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Binn Beal
19-05-2013, 05:29 PM
A Labour Party Junior Minister recently had a meal in a hideaway restaurant with which I am familiar (not as a customer mind you).
A bottle of fine wine was ordered at a cost of €200. This was followed by three more at the same price.
Guess who paid?
Correct. We did.
What's the best way of outing the parasite?

goatstoe
19-05-2013, 05:39 PM
A Labour Party Junior Minister recently had a meal in a hideaway restaurant with which I am familiar (not as a customer mind you).
A bottle of fine wine was ordered at a cost of €200. This was followed by three more at the same price.
Guess who paid?
Correct. We did.
What's the best way of outing the parasite?

Wait until Shatter is ousted, then follow up with this one. Labour have completely lost their way, Joan Burton's defence of Shatter was disgraceful.

C. Flower
19-05-2013, 05:43 PM
A Labour Party Junior Minister recently had a meal in a hideaway restaurant with which I am familiar (not as a customer mind you).
A bottle of fine wine was ordered at a cost of €200. This was followed by three more at the same price.
Guess who paid?
Correct. We did.
What's the best way of outing the parasite?

If you can produce evidence, post it here. If you are not sure if it is enough evidence, pm it to me for me to look.

I doubt this is unusual.

Greengoddess
19-05-2013, 05:46 PM
If that was a private dinner it's none of our business .

Seán Ryan
19-05-2013, 05:50 PM
If that was a private dinner it's none of our business .

Of course it's our business. Private or not. Little labour piggies who claim to be "real politicians" who live out of the public pocket are accountable for their various acts of hypocrissy.

C. Flower
19-05-2013, 05:59 PM
If it was paid for by the public, I can't see that it could have been private.

But as yet, we don't have evidence that it happened at all.

It would be interesting to see the food, drink and accommodation bill that will be run up by the G8.

Greengoddess
19-05-2013, 06:10 PM
If it was paid for by the public, I can't see that it could have been private.

But as yet, we don't have evidence that it happened at all.

It would be interesting to see the food, drink and accommodation bill that will be run up by the G8.

Ok it isn't obvious that it was publc. The g8 we so g know about since Shatter will block mobile phone signals!

jmcc
19-05-2013, 06:28 PM
If that was a private dinner it's none of our business .If the public paid for it then it is our business. These politicians are our employees and as their bosses, we have a right to know if they are using our money.

Regards...jmcc

Seán Ryan
19-05-2013, 06:37 PM
Ok it isn't obvious that it was publc. The g8 we so g know about since Shatter will block mobile phone signals!

Are you suggesting that Shatter will block signals on his own with his massive and thickly reinforced cranium. Or is it more the case that FG and their Labour enablers will sign legislation that pretends to have jurisdiction in Northern Ireland?

Shaadi
19-05-2013, 06:42 PM
A Labour Party Junior Minister recently had a meal in a hideaway restaurant with which I am familiar (not as a customer mind you).
A bottle of fine wine was ordered at a cost of €200. This was followed by three more at the same price.
Guess who paid?
Correct. We did.
What's the best way of outing the parasite?A Marie Antoinette / Charvet Charlie moment, worthy of closer inspection!

Greengoddess
19-05-2013, 07:10 PM
If the public paid for it then it is our business. These politicians are our employees and as their bosses, we have a right to know if they are using our money.

Regards...jmcc
But if someone had their family/ friends out and if its their salary paying, that isn't our business

jmcc
19-05-2013, 07:29 PM
But if someone had their family/ friends out and if its their salary paying, that isn't our business
If.

Regards...jmcc

Greengoddess
19-05-2013, 07:54 PM
If.

Regards...jmcc
Ok! Ok!

C. Flower
19-05-2013, 08:27 PM
But if someone had their family/ friends out and if its their salary paying, that isn't our business

We might say, given present circumstances, that we are paying them too much :) A perfectly decent glass of wine can be got for much, much less.

Greengoddess
19-05-2013, 08:42 PM
We might say, given present circumstances, that we are paying them too much :) A perfectly decent glass of wine can be got for much, much less.

Well I'm heading for such a glass RIGHT NOW!

PaddyJoe
19-05-2013, 11:22 PM
Are you suggesting that Shatter will block signals on his own with his massive and thickly reinforced cranium. Or is it more the case that FG and their Labour enablers will sign legislation that pretends to have jurisdiction in Northern Ireland?
Obama and retinue are staying in the Slieve Russell in Ballyconnell.

Slim Buddha
21-05-2013, 02:28 PM
We might say, given present circumstances, that we are paying them too much :) A perfectly decent glass of wine can be got for much, much less.

As the saying goes "if you pay peanuts, you get monkeys" but they are being paid comparitively very well and the monkey count is still embarrassingly high among them.

grainne whale
21-05-2013, 04:08 PM
Obama and retinue are staying in the Slieve Russell in Ballyconnell.
That should please Sean Quinn.

Baron von Biffo
21-05-2013, 04:22 PM
A Labour Party Junior Minister recently had a meal in a hideaway restaurant with which I am familiar (not as a customer mind you).
A bottle of fine wine was ordered at a cost of €200. This was followed by three more at the same price.
Guess who paid?
Correct. We did.
What's the best way of outing the parasite?

...

Saoirse go Deo
21-05-2013, 05:52 PM
Implementing austerity and then plonking down 800 quid in one night on wine is obscene.

jmcc
21-05-2013, 06:38 PM
We want to attract high calibre people to politics while at the same time showing small-minded begrudgery over someone socialising with a bottle of wine.And that's worked out well, hasn't it - paying loads to low quality people that one wouldn't leave in charge of a pothole?

So you think that it is alright to pay well to attract coffin surfers, school teachers on tour, an assortment of village idiots, hick solicitors, auctioneers, publicans and inbred political dynasts? Yeah, that's worked really well. So fecking well that we should get a refund from each of them.

And the Labour friends of the working class? I guess this Labourite ordered extra wine while the working class worries about putting food on the table. But then, in your view, they are worth it.


What price is the parasite threshold?I'm sure those in government and in the Dail will figure it out soon - and then they'll tax it but with an exemption for themselves and their cronies.

Forgive me if I don't consider these people to be "the quality". And if the Labourite in question was abusing the public purse then they should be dealt with harshly. But given the joke of a media in this country, it might not even get a mention. A quote from Jim Larkin appears particularly apt about many of those in Irish politics.

Regards...jmcc

Slim Buddha
21-05-2013, 11:29 PM
And that's worked out well, hasn't it - paying loads to low quality people that one wouldn't leave in charge of a pothole?

So you think that it is alright to pay well to attract coffin surfers, school teachers on tour, an assortment of village idiots, hick solicitors, auctioneers, publicans and inbred political dynasts? Yeah, that's worked really well. So fecking well that we should get a refund from each of them.

And the Labour friends of the working class? I guess this Labourite ordered extra wine while the working class worries about putting food on the table. But then, in your view, they are worth it.

I'm sure those in government and in the Dail will figure it out soon - and then they'll tax it but with an exemption for themselves and their cronies.

Forgive me if I don't consider these people to be "the quality". And if the Labourite in question was abusing the public purse then they should be dealt with harshly. But given the joke of a media in this country, it might not even get a mention. A quote from Jim Larkin appears particularly apt about many of those in Irish politics.

Regards...jmcc


One will always find defenders of the status quo, regardless of how bad it is. It is particularly bad in Ireland, because there seems to be nothing to compare it with except Britain, which has myriad problems of its own. Comparisons with similarly sized countires in Europe is out, it seems, because Ireland "has a different history", is "socialogically different" and , of course, they don´t speak English. All fatuous, specious, mendacious and puerile nonsense.

It is bone idle, lazy indolence to constantly compare us with the UK or USA, based purely on linguistic ignorance, and belligerent stubbornness. We can be compared to Norway, Belgium, Luxembourg, Switzerland and such countries and we come off such comparisons really badly. Our governance, for a start, is a shambolic joke.

But it has its defenders, that´s for sure.

barrym
22-05-2013, 08:46 AM
If that was a private dinner it's none of our business .

What's private about it if we paid for it? It is typical of the political class, and I include yerself, to hide this sort of thing behind "private" - it's far from it ye were raised.

Baron von Biffo
22-05-2013, 09:27 AM
What's private about it if we paid for it? It is typical of the political class, and I include yerself, to hide this sort of thing behind "private" - it's far from it ye were raised.

...

Binn Beal
22-05-2013, 09:54 AM
As I haven't got the receipt or other physical evidence I cannot publish the name. My information is from one of the proletarians in the chain of workers that provided the pig with his swill.
I take vulgar displays of wealth - particularly from those who are paid from the public purse - as a personal insult. It is all the more galling when this person belongs to an organisation, the Labour Party, that is daily devising more methods for cutting back on the living standards of the common people, driving them into exile and grinding them into poverty.

Cato
22-05-2013, 10:41 AM
What's private about it if we paid for it? It is typical of the political class, and I include yerself, to hide this sort of thing behind "private" - it's far from it ye were raised.

That's somewhat unfair. By 'private' I would have assumed, and a charitable reading would require it, that Greengoddess meant paid for out of the politician's own pocket and not from the public purse. If that is so then there is no issue here.

There is only an issue here if the meal was paid for from the public purse. There is, as yet, no evidence that a) the meal occurred, or b) that it was paid for from the public purse.

Greengoddess
22-05-2013, 11:41 AM
That's somewhat unfair. By 'private' I would have assumed, and a charitable reading would require it, that Greengoddess meant paid for out of the politician's own pocket and not from the public purse. If that is so then there is no issue here.

There is only an issue here if the meal was paid for from the public purse. There is, as yet, no evidence that a) the meal occurred, or b) that it was paid for from the public purse.
That IS what I meant. It seems there is an issue too. Apart from anything else there are privacy issues and how would you control what we spend with after tax income. TAXATION and salary are the key. Not what we do afterwards.

Binn Beal
22-05-2013, 12:00 PM
Vulgar displays of greed from those who are penalising us are an issue for me. Those in public life who daily devise ways to impoverish the public need to be made personally answerable in their social lives. They should not be allowed treat people's lives as a game from which they can walk away afterwards.
Given the opportunity I would advise direct action by upending the table, thus letting the light of publicity shine on those who demand frugality for others and luxury for themselves.

Greengoddess
22-05-2013, 12:17 PM
Vulgar displays of greed from those who are penalising us are an issue for me. Those in public life who daily devise ways to impoverish the public need to be made personally answerable in their social lives. They should not be allowed treat people's lives as a game from which they can walk away afterwards.
Given the opportunity I would advise direct action by upending the table, thus letting the light of publicity shine on those who demand frugality for others and luxury for themselves.
Yes, there is an issue there. The media have covered it for sensational purposes. The definition of " greed" might prove problematic. Why anyone would spend many hundreds on a bottle of wine is beyond me! If you were a public rep you would NOT be so keen on intrusions. There is no telling where they lead.

Slim Buddha
22-05-2013, 12:21 PM
Vulgar displays of greed from those who are penalising us are an issue for me. Those in public life who daily devise ways to impoverish the public need to be made personally answerable in their social lives. They should not be allowed treat people's lives as a game from which they can walk away afterwards.
Given the opportunity I would advise direct action by upending the table, thus letting the light of publicity shine on those who demand frugality for others and luxury for themselves.

If someone is buying wine with their own money, it is their affair. If it is being charged to the taxpayer, then it is a matter of legitimate public concern.

It may be insensitive of a representative of a governing party to be drinking a €200 bottle of wine but it is not illegal if it is his or her own money that paid for it. To make people "personally answerable in their social lives", as you put it, is imposing behaviour modification and norms which are unacceptable. You haven't shown that this was public money so this is not a "$410 hairdo" case. Yet.

Baron von Biffo
22-05-2013, 12:33 PM
To make people "personally answerable in their social lives", as you put it, is

...

fluffybiscuits
22-05-2013, 09:54 PM
A Labour Party Junior Minister recently had a meal in a hideaway restaurant with which I am familiar (not as a customer mind you).
A bottle of fine wine was ordered at a cost of €200. This was followed by three more at the same price.
Guess who paid?
Correct. We did.
What's the best way of outing the parasite?

Lash in an FOI request or drop Sound Migration a note on his blog

http://soundmigration.wordpress.com/

He does a lot of work around FOI,. if it was public he might be able to find it

barrym
23-05-2013, 07:55 AM
And we know we paid for it because...

Cop on, the likes of him wouldn't be buying €200 bottles of wine from his own pocket, he was more than likely showing off using our money.... OK, it may have been 'private' he may not even have claimed expenses, but he is well paid to be a senator.... isn't he?


Ah sure feck it, why would we want any sort of evidence that (a) it even happened and (b) that the taxpayer was charged. A bit of an ould rant is good for the blood and if we start digging around looking for facts they might get in the way.

Yes Baron, thanks for the advice, I'll be noting it next time, I'll make sure I make up something. That way you'll be able to defend the status quo.

B

Baron von Biffo
23-05-2013, 11:04 AM
Cop on, the likes of him wouldn't be buying €200 bottles of wine from his own pocket, he was more than likely showing off using our money.... OK, it may have been 'private' he may not even have claimed expenses, but he is well paid to be a senator.... isn't he?



Yes Baron, thanks for the advice, I'll be noting it next time, I'll make sure I make up something. That way you'll be able to defend the status quo.

B

...

Slim Buddha
23-05-2013, 11:32 AM
Well you seem to have made up a seat in the Seanad for a start. The original dúirt bean liom go ndúirt bean léi yarn cast him as a junior minister.

There's nothing libellous about saying someone enjoyed a bottle of wine with a meal so does it not strike you as curious that this person isn't named?

My guess is that the whole thing is a fabrication to wind up people who prefer ranting to thinking.


It may be a fabrication. It may not. We do not know. We do know that in the previous government, a world-class FF trough-snouter moved his arse from one terminal in Heathrow Airport to another in a limosuine owned by a company headed by the son of a former FF junior minister and another member of that government paid $410 of public money for a hairdo. It may be simply an FF sense of entitlement, that this behaviour was in some way normal, that made this sort of blatant ripoff commonplace at the time. But we do remember such outrageous trough-snouting by a class of people primarily responsible for the destruction of the Irish economy and in these strained economic times, it does not take much for people to react badly to politicians appearing to live high on the hog.

Having said that, if the Labour politician in question was spending his or her own money, that is their concern alone and that should be the end of it.
If it is taxpayers money, then it is a matter of legitimate public concern.

Baron von Biffo
23-05-2013, 11:38 AM
It may be a fabrication. It may not. We do not know.

[...]

Having said that, if the Labour politician in question was spending his or her own money, that is their concern alone and that should be the end of it.
If it is taxpayers money, then it is a matter of legitimate public concern.

...

Slim Buddha
23-05-2013, 11:59 AM
While there's no reason to believe that this story is true, let's assume for the sake of argument that it is. The question then arises of what's the maximum a politician should be allowed to spend on a bottle of wine before we agree with the OP that he should be physically attacked?

It is hard to say anything in this regard. We are, after all, talking about a country which allows pubs to operate inside its parliament building, one specifically for the sole use of legislators. The concept of having legislators having an exclusive source of alcohol in the workplace, that workplace being one where they, the legislators, are expected to formulate the laws of the nation, is frankly mind-boggling. So any question regarding the connection between politicians and alcohol should be borne with that background in mind.

Baron von Biffo
23-05-2013, 01:23 PM
It is hard to say anything in this regard. We are, after all, talking about a country which allows pubs to operate inside its parliament building, one specifically for the sole use of legislators. The concept of having legislators having an exclusive source of alcohol in the workplace, that workplace being one where they, the legislators, are expected to formulate the laws of the nation, is frankly mind-boggling. So any question regarding the connection between politicians and alcohol should be borne with that background in mind.

...

Baron von Biffo
23-05-2013, 01:33 PM
...

Shaadi
23-05-2013, 01:52 PM
An interesting little bit of gossip, but without evidence it's just that. As regards their privacy, well they're minor celebs by choice and celebs have to live with some intrusion in their lives, as long as it's true they've little protection. What interests me most was who paid the bill, if it was just a matter of spending their own money, well it would be seen as brash and a little hypocritical of a party that claims to be socially concerned about the poor and yet thinks the Dole on less a week than the price of one bottle of wine is a wonderful lifestyle choice.

If the tax-payer directly funded it as expenses or something I don't see how such extravagance could be acceptable, or if there was some element of lobbying going on and it were a perk it would look poor form. Anyhow, we'll probably never know.

Slim Buddha
23-05-2013, 01:55 PM
Like the UK, Germany, Austria and probably many many others?

We don't have Sharia law so having a glass of wine isn't a crime. Even the OP is only whinging about the price.

So you have no problem with pissed legislators???
That explains a lot.
I am not 100% sure if the Austrian parliament has a pub inside it but I do know that like the Swiss parliament, a canteen exists for staff and members. In Bern, most legislators eat out.
Mind you, you are not sure either,or you just don't know, so we won't quibble. The UK does have pubs within the Palace of Westminster, so we can agree on that. It still does not make it right and the pubs in Leinster House should be closed.

Slim Buddha
23-05-2013, 02:02 PM
Like the UK, Germany, Austria and probably many many others?

We don't have Sharia law so having a glass of wine isn't a crime. Even the OP is only whinging about the price.

There is NO bar in the Reichstag.

(Sorry, to avoid confusion, there is no bar in the Reichstag, specifically for legislators, as in Leinster House. )

Baron von Biffo
23-05-2013, 04:58 PM
So you have no problem with pissed legislators???
That explains a lot.
I am not 100% sure if the Austrian parliament has a pub inside it but I do know that like the Swiss parliament, a canteen exists for staff and members. In Bern, most legislators eat out.
Mind you, you are not sure either,or you just don't know, so we won't quibble. The UK does have pubs within the Palace of Westminster, so we can agree on that. It still does not make it right and the pubs in Leinster House should be closed.

...

Baron von Biffo
23-05-2013, 05:01 PM
...

Slim Buddha
23-05-2013, 06:25 PM
What a strange world view you have. A bar in the place doesn't come with a mandatory requirement to get pissed. I've even heard tell of people going into bars and not consuming alcohol at all!

True, it is not a mandatory requirement. However, it is most unusual to have easy to access to alcohol in the workplace. I certainly do not have such access and would find it bizarre if I had. But then, I am not making laws for the benefit of the Irish citizenry. There have been many occasions where TDs behaviour, after a strenuous bout of refreshment, has got into the media. I witnessed incidents of severe discombobulation in Leinster House involving public representatives and have always thought providing easy access of alcohol to these people was incongruous.

Slim Buddha
23-05-2013, 06:27 PM
http://www.faz.net/aktuell/gesellschaft/bundes-barkeeper-geht-in-rente-die-vertrauenswuerdigste-person-im-bundestag-11008375.html

Baron von Biffo
23-05-2013, 07:02 PM
...

C. Flower
23-05-2013, 07:35 PM
What were we saying about the treatment of whistle-blowers?

The OP suggests, clearly not seriously, an assault not on a politician, but on a table.