics filled our entire computer. My monitor also fused at the same time. When I called the TMO out of hours service the standard textbook response was given to us that I was the first one to report such a problem and I was made to feel like a fool reporting such an issue, which resulted in years of data being lost forever.
Please note if the power surges continue at Grenfell Tower, it would be very dangerous and costly because it is interfering with electric and electronic items in the household, including the telephone line, television, fridge, washing machine, computer etc”.

https://grenfellactiongroup.wordpress.com/2013/05/29/grenfell-tower-from-bad-to-worse/




Good piece here from the Independent on the actions taken by the residents before this catastrophe:


http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/grenfell-tower-fire-kensington-london-residents-kctmo-council-contract-ignored-poor-a7789276.html

Trow
15-06-2017, 04:15 PM
A blog posted in January 2016 by Grefnell Action Group...

Quote.. However, If the onsite staff at Lancaster West, from cleaning contractors and caretakers to office management, are so complacent that they can’t be trusted to deal promptly with such a public eyesore and health and safety hazard, then one has to wonder about the standard of health and safety scrutiny behind the scenes in hidden areas that are not so visible to the public.

Not for the first time we must ask how safe is Lancaster West, can staff be trusted to ensure it is safe, and what hidden fire risks might be lurking in Grenfell Tower or elsewhere on the estate? unquote.. https://grenfellactiongroup.wordpress.com/2016/01/24/grenfell-tower-still-a-fire-risk/

Quote... Grenfell Tower and the politics of Social Class

It's a fair bet that had Grenfell Tower been a luxury block of a flats - like one of those that are plentiful in the borough of Kensington - the catastrophic events of the last 36 hours wouldn't have happened. Fire and smoke alarms would have worked, sprinklers would have been installed, lifts would have been operational, there'd be more fire escapes and a type of plastic cladding known to be a fire risk wouldn't have been used on the building's exterior - a cladding scheme carried out incidentally because some of Kensington's more affluent residents had apparently been complaining the tower block was an 'eyesore'.

Certainly it's an indisputable fact that the politics of social class and social inequality runs through this entire horrific episode. Grenfell tower housed mainly poor people and people from ethnic minority backgrounds - people who are largely ignored and marginalised in contemporary British society - and you can't help but get the feeling the Tory local authority and the 'arms length' body the council had created to run the tower block just couldn't be bothered to listen to the concerns of all those poor people about the building's safety. unquote..
https://rodolfowalshglasses.blogspot.co.uk/2017/06/grenfell-tower-and-politics-of-social.html

C. Flower
15-06-2017, 04:53 PM
Tragic that the advice to stay in flats was only given in March after a lengthy campaign by residents because previously THERE WAS NO ADVICE ON FIRE DRILL AT ALL.

They had met the councillors, reports had been sat on, nothing done at all except install gas pipes with no protection (it was promised) and flammable cladding at a cost of 8 million "To make it look pretty for the rich neighbours". Explosions were heard throughout the fire, presumably from the gas.

"No alarms that could be heard in flats, no sprinkler system.

The people who raised a noise from the ground to wake the people in the flats are now sorry they did "Because what did we wake them for, They were still trapped."

The back door seems to have been locked - resident happened to have a fob or it could not have been opened.

https://www.facebook.com/Channel4News/videos/10154939461291939/

"It wouldn't have happened to rich people"

C. Flower
15-06-2017, 04:56 PM
Protests near the tower now, one man arrested.

The wrong person has definitely been arrested.

C. Flower
15-06-2017, 04:57 PM
One stairwell, one exit, no fire-escapes. That arises from the belief that alternative staircases would become hang-outs for drug dealers etc.

The block was built in the 1970s Richard, and I knew it well in the 80s. Nothing to do with drugs. It was cheap housing.

C. Flower
15-06-2017, 05:05 PM
Warning that you may not want to see and hear this video uploaded to Facebook by Rania Ibrahim, with her two children, trapped on the 23rd floor. I couldn't listen to more than the first couple of minutes.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rN9EpeJXwZc

C. Flower
15-06-2017, 05:08 PM
This is seen by the people of London as a part of the years of deliberate Tory "nudging" of working class people out of central London.

Trow
15-06-2017, 05:24 PM
I don't think any inquiry should be answerable to the Tory Government.

Not when we consider that Nick Hurd [Theresa Mays police and fire minister] was one of the 72 Tory mp's who are also residential landlords who voted against a Labour amendment to the governments housing and planning bill, designed to ensure all rental properties are fit for human habitation.

Quote..
“New clause 53 is about safety and would introduce a requirement for landlords to undertake electrical safety checks. Many organisations from across the sector support the measure, such as the Local Government Association, the London fire brigade, Shelter, the Association of Residential Letting Agents, British Gas, Crisis and the Fire Officers Association. They have all given their support in the past to measures that will see the introduction of mandatory electrical safety checks.

“It is estimated that electricity causes more than 20,000 house fires each year, leading to about 350 serious injuries and 70 deaths across the UK. Carbon monoxide, gas leaks and other fires and explosions cause fewer deaths and injuries, with 300 injuries and 18 deaths—these risks remain serious and it is right that we should continue to monitor them, but that shows what is at stake as regards electrical fires in the home.”

Labour’s amendment was defeated with the help of the 72 Tory MPs who top up their Parliamentary salaries as landlords.

Hurd, who makes at least £20,000 a year rental income from a 2 bedroom flat in Ruislip and a house in London, was among them.

Today, as Police and Fire Minister, he is leading the Government’s response to the Grenfell tragedy… unquote..
https://politicalscrapbook.net/2017/06/new-fire-minister-was-among-72-tory-landlords-who-voted-against-homes-fit-for-human-habitation/


With residential complaints from Grenfell tower on issues including electrical power surges and failures being continually ignored
what confidence can we have in Theresa Mays public inquiry?

C. Flower
15-06-2017, 05:25 PM
Britain First thug was seen baiting Moslems at the East London Mosque while they collected for fire victims.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/britain-first-grenfell-tower-fire-muslims-help-victims-racist-london-islamophobia-east-london-mosque-a7790991.html

I suppose he was infuriated by the solid response across ethnic groups to help and support people affected by the fire.

Trow
15-06-2017, 06:20 PM
Something ''controlled'' about the media when it comes to numbers. Fair enough when it comes to numbers of dead it will take a bit of time but when pressed, no-one wants to or seems able to answer the question. Perhaps the wrong question is being asked.

We are told how many are in hospital and in what condition.
We are told how many were rescued [be they in hospital or not]
We are told 17 are now confirmed dead.

Why does no-one ask.... How many are reported missing?

C. Flower
15-06-2017, 06:36 PM
Something ''controlled'' about the media when it comes to numbers. Fair enough when it comes to numbers of dead it will take a bit of time but when pressed, no-one wants to or seems able to answer the question. Perhaps the wrong question is being asked.

We are told how many are in hospital and in what condition.
We are told how many were rescued [be they in hospital or not]
We are told 17 are now confirmed dead.

Why does no-one ask.... How many are reported missing?

Someone has been arrested for sharing a photograph on social media of a 'partly covered' body and is being held by a police station.

A BBC reporter apologised to the camera at length because a very upset man she interviewed swore.

They are rightly scared of the anger.

A man was rescued by fire services this morning 12 hours after the fire started. Conceivably there could still be people dying in the building as it is still on fire.

The tenants all pay rent and you can guarantee that the landlords have contact mobile numbers for them. Have they tried ringing to see who is OK ?

How many years was it before there was any kind of justice for soccer fans killed on masse through no fault of their own at Hillsborough.

Trow
15-06-2017, 07:05 PM
Hmmmm, @ C. Flower. News reports saying they might not be able to identify all the dead. That means ''X'' amount for years to come will remain 'missing' and not officially dead?

BBC now reports that it is hoped the death toll will not reach ''triple figures.''

How long before we hear exactly how many bodies are removed from that building i wonder?

Spectabilis
15-06-2017, 08:01 PM
This discussion reminds me of the phrase 'managed decay'. We had a thread on this in 2012, with a focus on a different aspect of the built environment and social justice.

["The term ‘managed decay’ emerged last week in relation to the release of the 30-year government papers in the UK. It was used by SIr Geoffrey Howe, then Chancellor of the Exchequer, in relation to options for Liverpool following the Toxteth riots in January 1981."]

Built cheaply, but now the flats are expensive to rent. This was not the most expensive one i came across. Note that the landlord does not accept rent allowance; that there is no garden access or parking at that price.

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-to-rent/property-59885887.html

Spectabilis
15-06-2017, 08:23 PM
"(The four) senior staff at the not-for-profit company which manages Grenfell Tower earned more than £650,000 last year."
That's more than the Prime Minister who earns £142,500, at £162,500 each.
They manage 10,000 properties, including 82 tower blocks.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/four-grenfell-tower-managers-shared-650-000-pay-q7fqzdl9t

C. Flower
15-06-2017, 10:05 PM
Hmmmm, @ C. Flower. News reports saying they might not be able to identify all the dead. That means ''X'' amount for years to come will remain 'missing' and not officially dead?

BBC now reports that it is hoped the death toll will not reach ''triple figures.''

How long before we hear exactly how many bodies are removed from that building i wonder?

Tories will only allow one new building regulation if three old ones are removed. ALL building regulations came into being over life and death issues. As did Fire regulations.
The cheap plastic insulating slabs are banned in the US (which is not exactly brilliant for regulation).
There were 600 people living in the block. I think the residents' association have the best chance of compiling a list of who is missing. But not yet as people are scattered.

Trow
16-06-2017, 11:05 AM
Some numbers released today suggest @ 76 people reported missing in relation to this incident and a protest/demo demanding justice for the deceased has been planned for this evening in London.

C. Flower
16-06-2017, 12:29 PM
She was not alone in wanting to help. An Ethiopian couple from East London carried clothes and shoes. A Thai girl from Dartford had plastic bags balanced on wheels, a bucket of money tied around her neck, plus her son’s guitar. “He doesn’t need it anymore,” she said. “I thought why not? Someone might like it.”

Times like this one remembers how much there is to love about London's 'ordinary' people.

Trow
16-06-2017, 03:34 PM
Times like this one remembers how much there is to love about London's 'ordinary' people.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiWomXklfv8

C. Flower
16-06-2017, 04:12 PM
A large crowd of residents is at Kensington Town Hall chanting "Not 17". There is fury about the denial of the true number of deaths. The Council will not release the number of deaths.
Council has shifted its position that it would house everyone made homeless by the fire locally. This is a key issue as there is a feeling that the Council wants to drive out the working class (with good grounds given the history). Dispersing the residents would make it harder for them to help each other and to organise themselves to represent their shared interests. There will be a demonstration tonight in central London.

They would probably like to go in and find demolish the tower before independent analysis. Same as here, with Carrickmines and the block in which a young mother died of hypothermia in Dublin.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/live/2017/jun/16/grenfell-tower-fire-london-police-criminal-investigation-into-tragedy-latest-updates

C. Flower
16-06-2017, 04:13 PM
Theresa May, the COuncil and all of 'them' are hunkered down rightly fearing people's anger.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCKeZcmo5Iw

Trow
16-06-2017, 04:20 PM
Main protest to take place in Westminster at 6 pm. Solidarity protests in Liverpool, Edinburgh and Guild Hall Square, Derry City. More protests tomorrow.
http://metro.co.uk/2017/06/16/rallies-for-victims-of-grenfell-tower-to-be-held-tonight-across-the-uk-6712548/

Spectabilis
16-06-2017, 05:43 PM
Spotted on Twitter. Ye Gods



"https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DCcyWOGXoAAOD2p.jpg:large

Trow
16-06-2017, 06:02 PM
Protesters on the march to Whitehall.

Theresa May has put up 5 Million for a victims fund, to cover the costs of burials, clothing, transport to schools and the likes. Fire proof cladding would have cost two pounds more per sheet had it been installed at an additional overall cost of 5 thousand pounds in Grenfell tower.

How many millions will she now commit to the immediate replacement of all hazardous cladding on social housing estates?

Protest news... http://metro.co.uk/2017/06/16/protests-take-place-across-london-as-anger-grows-over-grenfell-tower-fire-6714579/

C. Flower
16-06-2017, 10:03 PM
Spotted on Twitter. Ye Gods
"https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DCcyWOGXoAAOD2p.jpg:large

They closed down coal mining because it created a working class. Under Thatcher, mining and manufacturing was deliberately decimated and exported to cheap labour zones abroad. The unemployed children of those workers were the 'chav' generation, mocked by the well to do. From the 1980s onwards, the Tories in London took every opportunity to privatise social housing in the centre of London and to drive workers out - as was done in Paris.

But GLCs under Labour resisted. Cameron was dedicated to rooting out workers and privatisation of their housing land in the City centre and along the river. That is partly why there is such fury now, because people realise that their whole class is and has been under attack, and that privatisation of management of social housing, profiteering and neglect, and cuts of fire services, and prettifcation to raise the value of private housing of west London, has been at the cost of scores or hundreds of deaths,

C. Flower
16-06-2017, 10:10 PM
Three main protests tonight, one to the BBC, one to Westminster and one to the tower.

There has been a sit down at Oxford Circus.

Theresa May visited Latymer yesterday and didn't meet with residents - only police and fire service chiefs. Today she visited, allegedly, privately, some injured people.

The Newsnight reporter's voice was shaking pointing out to May that she had seen for herself that there was nobody at all from officialdom to accept responsibility help the people of Grenfell Tower - they were left entirely to cope themselves, and for volunteers to help.

And of course, the toxic vilification in the media has begun, just as took place after Hillsborough.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DCeIQcSWAAA6xmW.jpg

C. Flower
16-06-2017, 10:12 PM
When in trouble the British Establishment sends in Brenda/Elizabeth.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DCd-WKoXkAAdrJb.jpg

C. Flower
16-06-2017, 10:53 PM
When in trouble the British Establishment sends in Brenda/Elizabeth.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DCd-WKoXkAAdrJb.jpg

C. Flower
16-06-2017, 10:54 PM
https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/3ae4ca79d84991570d99e46dc0640658a1fbdac9/0_0_4845_3321/4845.jpg?w=700&q=55&auto=format&usm=12&fit=max&https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/picture/2017/jun/16/martin-rowson-on-the-grenfell-tower-fire-cartoon#img-1

pluralist
17-06-2017, 12:16 AM
They closed down coal mining because it created a working class. Under Thatcher, mining and manufacturing was deliberately decimated and exported to cheap labour zones abroad. The unemployed children of those workers were the 'chav' generation, mocked by the well to do. From the 1980s onwards, the Tories in London took every opportunity to privatise social housing in the centre of London and to drive workers out - as was done in Paris.

But GLCs under Labour resisted. Cameron was dedicated to rooting out workers and privatisation of their housing land in the City centre and along the river. That is partly why there is such fury now, because people realise that their whole class is and has been under attack, and that privatisation of management of social housing, profiteering and neglect, and cuts of fire services, and prettifcation to raise the value of private housing of west London, has been at the cost of scores or hundreds of deaths,

"Gold Against The Soul"


Somebody told me to vote conservative
Tragedy is not known under this dimmest of lights
Everybody feels sick by the courtesy of dismay
Was I schooled without direction

Gold against the soul
Rock n' roll has a conscience
It supplies convenience
Gold against
Against the soul
Against the soul

Close the pits sanctify Roy Lynk an O.B.E.
Shareholding a piece of this ******* country
Fossilize - make Yorkshire into a tourist resort
And dream of new ways to humble the poor

Gold against the soul
White liberal hates slavery
Needs Thai labour to clean his home
Gold erodes
Erodes the soul
Erodes the soul

1000 Marlboro deaths ignored everyday
And who gives a **** about sexuality

Gold against the soul
Working class cliches start here
Either cloth caps or smack victims
Gold destroyed
Destroyed the soul
Destroyed the soul

C. Flower
17-06-2017, 12:19 AM
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ByT4618HL3s&feature=share

There appears to be a D notice in effect. Hardly any co erage in mmm online of protests.

C. Flower
17-06-2017, 12:28 AM
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VNTrjJ1T6oo

C. Flower
17-06-2017, 12:33 AM
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nwOkeDhYVFk

C. Flower
17-06-2017, 12:38 AM
https:m.//youtube.com/watch?v=E0NrY1iiAlE

Donal Og
17-06-2017, 06:46 PM
This is just awful.People , including the Murdoch rags , blaming May. Ok , but Boris was the Mayor who closed many Fire stations. Perhaps he is Rupert's anointed though?

pluralist
17-06-2017, 07:22 PM
http://moneycircus.blogspot.ie/2017/06/hundreds-dead-in-uk-grenfell-tower-fire.html

C. Flower
17-06-2017, 08:00 PM
I watched social media last night and saw two/three large marches across London, one of them to the BBC. I listened to BBC news this morning and only one march was very briefly reported, with mawkish focus on religious emblems.

There is a mass of material on social media, much of it with only a handful of viewings, which shows what is really going on. Massive, coherent anger at what happened, determination to get justice.

"They should be on remand on charges of manslaughter, till trial - the same as we would be if we were arrested for manslaughter".

May, the Mass Media reps, and the Royals were all furiously heckled.

Not content with killing the people of West London, the authorities and the media are revealing their fear and loathing of them in their behaviour since the fire.

By the by, from the first day, there were signs of Special Branch infiltration of the protesting crowds of friends and families - only what we should expect given the proven history of infiltration of community justice campaigns in the past.

It is simply incredible that there was no 'incident room' to coordinate rescue and the aftermath.

People who lived in the low rise blocks around the tower were evicted for safety reasons, and left to sleep rough on the grass for two nights.

There was very evidently no attempt to collate information on the missing.

Do not underestimate the working people of London.

C. Flower
17-06-2017, 08:12 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlHve3JhtJ4

pluralist
17-06-2017, 10:59 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWwNvdTqb68

pluralist
17-06-2017, 11:29 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WbVfZTUiOE

C. Flower
18-06-2017, 10:21 AM
As well as the racism and veiled class hatred shown by the British establishment, it's very evident that the fabric of government is falling apart.

Yes, the police have memories they don't love of being chased down the streets in the Notting Hill Carnival, and view the racially-mixed community of West London as an abomination. but does Britain really not have any Major Emergency Plan system as we have here in Ireland ? Even though the flood response was very patchy and deficient in places - there is a system for agencies and local authorities and army / fire /police to come together quickly and act in a practical way.

C. Flower
18-06-2017, 10:23 AM
It is awful for people there that they can't avoid seeing the tower day in day out. The towers rise above the low rise streets around and are visible from everywhere.

C. Flower
18-06-2017, 10:28 AM
It is awful for people there that they can't avoid seeing the tower day in day out. The towers rise above the low rise streets around and are visible from everywhere.

A good report from Katie Hopkins. Starts about a third of the way through. Everyone knows locally that at least 100 people died.

C. Flower
18-06-2017, 10:42 AM
I've looked at the U.K. Emergency Response procedures and indeed they are in my view much inferior to the Irish ones! There seems to be no proper structures for inter-agency co-operation or Emergency Plan system.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/61025/Chapter-2-Co-operation-revised-March-2012.pdf

Hang on....


In the event of a serious emergency, LFEPA (Fire and Emergency) will support arrangements to ensurethat a single local authority chief executive is able to speak on behalf of pan Londonlocal authorities. They will also put in place and maintain arrangementsfor the establishment of an effective control centre (paragraph 9.6).

The Mayor of London is also responsible according to this - What are you doing, Sadiq Khan ?

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/61032/Chapter-9-London-revised-March-2012.pdf

Trow
18-06-2017, 11:02 AM
A list of demands....

Grenfell Action Group and Radical Housing Network are demanding:

An independent Inquest and a Public Inquiry, so that no stone be left unturned in investigating what led to this horrific event, and tenants are able to have a voice.
That public authorities be held to account and criminal proceedings brought against all those responsible.
That all Grenfell residents be offered long-term and affordable housing in their local area – to meet this need, RBKC should buy local private property and turn it into council housing.
That Grenfell Tower is fully rebuilt and not a single unit of social housing is lost – this must not be an opportunity to privatise homes or for developers to make a profit. unquote.. http://radicalhousingnetwork.org/

It is being reported on Sky news that the external cladding on Grenfell tower ''was against building regulations.'' Also banned in Europe and USA. That claim made by Philip Hammond, Chancellor of Exchequer.

pluralist
18-06-2017, 05:25 PM
For what its worth, the public inquiry into the King's Cross fire commenced only three months' after the tragedy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King%27s_Cross_fire

C. Flower
18-06-2017, 05:35 PM
2 women who, it seems, died with their families at Grenfell, had been amongst tenants who campaigned for fire safety for the block and who had been almost certainly responded to with threatening "legal letters" .

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/two-women-feared-dead-grenfell-10640944

Trow
18-06-2017, 06:23 PM
2 women who, it seems, died with their families at Grenfell, had been amongst tenants who campaigned for fire safety for the block and who had been almost certainly responded to with threatening "legal letters" .

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/two-women-feared-dead-grenfell-10640944

From the Grenfell Action Group blog, March this year [2017]

Quote.. In our view the Grenfell Action Group has never criticised the Council, its members or its officers, inappropriately or without justification, and the uncompromising style and content of our blog is simply the result of our ongoing attempts to combat the oppression we face from this powerful and un-holy alliance of Council and TMO. The complicity of these two powerful bodies ensures that we are repeatedly marginalised by claims that we are irrelevant and do not legitimately represent the Lancaster West community.

There is little doubt, however, that these same hypocrites follow our blog closely, ever mindful of our ability to undermine their often clumsy and amatuerish propaganda efforts. The Council has even attempted on occasions to silence us by threatening legal action for defamation. However, they have never followed through with these threats, having quickly realised that we invariably source our content carefully and conscientiously, and frequently from the Council’s or other public records.

For our part, we fully intend to continue our efforts to inform the North Kensington community and to represent their interests, and those of other mismanaged, threatened and besieged communities elsewhere in the borough, and will not be bought off or fobbed off, intimidated or silenced by the Council, the KCTMO or other RBKC collaborators. unquote.. https://grenfellactiongroup.wordpress.com/2017/03/14/kctmo-feeling-the-heat/

Behind the scenes here i'm reading away at the blogs re. suspected shady deals concerning properties on the estate. Earlier, i came across another forum were a member had posted a video of Monty Pythons ''the architect'' sketch.

I think it accurately reflects local council attitudes to social housing. If you look it up, watch out for the freemason type handshake at the end. Dont want to post it myself for fear of offending at this sensitive time.

C. Flower
18-06-2017, 08:41 PM
I just took a look at the page of the Kensington and Chelsea Borough website concerning the Grenfell House fire.

The only entry today is to say that the Town Hall will re-open tomorrow. It was closed since Friday.

It starts with a long whinge about "damage done to the Council headquarters by protestors." I watched the videos at the time and there was no sign of damage being done, unless maybe a wrenched door hinge. I assume in due course the Council will go the Joan Burton road of looking for arrests of these grieving relatives.

The estimated number of people killed has not been updated since Friday's figure of 30 (it is now according to the Police "definitely over 58" ).

Crowds of local people clapped the Firefighters leaving their shift today doing the grim work that presumable resulted in the changed number.

The statement is clear that there is no commitment to keep this community together by housing them locally. Another Hurricane Katrina situation.

The following part of the statement is worrying - all of the people living in the low blocks around Grenfell Tower were evicted after the fire, and many of them ide.slept at least two nights on the grass outside. It looks from this as though the Council is giving only limited help to the elderly or 'vulnerable' amongst them.
m.

We are now looking to source interim accommodation for those Grenfell Tower residents and also trying to assist, where possible, elderly and vulnerable residents from surrounding areas who have been unable to return to their homes due to the safety cordon.

From reading the page (English only) I can get no idea about what if any services are available for them (bar a hotel bed for people from the Tower) or where they should go for them. There is no map of the various places mentioned.

It is completely dysfunctional stuff.

https://www.rbkc.gov.uk/newsroom/all-council-statements/grenfell-tower-latest

There is no expression of sorry, grief or regret from the Council bar a quote from the Chair of the Council that "this is a terrible day for Kensington and Chelsea Council".

.... I just found the statement of 14 June tucked away in a list of 'maisonette fire' incidents.

It treats the event purely as a Fire and Police matter and does not mention housing or any other social responsibility of the Council.

http://www.london-fire.gov.uk/LatestIncidentsContainer_North-Kensington-tower-block-fire-Wednesday-14-June.asp

On Emergency Planning - which seems to focus on "business continuity" rather than community wellbeing.

https://www.rbkc.gov.uk/community-and-local-life/emergencies/contingency-planning

http://www.rbkc.gov.uk/committees/Document.ashx?czJKcaeAi5tUFL1DTL2UE4zNRBcoShgo=g5o Wza5PBd2kQFJK2%2BWwi5NZtbn2prxOZzKVFVuAUryiyWPmOO2 1VA%3D%3D&mCTIbCubSFfXsDGW9IXnlg%3D%3D=hFflUdN3100%3D&kCx1AnS9%2FpWZQ40DXFvdEw%3D%3D=hFflUdN3100%3D&uJovDxwdjMPoYv%2BAJvYtyA%3D%3D=ctNJFf55vVA%3D&FgPlIEJYlotS%2BYGoBi5olA%3D%3D=NHdURQburHA%3D&d9Qjj0ag1Pd993jsyOJqFvmyB7X0CSQK=ctNJFf55vVA%3D&WGewmoAfeNR9xqBux0r1Q8Za60lavYmz=ctNJFf55vVA%3D&WGewmoAfeNQ16B2MHuCpMRKZMwaG1PaO=ctNJFf55vVA%3D

http://www.rbkc.gov.uk/committees/Document.ashx?czJKcaeAi5tUFL1DTL2UE4zNRBcoShgo=g5o Wza5PBd2kQFJK2%2BWwi5NZtbn2prxOZzKVFVuAUryiyWPmOO2 1VA%3D%3D&mCTIbCubSFfXsDGW9IXnlg%3D%3D=hFflUdN3100%3D&kCx1AnS9%2FpWZQ40DXFvdEw%3D%3D=hFflUdN3100%3D&uJovDxwdjMPoYv%2BAJvYtyA%3D%3D=ctNJFf55vVA%3D&FgPlIEJYlotS%2BYGoBi5olA%3D%3D=NHdURQburHA%3D&d9Qjj0ag1Pd993jsyOJqFvmyB7X0CSQK=ctNJFf55vVA%3D&WGewmoAfeNR9xqBux0r1Q8Za60lavYmz=ctNJFf55vVA%3D&WGewmoAfeNQ16B2MHuCpMRKZMwaG1PaO=ctNJFf55vVA%3D

pluralist
18-06-2017, 09:01 PM
^ Interesting.

In online commentary, including from the left, I see the word 'gentrification' hovering in the background of all of this.

'Gentrification' is essentially a euphemism for the sale of public assets to private profiteers and corrupt offshore oligarchs.

C. Flower
18-06-2017, 09:09 PM
^ Interesting.

In online commentary, including from the left, I see the word 'gentrification' hovering in the background of all of this.

'Gentrification' is essentially a euphemism for the sale of public assets to private profiteers and corrupt offshore oligarchs.

I don't think so. Gentrification is the phenomenon of middle class people buying up working class housing incrementally, when it is well located, and cheap. They then paint the front door in this years colour, put a potted bay tree outside, and if enough of them move in it becomes trendy and prices double or quadruple. A fair bit of this went on in parts of North Kensington.

What you are talking about is international commodification of housing as promoted here by FG.

Trow
18-06-2017, 09:11 PM
There's nothing the ''authorities'' associated with the RBKC [Royal Borough of Kensington and Chelsea] would like more than to see protests descend into violence. At any inquiry it would give clout to any application to have records suppressed for 'security reasons'' Considered too sensitive or not in the public's interest to know. As in ''public interest immunity certificates.'' Incase such records if disclosed would inflame public feeling/opinion and lead to disorder.

We're about to find out if those associated with the council are above the law,..... they are certainly beneath contempt in my opinion and before the defamation writs are issued, pause, reflect on recent events and learn that for every voice lost from the Grenfell Action Group recently, many more have been gained.

pluralist
18-06-2017, 09:38 PM
There's nothing the ''authorities'' associated with the RBKC [Royal Borough of Kensington and Chelsea] would like more than to see protests descend into violence. At any inquiry it would give clout to any application to have records suppressed for 'security reasons'' Considered too sensitive or not in the public's interest to know. As in ''public interest immunity certificates.'' Incase such records if disclosed would inflame public feeling/opinion and lead to disorder.

We're about to find out if those associated with the council are above the law,..... they are certainly beneath contempt in my opinion and before the defamation writs are issued, pause, reflect on recent events and learn that for every voice lost from the Grenfell Action Group recently, many more have been gained.

Agree 100%.

pluralist
18-06-2017, 10:00 PM
I don't think so. Gentrification is the phenomenon of middle class people buying up working class housing incrementally, when it is well located, and cheap. They then paint the front door in this years colour, put a potted bay tree outside, and if enough of them move in it becomes trendy and prices double or quadruple. A fair bit of this went on in parts of North Kensington.

What you are talking about is international commodification of housing as promoted here by FG.

I think we are possibly venturing into ideological debates, or hair splitting. My definition of working class includes anyone that has to sell their labour to cover the basic needs of life. Possibly, this includes most people that you would regard as middle class under Marxist analysis.

Anecdotally, some of the Grenfell survivors have already been questioned about their immigration status. My view on this is simple - Britain, as with any country, is entitled to protect its borders, but once immigrants are there, they are entitled to basic human rights and state protections.

pluralist
18-06-2017, 10:35 PM
Photos of the inside have been published.

http://www.independent.ie/world-news/europe/britain/first-pictures-from-inside-grenfell-tower-as-number-of-people-feared-dead-rises-above-58-35839775.html

Have they been vetted to ensure no human remains are included?

The only prosecution so far has been in relation to a local resident who allegedly lifted a cover off a body-bag to photograph a deceased victim. A spur-of-the-moment action and perhaps foolish, but requiring an immediate court appearance and jail sentence??

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/817304/london-fire-grenfell-tower-met-police-victims-stuart-cundy-steve-apter-paul-woodrow

C. Flower
18-06-2017, 10:40 PM
[QUOTE=pluralist;465693]I think we are possibly venturing into ideological debates, or hair splitting. My definition of working class includes anyone that has to sell their labour to cover the basic needs of life. Possibly, this includes most people that you would regard as middle class under Marxist analysis.
I don't mind what you want to call them - I'm just saying that gentrification was a term originally applied to individual households, not hedgefunds, moving in. The phenomenon you are talking about I am assuming is the mass removal of workers from prime areas and profiteering from luxury redevelopment.


Anecdotally, some of the Grenfell survivors have already been questioned about their immigration status. My view on this is simple - Britain, as with any country, is entitled to protect its borders, but once immigrants are there, they are entitled to basic human rights and state protections.
The Law does not love Notting Hill and North Kensington: too many non-white faces. I would not be a bit surprised if they jailed and deported anyone who can't prove residency rights . And losing all one's personal documents in a fire is not going to help them.

C. Flower
18-06-2017, 10:45 PM
Flammable cladding, exposed gas pipes, lack of alarms and sprinklers, wrong advice to stay put,. Disabled persons on upper floors. Anything else ?


It was reported that the material used in the cladding covering Grenfell was Reynobond PE - a cheaper, more flammable version of two available options.
Appearing on the BBC's Andrew Marr Show, Mr Hammond said: "My understanding is the cladding in question, this flammable cladding which is banned in Europe and the US, is also banned here."
John Cowley, managing director of CEP Architectural Facades, which produced rainscreen panels and windows for Grenfell Tower's cladding sub-contractor Harley Facades Ltd, said: "Reynobond PE is not banned in the UK.

"Current building regulations allow its use in both low-rise and high-rise structures.
"The key question now is whether the overall design of the building's complete exterior was properly tested and subsequently signed off by the relevant authorities including the fire officer, building compliance officer and architect before commencement of the project."

C. Flower
19-06-2017, 11:17 AM
79 people confirmed to believed to be dead, by the police. Many of them children.

Trow
19-06-2017, 03:17 PM
A hard hitting blog posted today by the Grenfell Action Group titled Culture Of negligence.....

It begins... The many who lost their lives in this catastrophe were our friends and neighbours. We tried to speak for them in life and we will continue to speak for them now. We share the pain of the homeless, the injured and the bereaved to whom we offer our heartfelt sympathy, condolences and solidarity. We also share the sense of anger and injustice that has troubled this community for years. That is why we started this blog and that is why we will continue as we started, speaking truth to power whether or not they choose to listen. unquote..

https://grenfellactiongroup.wordpress.com/

pluralist
19-06-2017, 05:08 PM
Grenfell Tower and the politics of needless death

Nick Cohen


As the body count rose from the Grenfell Tower fire, sensible people warned us not to rush to judgement. Activists, mainly from the left, denounced a complacent housing bureaucracy at the Kensington and Chelsea Tenant Management Organisation, and a Conservative government, which had refused in its laissez-faire way to regulate rented housing.

The warnings sounded sensible. At the time of writing, I still do not know for sure why the fire spread with such ghastly effectiveness. Why rush to judgement and into print? In any case, is there not something wrong with people whose first reaction to a disaster is to take cheap shots?



But sensible points can be beside the point. From the moment I heard the accents of the survivors on yesterday morning’s news, I understood that the fire was inescapably political.

London is a city of the rich and the poor. The middle and skilled working classes are finding it increasingly hard to rent a home within five miles of the centre, let alone buy one. The rich are just as likely to live in high-rise flats (or ‘apartments’ as the estate agents call them) as in Chelsea townhouses. Tower blocks for the toweringly wealthy are everywhere: from Canary Wharf and west along the Thames to the old St Katharine’s dock, south of the river in the converted Battersea Power station, and back north at the Candy brothers’ complex for oligarchs by Hyde Park.

To give you an idea of how rich the London rich are, across the road from where I work at the Guardian and Observer, architects have developed the wasteland north of Kings Cross. Once the home of prostitutes and drug dealers, it now has apartment complexes. The architects have done a fine job of turning a derelict spot into a place to live and work. But Kings Cross is still intersected by main roads and railway lines. The noise and the air pollution alone make it no one’s idea of a luxury neighbourhood. For all its faults, a 3-bedroom flat in a converted gasholder, which a family with two children might want, costs £2.9 million. A two-bedroom flat, which a family with two could just about manage in, costs £2.1 million. During the election campaign, Labour argued that an income of £70,000 a year made you rich. Certainly, it puts you in the top five per cent of earners. But to afford the price of these modest ‘apartments’ in a not noticeably salubrious part of central London you would need an income of close to £600,000 or have access to a million or more in capital.

As soon as I heard the accents on the radio, I knew rich London had been spared. The fire was in a council tower block comfortable people only see as they drive on the Westway. The survivors had the voices of poor London: of refugees, of newly arrived immigrants from the Congo, Philippines and Morocco, and of the established working class, who could not think of moving out however many second or third jobs they took on. While I take the warnings against jumping to conclusions seriously, you can already say that their families and neighbours died because they were poor.

Survivors of Grenfell Tower said they had complained repeatedly that the building had only one escape route. They were worried boilers and gas pipes might explode. They asked why fire alarms and sprinklers did not protect the tower. In a prophetic post last November the tenants said: ‘It is a truly terrifying thought but the Grenfell Action Group firmly believe that only a catastrophic event will expose the ineptitude and incompetence of our landlord, the KCTMO.’ ‘We were ‘brushed away,’ they added.

The late LSE Professor Richard Titmuss once said, ‘poor public services soon become public services for the poor’. They stay that way because the poor lack the means to challenge them.

In any tower block for the rich from Canary Wharf to Hyde Park, if the homeowners said they were in danger, their apartment managers would have jumped to reassure them. Comfortable people know how to complain, or how to hire professionals to complain on their behalf. The poor do not, and official society knows it can disregard them. If middle-class readers doubt me, try phoning the complaints line of any public or private service and fake if you can a working class or immigrant accent. My guess is the reception you receive will be a novel experience.

And, of course, if the wealthy are brushed off they can concentrate minds by threatening to sue. As officials ignored the firetrap in Kensington, the owners of luxury Thames-side apartments sued Tate Modern. They went to the courts, not because they feared their lives were in danger, but because a new viewing gallery Tate Modern had built meant that thousands of visitors were staring into their homes and turning their flats into ‘goldfish bowls’.

I am not jeering at them or saying their concerns were trivial when set against the dangers of the London slums. I am simply making the case that money and lawyers will ensure that the rich are unlikely in the extreme to die as the tenants of Grenfell Tower died.

This ought to be a moment of reckoning. We ought to insist on rich and poor alike receiving the same health and safety standards. If the rich have sprinklers, so should the poor. If the buildings that house the rich have cladding that does not go up in flames so should the buildings that house the poor. We ought to go beyond safety, and raise expectations of what levels of space and comfort residents of public housing and private rented accommodation can expect.

Perhaps we won’t. The implementation of civilised standards will take time and cost money, lots of it. Perhaps there will be an inquiry that goes nowhere, a police investigation that fizzles out, and some tinkering with regulations in Whitehall. The carnival of British public life will toot its horn and move on. I don’t think it can. Or at least I hope it can’t. We have just seen hundreds of people, piled up in a death trap, trying to escape from a catastrophe they had repeatedly warned would befall them.

If we can move on from that, we can move on from anything.

https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2017/06/politics-needless-death/

pluralist
19-06-2017, 05:20 PM
Nick Cohen, who wrote a book explaining why he had basically ditched the left, and Katie Hopkins (who has never claimed to be on the left, and has been reported to police on numerous occasions for tweets or articles that were, according to those who reported them, racist) more or less on the same page on this.

C. Flower
19-06-2017, 07:33 PM
Nick Cohen, who wrote a book explaining why he had basically ditched the left, and Katie Hopkins (who has never claimed to be on the left, and has been reported to police on numerous occasions for tweets or articles that were, according to those who reported them, racist) more or less on the same page on this.

When confronted with frying children as the alternative, equality suddenly seems strangely attractive to them.

Sadiq Khan is wooden and lame - and heckled. He, from London Labour Party, voted against installing fire hydrants at Grenfell and other estates.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZJ7fQgOUrs

Trow
19-06-2017, 11:11 PM
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2017/06/politics-needless-death/

I'm not so sure any police investigation will just ''fizzle out''

Trow
21-06-2017, 03:42 PM
A response to news of affordable housing to families of Grenfell in a luxury block.....

Quote.. “We’re pleased that the Corporation of London has stepped in to offer affordable social housing to Grenfell residents – the least that should happen is that existing social tenants are offered alternative social housing after their homes have been burnt to the ground following council and government negligence.

“However, questions remain about housing social tenants in luxury apartment blocks – how ‘affordable’ will these flats really be? We also abhor the way in which developers of luxury blocks meet ‘affordable’ housing quotas by designing buildings in which those on low-incomes are kept out of sight and out of mind from the rich. unquote...

More here.. http://radicalhousingnetwork.org/

C. Flower
21-06-2017, 04:35 PM
The funeral took place today of Mohammed Alhajali, a young Syrian student aged 23, from Daraa, who died in the fire, after being trapped for 2 hours.
His brother who got out was devastated as he thought Mohammed was behind him on the stairs. The brothers spoke on the phone before he died as was the case with many of those who were trapped. The last person to be rescued was an elderly man who was got out 12 hours after the fire started. 79 people are known to have died: the full number is never likely to be known.

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2017/06/21/15/4174801B00000578-4625634-image-m-111_1498055531474.jpg


In a statement read by family friend Muzna Alnaib, Mr Alhajali's family said: 'He was a loving and caring person always showing support and solidarity with his friends and family stuck back in Syria.
'He never forgot to tell us how much he loved us, his very last words to us were how much he missed us. Ever since he moved away from us we tried to be united with him and his brothers and now, instead, we have been united by his body.
'May he rest in peace and may no other family experience the pain we have endured in the last few days. We would like to thank everyone who has been so kind to us over the past few days.
'In particular we would like to thank the charities and volunteers who have helped us since the fire, especially the Eden Care charity.
'We want to thank all of you who signed the petition to the government to allow us to be here and we would like to thank the home office for their assistance in getting us to London in time for the funeral.'


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4625634/Funeral-Syrian-refugee-killed-Grenfell-Tower-fire.html#ixzz4keh18L86
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C. Flower
21-06-2017, 04:40 PM
There were "Day of Rage" protests across London today, all peaceful. Not supported by all residents, some of whom feared trouble.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/jun/21/day-of-rage-protest-march-westminster-grenfell-tower

C. Flower
21-06-2017, 04:53 PM
A very informative article. Much of this is relevant to Ireland as well as England.

The two main pieces of news are

1) that the Fire Service came to put out a fridge fire and left believing it was out. It is speculated that sparks may have got outside and that the outside of the building was already burning when they left.

2) that the Cabinet was repeatedly warned by letter from the main Fire advisory body that there was going to be a disaster due to use of flammable exterior materials. Grenfell and many other buildings have cladding with both flammable cover panels and flammable insulation.

The article is illustrated with very clear diagrams.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/06/20/grenfell-tower-firefighters-put-fridge-blaze-just-leaving-flats/

pluralist
22-06-2017, 09:40 PM
There were "Day of Rage" protests across London today, all peaceful. Not supported by all residents, some of whom feared trouble.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/jun/21/day-of-rage-protest-march-westminster-grenfell-tower

That is interesting, protests badged as "Day of Rage" are usually not particularly peaceful.

Trow
23-06-2017, 10:12 AM
Televised reports of police seizing documents from a number of organizations.

C. Flower
23-06-2017, 11:33 AM
That is interesting, protests badged as "Day of Rage" are usually not particularly peaceful.

The usual s*** stirrers at work - perhaps just stupid, perhaps doing a job.

C. Flower
23-06-2017, 11:34 AM
Televised reports of police seizing documents from a number of organizations.

First sign of life from them since the fire started. Apart from arresting the black guy who took a photo.

Trow
23-06-2017, 11:46 AM
First sign of life from them since the fire started. Apart from arresting the black guy who took a photo.

Yeah, they ran silent just like the local council. Interesting that they are saying they still don't have 'the full picture.'' What's missing i wonder?

Spectabilis
23-06-2017, 11:50 AM
So it was the fridge... but why?

"Police officers have established that the initial cause of the Grenfell Tower fire was a fridge-freezer [a Hotpoint FF175BP, a model with no recalls] and that it was not started deliberately, Det Supt Fiona McCormack, who is overseeing the investigation, said on Friday."


https://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/uk/grenfell-fire-fridge-freezer-was-initial-cause-of-tower-fire-1.3130909

Now to see what a review of wiring discloses and whether there had been recurrence of those power surges as reported by the Residents' Association in 2013

C. Flower
23-06-2017, 12:26 PM
So it was the fridge... but why?

"Police officers have established that the initial cause of the Grenfell Tower fire was a fridge-freezer [a Hotpoint FF175BP, a model with no recalls] and that it was not started deliberately, Det Supt Fiona McCormack, who is overseeing the investigation, said on Friday."


https://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/uk/grenfell-fire-fridge-freezer-was-initial-cause-of-tower-fire-1.3130909

Now to see what a review of wiring discloses and whether there had been recurrence of those power surges as reported by the Residents' Association in 2013

Good question. Surely it was only a matter of time before those power surges would cause a fire ?

But even if someone had lit a bonfire in their flat, the block should still not have burned down.

Spectabilis
23-06-2017, 12:58 PM
Oh, no question about that. The rapid and all-consuming spread of the fire is the next question, and at least we have some answers on the preliminary tests of insulation and cladding.

I had the misfortune to see the fire spread in real time, and each apartment was an inferno, with the fire climbing on the outside in a bizarre, linear way. I had not seen the earlier evacuations, so assumed an utterly horrifying outcome in numbers of casualties. The reporting of 'missing' and dead still very unsatisfactory, while there is talk of manslaughter charges being brought, nothing will undo this tragedy.

Completely astounded to hear on RTÉ 1 just now that the building industry is 'self-regulating here. Like the banks, I guess.

Spectabilis
23-06-2017, 07:45 PM
More than 100 homes in a tower block on a council estate in Camden, north London, are be evacuated because of safety concerns over cladding in the aftermath of the Grenfell Tower fire.
"Camden Council says residents in 161 flats in the Taplow block, one of five towers on the Chalcots estate, will be moved for "urgent fire safety works".
Similar cladding was used on the building to that on the Grenfell Tower."

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-40389148

It seems that even more residents will be moved urgently and will be out of their homes for up to three weeks. There are 5 tower blocks are in the same category.

Trow
23-06-2017, 09:46 PM
A further blog by Grenfell action group titled ''The forgotten forgotten victims. It begins with this piece linked to the Guardian..

Quote.. “When society places hundreds of proletarians in such a position that they inevitably meet a too early and an unnatural death, one which is quite as much a death by violence as that by the sword or bullet; its deed is murder just as surely as the deed of the single individual.”

These words were written by Friedrich Engels in 1845, in ‘The Condition of the Working Class in England’. Over 170 years later, Britain remains a country that murders its poor. When four separate government ministers are warned that Grenfell and other high rises are a serious fire risk, then an inferno isn’t unfortunate. It is inevitable. What happened wasn’t a “terrible tragedy” or some other studio-sofa platitude: it was social murder. unquote.. https://grenfellactiongroup.wordpress.com/
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jun/20/engels-britain-murders-poor-grenfell-tower

Two good pieces of writing.

dedogs
24-06-2017, 02:41 PM
did ye see where that claddin failed every single 1 of the safety tests after the fire????!! its a total fuckin discrace that they were let put that on a tower!!!!

C. Flower
24-06-2017, 11:02 PM
The dysfunctionality has continued. Tenants were thrown out of their homes at 2 a.m. this morning in Camden blocks, having been told earlier they were O.K.

Without spelling out exactly what the problem is, the Head of the local Council has decided that remedial works must be done and will be done in the next 4 weeks, before they can go home.
Different local authorities are taking different approaches. Birmingham is going to put sprinklers in all of their tower blocks. These decisions all seem to ad hoc, not based on any systematic approach.

Outsourcing / privatisation underlies all of this. The Councils have handed over management to a profit making company, who gets in various for-profit maintenance and repair firms to check safety and to carry out work on the housing stock.

Local authorities may not have staff competent to deal with this kind of project. Unlike Ireland, building regulations are inspected, but have been reduced

Tenders for refits and refurbishment presumably go to the lowest bidder, who has pared down the specification to the lowest feasible in order to win the tender and make a profit.

C. Flower
26-06-2017, 09:25 PM
Every block tested in the UK so far has failed the safety test for cladding.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/26/world/europe/uk-cladding-test-failed.html?rref=world/europe&module=Ribbon&version=context&region=Header&action=click&contentCollection=Europe&pgtype=Multimedia

Trow
28-06-2017, 02:02 PM
Residents write to Prime Minister and Home Secretary re. terms of reference, scope, legal aid etc concerning public inquiry.
http://radicalhousingnetwork.org/

C. Flower
28-06-2017, 08:58 PM
did ye see where that claddin failed every single 1 of the safety tests after the fire????!! its a total fuckin discrace that they were let put that on a tower!!!!

Every tower block tested so far in the UK has failed its fire safety inspection.

C. Flower
28-06-2017, 09:28 PM
Just read this, from last week. There is a clear intention, and fear, that Grenfell Tower residents will deliberately be split up so that they will not be able to support each other in coordinating action.


23/06/17 Grenfell Tower residents evicted from emergency hotel accommodation with hours noticeToday residents of Grenfell Tower were given eviction notices by the local council to vacate their temporary accommodation in Kensington, in a move described as ‘barbaric’ by Radical Housing Network.
Residents of Grenfell Tower who had been staying at the Holiday Inn, Kensington, were told today that they were to be separated and moved by 4pm to other temporary hotel accommodation across London, in places such as in Heathrow, Lambeth, Southwark and north London. Following intervention by legal observers, most of the residents have been moved together to a hotel in Westminster.
Pilgrim Tucker, a community organiser working with the Grenfell Action Group and liaising with residents at the hotel, said:
“It’s beyond disgusting that after all these people have been through – losing their neighbours and watching their homes burn to the ground – authorities are prepared to tell them that they have hours to pick up their bags and move to some unknown destination, separated from their friends and neighbours. It makes you wonder if anything’s been learned from the Grenfell catastrophe.”
Radical Housing Network, an alliance of which Grenfell Action Group is a member, said:
“Today Grenfell residents staying together in a Kensington hotel were told they were going to be split up and scattered across London at a moment’s notice. Moving people around who have been through horror and trauma from one temporary accommodation to another is barbaric and unnecessary, and speaks of a degree of callousness by the authorities.
“Only yesterday Sajid Javid was promising that all those made homeless by the Grenfell fire would be rehoused in the borough within a matter of weeks. The government needs to move fast to make good on this commitment to rehouse all those made homeless by this catastrophe, according their wishes and needs.
“We still need answers as to what will happen to private renters, subtenants and homeowners of Grenfell Tower. We strongly suggest that given the scale of the disaster – and the trauma, mismanagement and negligence surrounding this case – all tenants of Grenfell, not just council tenants, are prioritised for permanent social housing in the local borough. If no so such social housing is available, we suggest Kensington & Chelsea council dip into their £274 million cash reserves to buy up property and turn it into social housing.
“Grenfell Tower is an indictment of a broken housing system – one where council housing is systematically run down and tenants are treated with contempt.
“It’s about time we had housing for people not for profit – and public investment in secure, decent, genuinely affordable housing for everyone.

Trow
28-06-2017, 09:44 PM
Every block tested in the UK so far has failed the safety test for cladding.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/26/world/europe/uk-cladding-test-failed.html?rref=world/europe&module=Ribbon&version=context®ion=Header&action=click&contentCollection=Europe&pgtype=Multimedia

Be interested to know how many social housing blocks have been tested in the North [Ireland]

C. Flower
28-06-2017, 09:52 PM
Be interested to know how many social housing blocks have been tested in the North [Ireland]

"37 local authorities in England...." All of the cladding failed.

http://metro.co.uk/2017/06/28/theresa-may-reveals-120-tower-blocks-have-cladding-that-failed-fire-safety-tests-6740563/

This sounds worrying to me in Belfast - I think until proved otherwise, any block with modern cladding can be considered a fire hazard. A Notting Hill resident had pulled a piece off and set a match to it - it went up like a firework. People could do their own tests.

http://www.irishnews.com/news/2017/06/15/news/tower-block-residents-seek-fire-safety-assurances-1056331/

C. Flower
28-06-2017, 09:56 PM
Heartbreaking.
This six month old baby died in her mother's arms in the smoke filled stair well. Her mother and father and sister died. One six year old sister survived on the 20th floor, and has no-one. The number confirmed dead is now more than 80.

https://metrouk2.files.wordpress.com/2017/06/pri_435528731.jpg?w=748&h=766&crop=1

C. Flower
28-06-2017, 09:57 PM
Malek, aged 8 died.

https://metrouk2.files.wordpress.com/2017/06/pri_43457596-e1498669149704.jpg?w=620&h=693&crop=1

C. Flower
30-06-2017, 09:23 PM
The Chair of Kensington and Chelsea Council has resigned after closing down the first Council meeting since the fire because the press were there - he said he was advised that discussion would prejudice the inquiry.

Head of the management firm who managed Grenfell Tower has gone, too.

Paperwork has emerged that shows that the Council overrode the Architect's specification of fire resistant mineral and zinc cladding with aluminium and foam cladding, highly flammable, but £300,000.00 cheaper.

C. Flower
05-07-2017, 06:20 PM
George Monbiot's view is that the Inquiry is a stitch up.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jul/05/grenfell-fire-public-inquiry-stitch-up-red-tape-regulation-policy-exchange?CMP=share_btn_fb

Trow
08-07-2017, 12:20 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HxN1STgQXW8

DCon
12-07-2017, 09:33 PM
Newsnight reporting cyanide poisoning in survivors of the fire

pluralist
12-07-2017, 09:46 PM
Just switched on the tv. Damning interview with relative of survivors.

C. Flower
12-07-2017, 10:59 PM
Just switched on the tv. Damning interview with relative of survivors.

Damning of whom ?

C. Flower
12-07-2017, 11:09 PM
I lived in West London a good many years and knew a lot of the tower blocks well. It was not infrequent for people to be left without lift service for weeks on end, not once, but over and over again. For anyone old and infirm on a higher floor, that meant they were housebound. Nobody in the local authority apparently gave a toss. There is a them and us set of class attitudes that makes their reasonable needs invisible.

In Ireland newly homeless families are being put into 'Family Hubs' that look suspiciously like the Direct Provision hell-holes. And they will be treated like dirt too.

pluralist
13-07-2017, 12:14 AM
I lived in West London a good many years and knew a lot of the tower blocks well. It was not infrequent for people to be left without lift service for weeks on end, not once, but over and over again. For anyone old and infirm on a higher floor, that meant they were housebound. Nobody in the local authority apparently gave a toss. There is a them and us set of class attitudes that makes their reasonable needs invisible.

In Ireland newly homeless families are being put into 'Family Hubs' that look suspiciously like the Direct Provision hell-holes. And they will be treated like dirt too.

The (in)famous Ballymun Towers (as featured in the U2 Song 'Running To Stand Still' ) were also left without lifts for months on end.

pluralist
13-07-2017, 12:14 AM
Damning of whom ?

Damning of council, government & media.

C. Flower
13-08-2017, 06:23 PM
Grenfell Tower is not going away. Prosecutions being brought against individuals and companies are just too late, and the warnings went on too long, for any kind of repair to be possible. It will have a political effect, a profound one.

Just one of very many community documentaries made about the fire
https://www.mixcloud.com/Channel107/grenfell-tower-the-legacy-that-follows-107talk/

Trow
23-08-2017, 06:55 PM
Grenfell Tower is not going away.
https://www.mixcloud.com/Channel107/grenfell-tower-the-legacy-that-follows-107talk/

Caught a few soundbites in relation to the ''terms of reference'' for the upcoming inquiry. Does'nt look like the long battle between residents and the ''Royal'' borough of Kensington and Chelsea will get the exposure it deserves. Can you guess why?

I'll do the rounds and bring forward what people locally on the ground are saying.

Later....
From Grenfell Action group... Quote..
Apologies are due to our readers for the absence of any new blog posts during the last two weeks. We hope you will understand that, since the fire, the blog was researched and written by just one blogger working alone and in poor health. Consequently he eventually suffered a burn out and needed time and space to recover and recharge.

We have also had other responsibilities, like working with our solicitors and the Metropolitan Police on the evidence we will be providing to both the Public Inquiry and the ongoing criminal investigation. We take our responsibilities in those respects very seriously.

We hope to post a blog this week. It would probably be unfair to claim that it was worth the wait, but we can promise it will be on a subject of great importance that will surprise and shock many of our less cynical readers and will certainly be worth reading. unquote. https://grenfellactiongroup.wordpress.com/

From radical housing network, full blog worth the read at the link. The opening quote..

In response to the announcement of the terms of the Grenfell Inquiry, Radical Housing Network said:

“This is yet another refusal by the Government to confront the enormity of Grenfell, and the indictment of our housing system which it represents. Limiting the inquiry to the narrow ‘technical’ causes of the fire will produce a narrow ‘technical’ outcome – one in which Grenfell is seen as an isolated case. unquote..
More here.. http://radicalhousingnetwork.org/

C. Flower
21-09-2017, 08:39 PM
The Inquiry started today. There is a monthly silent memorial march past the Tower, by local people. Still a deep amount of disturbance over this.

pluralist
27-09-2017, 08:42 AM
Grenfell Tower fire was a 'crime' that should bring down the government declares head of the firefighters' union

Matt Wrack said ministers should have to give evidence to the public inquiry into the "atrocity" - and warned his members could boycott it

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/grenfell-tower-fire-crime-should-11237179#ICID=sharebar_twitter

Trow
24-12-2017, 08:21 PM
Inquest stashed away until 2019.

C. Flower
04-06-2018, 10:06 AM
The Inquiry starts today. The pre-inquiry statements on the 72 people who died, intended to be a mark of respect, were marred by playing a sound recording of dying people, which led to the physical collapse of family members in attendance. The Conservatives held on to control of this ultra wealthy borough (Kensington and Chelsea) in the recent local elections

.https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/local-election-2018-labour-concede-defeat-in-kensington-and-chelsea-at-first-election-since-grenfell-a3830891.html

C. Flower
27-06-2018, 06:27 AM
Local women describe how people ran to Grenfell with water and helped people get out from all over the neighbouring streets but most particularly Muslim boys who were up because they were coming home from Ramadan prayers. "Muslim boys are always blamed when something is bad, no one talks about it when they do good" "We don't care who people are." Everything about this is so right and is just what this neighbourhood, always racially mixed since it was built - Irish, West Indian, Asian, White, is like.

https://www.indy100.com/article/muslim-boys-prayer-ramadan-grenfell-tower-block-fire-kensington-london-7789971