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fluffybiscuits
18-11-2014, 11:06 PM
http://www.patriotic-socialist.org.uk/policy

They reject Marxism and Nazism or so they say

Be scared, be very scared of the following


7. Immigration

The Patriotic Socialist Party is fully committed to the introduction of a system of immigration based on economic sustainability in order to better control population growth via migration patterns and maintain and enhance the standards of living for everyone that resides within the nation. The free movement of people must be ended by withdrawing from the European Union and introducing a universal points-based system to manage immigration levels in the future.

8. Armed Forces

The Patriotic Socialist Party is fully committed to the formation of a revitalised Armed Forces in order to guarantee the safety and security of the people, adhering to the belief that no nation on Earth has ever needed a strong military until it did. The future is unpredictable and Britain must always be prepared for the worst-case scenario for, as we have seen in recent history, war and conflict is always a very real danger.

9. Government

The Patriotic Socialist Party is fully committed to the dissolution of the United Kingdom and the formation of the United Federation of Britain in order to mould Britain into a modern nation and to address the issues concerning the balance between devolution and the preservation of a united Britain. A British Assembly will take the form of Britainís central government, which will be granted all primary legislative powers, alongside English, Welsh, Scottish and Northern Irish Assemblies, which will be limited to secondary legislative powers only. The newly formed Federation will work towards the reunification of the British Isles under a single central government, with the consent of the Irish people, and will be consolidated and preserved in a Codified Constitution.



Last sentence made me LOL!

They ahve some bloke called Dave Osbourne running in the Rochester election. Never heard of them till tonight.

Seems all wishy washy sh**e

Supporting armed forces, Euroskeptic, fighting Independence movements...all carachteristics of a right wing party

Apjp
18-11-2014, 11:14 PM
Any more wishy washy than re-unifying Ireland and Britain if PBP were in power??

You've got to admire the openness of openly stating colonial policies, with this group, with Boris Johnson etc. and not presenting it as some greater good because a Republic is a backward thing, which is the PBP's view. The only thing more reprehensible and disgusting than colonialism is a policy allowing it.

I'd find it extremely funny if such a thing got legs.

Many British politicians probably do believe Irish people would swallow it.

SF's rise is as much to do with the perceived protection of economic sovereignty from the ECB's and IMF'S continued interference and doing something about the reparations as it is with the state of the country.

fluffybiscuits
18-11-2014, 11:30 PM
Any more wishy washy than re-unifying Ireland and Britain if PBP were in power??

You've got to admire the openness of openly stating colonial policies, with this group, with Boris Johnson etc. and not presenting it as some greater good because a Republic is a backward thing, which is the PBP's view. The only thing more reprehensible and disgusting than colonialism is a policy allowing it.

I'd find it extremely funny if such a thing got legs.

Many British politicians probably do believe Irish people would swallow it.

SF's rise is as much to do with the perceived protection of economic sovereignty from the ECB's and IMF'S continued interference and doing something about the reparations as it is with the state of the country.


One positive of them stating their colonial ambitions is that you know where you stand with such parties so tearing them apart is a lot easier. Love how you turn a discussion of this party and its right wing policies into an argument of the PBP. There are so many things I could say about how patriotic you are but some things are better left unsaid. Release your inner b*tchy side somewhere else so lets quit slinging mud and get back on topic like decent people do...

Apjp
19-11-2014, 07:49 PM
PBP are a unionist party.

Except they don't shout it from the rooftops.

It isn't excessively patriotic to oppose any form of union with Britain as an Irish citizen.

Just paying the obligation of being a citizen lip service to say the least.

We aren't British, and the SP PBP et al would want to cotton on to that, stop denigrating Republicanism and work with SF Indos et al to oust this shower.

By criticizing PBP, your party, I was criticizing a political viewpoint so I don't appreciate personal attacks in reply. I do think a member or supporter of a unionist party criticising unionism ie. by highlighting the Unionist quote above is hypocritical!

You are right about this being a far right party and you could do worse than stick it on the Nazi watch thread instead.

Just evading the point with a personal attack by calling me a nationalist and bitchy. How can a Unionist party supporter criticise unionism?

C. Flower
19-11-2014, 08:20 PM
One positive of them stating their colonial ambitions is that you know where you stand with such parties so tearing them apart is a lot easier. Love how you turn a discussion of this party and its right wing policies into an argument of the PBP. .

Please remember we have a site rule here against personalised "man not ball" posting.

apjp has pointed out that the Trotskyist parties in Ireland also want a reunited British Isles.

It is a fair point. But I also agree with you that this party sounds like a neo nazi party and one that specifically making threats at Ireland.

Do you know how this got started - who is behind it ?

morticia
19-11-2014, 08:34 PM
Frankly I think many of the mainstream UK parties might be interested in reuniting the "British" isles if they thought they could get away with it.

The Socialist party here also has a utopian ideal that the archipelago should be reunited under one socialist government in Westminster.

This is, IMO, an utterly unrealistic aim. The British will (as a people with memories of Empire and a frustrated superiority complex) turn right en masse long before they turn left. Britain isn't the only ex imperial nation with a tendency to turn right under stress either; take a look at Geert Wilders, the Vlaams Bloc in Belgium, Rajoy in Spain and Marine Le Pen in France. Our tendency to turn left under economic stress has probably to do with two factors; post colonial memories of what it is like to be colonised (lack of supremacist mentality) and the charitable principles taught (but often not practiced) by the church dominated society of the recent past.

I would not be surprised if PBP also has policy fantasies of uniting the ....what do we call them..., not entirely British Isles?? NW European Archipelago?? The soggy isles?? The best whisky in the world islands???

Anyway, I too would be too republican, and too realistic to vote for this ideal.

Reunification just means we get marginalised by a Westminster centric and increasingly right wing UK administration, and social supports go even further through the floor.

But I wouldn't let the patriotic socialist party (sounds like a veiled synonym for national socialist party) deprive you of sleep. UKIP kinda has that space covered and the chances of a tiny new party getting a seat under first past the post are similar to that of blizzards in Hell. Furthermore, far right parties have the same Monty Pythonesque tendency to form "more ideologically pure than thou" splinter groups as the far left..,

C. Flower
19-11-2014, 08:57 PM
They have an elected member - on a Parish Council, which may mean about 50 votes.

It is looking for working class and lower middle right wing vote that won't go for Farage because he is too snooty.

http://www.patriotic-socialist.org.uk/about-us/elected-members

I wouldn't laugh at any of them, they are all dangerous.

morticia
19-11-2014, 09:20 PM
The UK FPTP system is designed to ensure minimal entry from newbie parties; the bar is very high. In this instance, this may not be a bad thing.

And Nige may be an ex stockbroker, but he's not got a snooty accent and manages (dangerously) to come across as a man of the people somehow; don't ask me, but I'd like to bet he'll Hoover up half the votes around where my other half is from. He also seems to have the likes of the Orange lodges well behind him (they aren't just serving the upper echelons of NI protestant society as far as I am aware).

He worries me.

Apjp
19-11-2014, 09:34 PM
All it takes is 1 or 2 councillors elected to give these lads a long term boost.

Any British party making threats at Irish society is inherently a racist and colonial one.

Irish society through things like Irish Aid, our international humanitarian work etc. has fundamental internationalist principles and some Republican principles too, the least of which is sovereignty. Politicians have forgotten these things since the late seventies, but the diplomats in Asia and Africa to be fair, people like President Higgins(about the only person worthy of a job title in Irish politics) etc. remind us of these principles-solidarity with the oppressed.

Michael D made a bold move against government policy today and is a credit to his country.

In his own words 'The Irish people knew what they were voting for' when Sheahan pretty much threatened to smear him by implying he was 'exceeding his mandate' which is actually a pretty wide mandate under the Bunreacht, and allows him massive discretion to air personal views, as long as he does not directly come out against government(coming out against policies of govt. though like Direct Provision, Neoliberal austerity and homelessness have all been effective ways of pushing out the boundaries of his institution and gives the office some credibility at last).

How many other politicians go to direct provision centres, prisons and Homeless centres?!! O' Cuiv maybe for a few votes and his own personal beliefs-he claims-on prisoners rights, but I haven't heard of anyone else doing this, apart from some on the left.

To imply the consent of Irish people would be sought on this matter is laughable. You can be sure it means coercion.

For the record it isn't my having a problem with PBP. I like RBB. I think the Karl Gill types though should cop on and work with others, not splinter.

Clare Daly just said the next Government will be interesting. More hints and nods from some, while fierce wagon circling from others.

The notion that we'd go back to having the monarchy too and that consent could be obtained is equally ridiculous and dangerous.

UKIP are enough to worry about.

morticia
19-11-2014, 09:47 PM
I'd agree the Irish left wing (unlike any UK party proposing this) are not proposing reunification with bad stuff in mind; they're just naive IMO. Joe Higgins and RBB are decent people in and of themselves.

And I'd agree on Michael D. That's one no 1 vote I got right, I think. So far at least.

fluffybiscuits
19-11-2014, 11:38 PM
Please remember we have a site rule here against personalised "man not ball" posting.

apjp has pointed out that the Trotskyist parties in Ireland also want a reunited British Isles.

It is a fair point. But I also agree with you that this party sounds like a neo nazi party and one that specifically making threats at Ireland.

Do you know how this got started - who is behind it ?

Again Im criticising the argument per se and not the poster, maybe if I said I love how the post becomes more about the PBP than the party and its right wing policies !!

Not too sure how it started, info is scant in that regards.

The argument that somehow that PBP/SWP are in favour of some sort of a United British Isles is all news to me and I think we have rehased all this over in another post which I';ll see if we can dig out. Brid Smith was sympathetic to the hunger strikers and was on the H Block committee with Adams and his mates to support Bobby Sands.






They have an elected member - on a Parish Council, which may mean about 50 votes.

It is looking for working class and lower middle right wing vote that won't go for Farage because he is too snooty.

http://www.patriotic-socialist.org.uk/about-us/elected-members

I wouldn't laugh at any of them, they are all dangerous.

UKIP started small and now look

Trow
20-11-2014, 06:35 PM
http://www.patriotic-socialist.org.uk/policy

They reject Marxism and Nazism or so they say

Be scared, be very scared of the following


Last sentence made me LOL!

They ahve some bloke called Dave Osbourne running in the Rochester election. Never heard of them till tonight.

Seems all wishy washy sh**e

Supporting armed forces, Euroskeptic, fighting Independence movements...all carachteristics of a right wing party

Like the BNP? Quote.. A further BNP policy is "to end the conflict in Ireland by welcoming Eire as well as Ulster as equal partners in a federation of the nations of the British Isles unquote. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_National_Party

fluffybiscuits
20-11-2014, 10:30 PM
Like the BNP? Quote.. A further BNP policy is "to end the conflict in Ireland by welcoming Eire as well as Ulster as equal partners in a federation of the nations of the British Isles unquote. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_National_Party

They are more and more like the BNP everything I see about them.

On Immigration from their policy document



- Remove the freedom of movement of people
from EU countries by withdrawing from EU.
- Put an end to uncontrolled mass immigration
and promote a reformed Points-Based system
to manage immigration levels in the future.
This will virtually eliminate all non-skilled
immigration into Britain.