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Saoirse go Deo
16-06-2016, 04:23 PM
Shot and stabbed on the street in West Yorkshire outside her constituency clinic..... Sad news.

pluralist
16-06-2016, 04:46 PM
First British MP to be murdered since Ian Gow in 1990 if I'm not mistaken?

Saoirse go Deo
16-06-2016, 04:50 PM
First British MP to be murdered since Ian Gow in 1990 if I'm not mistaken?

I believe so... in altogether different circumstances though.

A lone lunatic?

pluralist
16-06-2016, 04:53 PM
I believe so... in altogether different circumstances though.

A lone lunatic?

It is looking as though it wasn't political. She intervened in a row between two men one of who had a home-made gun and history of mental illness is what I'm reading.

TotalMayhem
16-06-2016, 09:25 PM
Will this atrocity swing the vote? And who is really behind it?

C. Flower
16-06-2016, 09:54 PM
Will this atrocity swing the vote? And who is really behind it?

Is there any evidence that it is anything to do with the vote ?

random new yorker
16-06-2016, 10:13 PM
speechless about this

unbelievable, home-made gun? i read she was savagely stabbed ..

pluralist
16-06-2016, 11:26 PM
Will this atrocity swing the vote? And who is really behind it?

Did you read the Alex Massie article here? I think you should:

http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/06/a-day-of-infamy/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

Hiding Behind A Poster
17-06-2016, 01:59 AM
Did you read the Alex Massie article here? I think you should:

http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/06/a-day-of-infamy/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

That's a brilliant article. Also worth noting is the following comment from Polly Townbee of the Guardian:


This attack on a public official cannot be viewed in isolation. It occurs against a backdrop of an ugly public mood in which we have been told to despise the political class, to distrust those who serve, to dehumanise those with whom we do not readily identify.

C. Flower
17-06-2016, 08:00 AM
Jo Cox's Maiden Speech and last speech in Parliament. Clearly, a rising star, tiny, energetic, and politically very very sharp - she had begun to pull MPS across party behind her campaign on Syria within weeks of being elected.

"Batley and Spen born and bred" - her Maiden Speech was dazzling. She came out of the NGO sector and was passionately pro Obama (worked for him in 2008) and pro intervention in Syria as well as for opening the door to more Syrian refugees, particularly displaced children. in the UK.

She was also passionately for unity in her multicultural constituency which she clearly loved.

It is easy to see why her colleagues in Labour are devastated: personally magnetic, solidly a reformist politician who would have been a big asset to Labour.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3OQRnJ1zrQ


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i7PN16CsLp4

Richardbouvet
17-06-2016, 09:22 AM
There are reports that Jo was being harrassed/threatened for the past 3 months or so, so her assasination may not be not wholly explainable in terms of the Brexit debete.

The remainers have already begun to make cynical and opportunist use of this event, though not yet explicitly. They are attacking populist anger with the establishment, which is of course the driving force behind Brexit.

The above article is a case in point. The phrase "day of infamy" was originaly used by Roosevelt to describe the attack on Pearl Harbour by the way.

C. Flower
17-06-2016, 10:31 AM
There are reports that Jo was being harrassed/threatened for the past 3 months or so, so her assasination may not be not wholly explainable in terms of the Brexit debete.

The remainers have already begun to make cynical and opportunist use of this event, though not yet explicitly. They are attacking populist anger with the establishment, which is of course the driving force behind Brexit.

The above article is a case in point. The phrase "day of infamy" was originaly used by Roosevelt to describe the attack on Pearl Harbour by the way.

I much agree with your points. There's no explanation at all of her death as yet. In fact, the article is itself populist.

In so fas as this affects my thinking about Brexit, it is to remind myself that a withdrawal from the EU, without any parallel action on the left to make practical connections between workers in different countries, would be swept along by the other, clearly reactionary Brexit trend to isolationism and racism.

MauriceColgan
17-06-2016, 02:50 PM
An awful event! R.I.P. Jo Cox.

Great words from her husband.

random new yorker
18-06-2016, 04:45 PM
Did you read the Alex Massie article here? I think you should:

http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/06/a-day-of-infamy/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

Excellent analysis.. the best i've read on this subject so far.

Thank you pluraist for finding these gems.

Donal Og
18-06-2016, 07:04 PM
Yes , the Massie article is very well written. The lone nutcase hypothesis is a bit frazzled at this stage. Mair was a supporter of Britain First a far right party started by an old mate of the Ulster loyalist gunman Johnny Adair. He was at one time associated with the White Rhino Club , which supports apartheid. Bit of a lost cause but they have meetings , often addressed by such stellar speakers as Neil Hamilton , the disgraced ex Tory MP. The latter is now a member of UKIP. Now , of course, the man has mental health issues but , as Massive writes , these events don't happen in s vacuum.

pluralist
18-06-2016, 07:32 PM
Excellent analysis.. the best i've read on this subject so far.

Thank you pluraist for finding these gems.

You are most welcome.

pluralist
19-06-2016, 04:28 AM
The murder of a young, white, attractive left-leaning female MP is a very emotional trigger and regardless of logic and evidence the establishment UK media are keen to link it to the 'Brexit' campaign.

C. Flower
19-06-2016, 09:12 AM
Yes , the Massie article is very well written. The lone nutcase hypothesis is a bit frazzled at this stage. Mair was a supporter of Britain First a far right party started by an old mate of the Ulster loyalist gunman Johnny Adair. He was at one time associated with the White Rhino Club , which supports apartheid. Bit of a lost cause but they have meetings , often addressed by such stellar speakers as Neil Hamilton , the disgraced ex Tory MP. The latter is now a member of UKIP. Now , of course, the man has mental health issues but , as Massive writes , these events don't happen in s vacuum.

The issue for Mair is racism and nationalism. Jo Cox was very actively working in her constituency to bring the different racial and cultural groups together. She was also very much pro-EU / remain. She was in no way a random target.

It is not the first time racist far right fanatics have murdered socialists in Europe. Another Brevik, but of course there have been many more.

In Court, Mair gave his name as "Death to traitors, Freedom for Britain".

Crude attempts to blame "Brexit" as a whole are liable to backfire.

pluralist
20-06-2016, 05:59 PM
The issue for Mair is racism and nationalism. Jo Cox was very actively working in her constituency to bring the different racial and cultural groups together. She was also very much pro-EU / remain. She was in no way a random target.

It is not the first time racist far right fanatics have murdered socialists in Europe. Another Brevik, but of course there have been many more.

In Court, Mair gave his name as "Death to traitors, Freedom for Britain".

Crude attempts to blame "Brexit" as a whole are liable to backfire.

"Crude attempts to blame "Brexit" as a whole are liable to backfire"

Well, how much do you want to bet? The betting markets and even polls say that these crude attempts have not backfired at all (and that's not to give credence to the, in my view, stupid conspiracy theories that are circulating).

riposte
20-06-2016, 07:33 PM
Will this atrocity swing the vote? And who is really behind it?

........
http://www.politicalworld.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=1134&d=1466451219

C. Flower
21-06-2016, 11:54 AM
"Crude attempts to blame "Brexit" as a whole are liable to backfire"

Well, how much do you want to bet? The betting markets and even polls say that these crude attempts have not backfired at all (and that's not to give credence to the, in my view, stupid conspiracy theories that are circulating).

Not to say that the element of Brexit support that is racist should not be targetted.

I've not seen the stupid conspiracy theories. The fact that Cox's murder is politically advantageous to the EU is evidence of nothing in itself. "Lone gunmen" - and women - are an odd phenomenon. It is very possible that some are having their strings pulled, biut not all. There was Violet Gibson, the Irishwoman who shot Mussolini. She was on the odd spectrum of normal, but not part of any grand conspiracy. And wasn't WW1 started (to some extent) by a lone assassin ?

Ceannaire
21-06-2016, 12:40 PM
Not to say that the element of Brexit support that is racist should not be targetted.

I've not seen the stupid conspiracy theories. The fact that Cox's murder is politically advantageous to the EU is evidence of nothing in itself. "Lone gunmen" - and women - are an odd phenomenon. It is very possible that some are having their strings pulled, biut not all. There was Violet Gibson, the Irishwoman who shot Mussolini. She was on the odd spectrum of normal, but not part of any grand conspiracy. And wasn't WW1 started (to some extent) by a lone assassin ?


No, Princip was part of a terrorist grouping called the Black Hand. Indeed, that wasn't the only attempt the group made on Archduke Fedinand's life that very day.

C. Flower
21-06-2016, 12:44 PM
No, Princip was part of a terrorist grouping called the Black Hand. Indeed, that wasn't the only attempt the group made on Archduke Fedinand's life that very day.

Well, thanks for that. From what I remember hearing about him, he was an idealist , progressive and a reasonably sympathetic character.

So, do you think that the lone gunman is a psychologically authentic phenomenon ?

riposte
21-06-2016, 04:18 PM
I've not seen the stupid conspiracy theories.

Of course there are no conspiracies ...... when things are going your way.

http://www.politicalworld.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=1135&d=1466526408

C. Flower
21-06-2016, 05:24 PM
Of course there are no conspiracies ...... when things are going your way.



1. I have no idea if there was a conspiracy or not.

2. "My way" is to break up and replace the EU. Brexit plus a campaign for working class unity across Europe.

Two polls today have the campaigns 50-50. Most people vote according to how they believe the outcome will affect their pocket and quality of life.

riposte
21-06-2016, 05:42 PM
1. I have no idea if there was a conspiracy or not.

2. "My way" is to break up and replace the EU. Brexit plus a campaign for working class unity across Europe.

Two polls today have the campaigns 50-50. Most people vote according to how they believe the outcome will affect their pocket and quality of life.

Sometimes what affects your pocket is not the same as what affects the quality of your life......... EG.. monetary compensation does not improve the quality of your life if you can no longer cut turf.... or have a Wind turbine outside your door or jet planes flying over your house every twenty minutes.

C. Flower
21-06-2016, 07:12 PM
Sometimes what affects your pocket is not the same as what affects the quality of your life......... EG.. monetary compensation does not improve the quality of your life if you can no longer cut turf.... or have a Wind turbine outside your door or jet planes flying over your house every twenty minutes.

A lot of people in Britain think the EU has wrecked their quality of life and hit their pockets.

I agree with you about quality of life - the massive opposition in Ireland to Gridlink's towering lines of pylons showed that people are prepared to trade off wealth for a beautiful and peaceful location - but get really angry then when that, too is threatened.

pluralist
22-06-2016, 12:17 AM
Some Brexiteers can't keep a lid on their xenophobia, even directing it at their own side.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3653410/Remain-campaign-war-Lord-Sugar-condemned-utterly-unacceptable-claim-Brexit-campaigner-shouldn-t-tell-British-s-Germany.html

By contrast the Remain campaign has keep a remarkably united front, at least in public, though the likes of Corbyn is clearly uncomfortable at being on the same side as Cameron on any issue.

pluralist
23-11-2016, 09:05 PM
Jo Cox Killing - THE REALITY

Today, Thomas Mair was found guilty of murdering Labour MP Jo Cox. He failed to enter a plea, was refused permission to address the court by the trial judge, and was given a whole life term, a very rare occurrence, meaning only a Secretary of State can sanction his release. What that means will make uncomfortable reading for many of those whose pushing of borderline incitement, hatred and rabble rousing contributed to her death.

As the judge put it, “Mair's inspiration was not love of country but admiration for Nazism”. He told Mair “You affect to be a patriot. The words you uttered repeatedly when you killed her, give lip service to that concept … Those sentiments can be legitimate and can have resonance but in your mouth, allied to your actions, they are tainted and made toxic”. Mair “had maintained his silence throughout the trial and during every police interview”.

That much will not be disputed. Some of what follows certainly will. But it has to be said, and some of those being referred to need to listen - and learn.

Thomas Mair was not a “loner”. He was a member of the far-right, an extremist, a radical, a zealot for his particular cause.

Thomas Mair did not have mental health issues. One of the first excuses deployed by the ranters and bigots in the right-leaning press was that Mair had some kind of mental health problem. This was bullshit. Had he been so afflicted, he would have been able to have a plea of manslaughter entered, probably on the grounds of diminished responsibility. No such plea was entered, as there was no problem. He knew what he was doing. The whole life term handed down underscores that.

Radicalisation is not just about Muslims. Right-wing indoctrination and radicalisation is out there, it is at least as poisonous as any other brand of extremism, and it needs to be tackled before someone else gets murdered. And the press needs to wake up to its role in deflecting attention elsewhere, taking ownership of its very considerable problem.

Had Mair been a follower of the Prophet, the press would have behaved very differently. There would have been no “look over there at the loner with the mental health problem”. There would have been no “it’s got nothing to do with the referendum”. Every contact he had made in the past year, and perhaps going back longer, would have been pored over and splashed all over the papers. Unlike what actually happened.

The press will now try and divert attention elsewhere. Mair’s actions will be justified with that nudge-and-wink “well, he was right to be worried about all those migrants”, “it’s not racist to be worried about someone else taking your job”, and of course it will all be someone else’s fault. That is not good enough. The right-wing press knows that its constant barrage of migrant and EU bashing contributed to this tragic event. They have a problem and it’s about time they agreed to man up and own it.

Right-wing extremism is being legitimised. It’s not just groups like the BNP, NF, Britain First and the rest of the neo-Nazi pond life. There is also, more worryingly, the rise of what is politely called the “Alt-Right”, which is in reality just far right unpleasantness masquerading under an ostensibly legitimate name. This includes the likes of Breitbart and others pretending that males, and especially young white males who can’t get laid, are being oppressed by some mythical tide of political correctness, rather than their own inadequacy. This, too, is radicalisation, and it too is potentially dangerous.

All of this combined to help poison Thomas Mair’s views, and no doubt many others. But I have news for all those hoping that there will be a more tolerant and civil approach to the EU, migration, other religions, other languages and nationalities, and opposing political views - the press and their legions of attack dogs will not take ownership of their problem. Indeed, they will protest that any toning down of their rhetoric is an attack on free speech.

So the Sun, Mail, Express and the rest will continue to insist that they be allowed leeway to shout “Fire” in the crowded theatre of life. The incitement will continue, the hate speech will go on, the hate crimes will continue to mount up, and ultimately someone else will get killed. But it will be someone else’s fault.

Thus the sad state of political discourse in Britain today. The words of Stanley Baldwin were never more apposite: the newspapers “are engines of propaganda for the constantly changing policies, desires, personal vices, personal likes and dislikes … What are their methods? Their methods are direct falsehoods, misrepresentation, half-truths, the alteration of the speaker's meaning by publishing a sentence apart from the context … What the proprietorship of these papers is aiming at is power, and power without responsibility - the prerogative of the harlot throughout the ages”.

Jo Cox need not have died. Think about that, editors and proprietors, next time you bleat about your freedom of speech. I’ll just leave that one there.

http://zelo-street.blogspot.ie/2016/11/jo-cox-killing-reality.html