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fluffybiscuits
28-12-2012, 12:23 PM
http://www.indymedia.ie/article/102930

http://athensantifa19jan.wordpress.com/international/


On the 19th of January 2013, we flood the streets of Athens from every city and neighborhood of the country, workers and youth from every workplace, place of education and art. We occupy the city with music, chants and speeches, to shout that the Nazis are not welcome, that the coalition government’s racist policies of concentration camps, FRONTEX and of the denial of citizenship to the children of immigrants, enrage us as much as the barbaric measures that send hundreds of thousands to unemployment.

We cannot tolerate the rich and the government that sows poverty and deprivation, leads to suicides, sends homeless to queue at soup kitchens putting the blame for the crisis on immigrants, turning them to scapegoats, just like Hitler blamed the Jews for everything. This policy led to Dachau and Auschwitz camps, to gas chambers and the crematories with millions of dead Jews, Roma, Communists and gays. It led to the massacre of WWII, the Nazi brutalities in the occupied countries like Greece, with the martyr cities that were burnt, the lives lost in the blockades by the assassins of the “Security Squads” in Kalavryta, Kokkinia, Chortiati, Kontomari, Viano, Distomo and other places.

We cannot accept [Minister of Public Order] Dendias’ police attacking strikes and demonstrations with tons of chemicals and extending a hand of cooperation to the Neo-nazi assault squads of Golden Dawn, organizing racist pogroms in the neighborhoods with stabbings of immigrants, destruction of shops and house intrusions. It’s the same police that jails demonstrators like it did in Thessaloniki, where it reached the point of torturing the antifascist demonstrators of the motorbike demonstration. We are disgusted by the vulgar attack against artists like in the case of “Chitirion” theatre and the censorship of Dendias with journalists’ lay-offs and criminalization of journalist revelations.

We can not close our eyes to the thousands of dead immigrants and refugees, women and children, being hunted by the guards of FRONTEX. We demand to stop the disgrace of the nazi-type concentration camps and the sweeping operations by the Greek police. The immigrants need legalization and the refugees need asylum, victims as they are of the imperialist wars, the dictatorships and the annihilating measures of austerity by the IMF.

Samaras rushed to proceed with the new law to deny the citizenship to the children of immigrants born in this country, with a decision by the High Court that shared the racist prejudice of New Democracy and the Golden Dawn. Thousands of children that are studying in schools are deemed illegal once they turn 18 and are asked to go back to the country of their parents where they have never been themselves!

This is why the last months an unprecedented antifascist uprising has unfolded. On the 24th of August thousands of immigrants sent their message to Dendias that they are not afraid of the police sweeping operations called “Xenios Zeus”. In the neighborhoods the racist pogroms were challenged everywhere. On the 28th of October, the teachers, the students and the antifascists showed who controls the streets sending the neo-Nazi of Golden dawn back to the sewers. “Neither in the parliament not anywhere, Nazis out of our neighborhoods” shouted thousands around Greece.

We call all workers and youth, intellectuals and artists, the immigrants’ communities, trade unions, student unions, school students, the local councils, all the committees against racism and fascism, the collectives of resistance, people’s assemblies to support the national demonstration in Athens on the 19th of January. In the city which sent the greatest message against the Nazi occupation and today sends a message of resistance to the memorandums and the Troika that Neo-Nazis are not welcome – they are racist killers!

We call for international solidarity with participation in Athens demonstration on 19th of January and antifascist action around the world outside Greek embassies.

Saturday 19/1 Athens, Anti-fascist city
National demonstration, Omonia Square, 2pm
Concert, Syntagma Square, 4pm

Sam Lord
07-01-2013, 04:23 PM
There is an event in Dublin it appears. It should be supported.




Greek Embassy, 1 Upper Pembroke Street, Dublin 2

19 January 2013 | Europe wide day of action
All together against fascism and racism in Europe


Solidarity demo with our Greek brothers and sisters | No to fascism in Greece, no to racism in Ireland!
...
Please join us
Saturday 19 January 2013, 2:30 PM, Greek Embassy, 1 Upper Pembroke Street, Dublin 2

Please email us if your organizations are supporting this protest: [email protected]

Download Flyer
http://rapidshare.com/files/3345214344/arn19jan.pdf


The rise of racism and fascism in Europe is a clear and present danger – nowhere more so than in Greece. Anti Racism Network Ireland (ARN) is delighted to support developing and serious initiatives that can meet this threat. The rise of the openly Nazi Golden Dawn party in Greece, which now stands at 14% in the polls and practices open violence against migrants, has sent shock waves across the continent. Now the response in the name of the majority of people in Europe is gathering pace.

INTERNATIONAL DAY OF ACTION ON 19 JANUARY CALLED BY A BROAD RANGE OF ANTI-FASCIST AND IMMIGRANT ORGANIZATIONS IN GREECE WITH THE THEME ATHENS – ANTI-FASCIST CITY: “On the 19th of January 2013, we flood the streets of Athens from every city and neighborhood of the country, workers and youth from every workplace, place of education and art. We occupy the city with music, chants and speeches, to shout that the Nazis are not welcome, that the coalition government’s racist policies of concentration camps, FRONTEX and of the denial of citizenship to the children of immigrants, enrage us as much as the barbaric measures that send hundreds of thousands to unemployment”.

ARN is supporting the international day of action on 19 January. That day will see a nationwide rally and anti-fascist festival in the Greek capital and solidarity protests in other countries. ARN has called a solidarity demonstration outside the Greek Embassy in Dublin. We are inviting our friends, supporters, everyone including all anti-racist, anti-fascist organizations to join in this demonstration.


Athens – anti-fascist city, Dublin – anti-racist city, Europe - anti-fascist continent!

We aim to bring together all the communities and sectors of opinion in this country who are alarmed at the rise of Golden Dawn and who wish to stand together against it. Shock at the rise of Golden Dawn is leading to a new coming together of anti-fascist forces in Greece and elsewhere. We applaud the collaboration and co-ordination of those in Greece and elsewhere who through successive initiatives aim to enhance the unity and effectiveness of the anti-fascist movement. ARN pledges to play our part to assist these developments and to support our friends and colleagues abroad.

Please join us: Saturday 19 January 2013, 2:30 PM, Greek Embassy, 1 Upper Pembroke Street, Dublin 2

• Any gains made by fascists and racists in Greece are also gains made by fascists and racists elsewhere.
• In Ireland we believe that current economic crisis and cuts breed racism that targets asylum seekers, migrants and other minorities.
• We cannot afford the development of racist sentiments and arguments in this country and we need to expose racism for what it is.
• The international day of action is an important event for all anti-fascist, anti-racist groups and organizations to send out a clear message from all corners of the world against racism.
• Show the racists and fascists across the continent that never again fascism will be normalized. The anti-fascist movement is live and the society is united to push these back into the history where they belong.

Please email us if you/your organizations are supporting this protest: [email protected]

Contact Memet: 087 791 9307 | Luke: 085 807 2476

Please share our Facebook event


---------------------------------------------------------------------
Αthensantifa19jan:
http://athensantifa19jan.wordpress.com/international

We call for international solidarity with participation in Athens demonstration on 19th of January and action outside Greek embassies.

Called by: Movement Against Racism and Fascist Thread (KEERFA), Panhellenic Federation of Artists and Entertaiment (POTHA), Intellectuals and Artists , Empros Theater, Initiative Mavili (artists), Union of Immigrant Wirers, Pakistan Community of Greece, Afghan Community of Greece, Open School of Immigrants in Piraeus, Egyptian Community,Union of United Afghan Refugees in Greece, Iranian Political Refugees Union, Antifascist Group of Albanian Immigrants, Union of Syrians in Greece, ASANTE (African immigrants in Greece), Trade Unions, Teacher’s local unions, Hospital Workers unions, Mayors, local and peripheral councilors, Student associations, Schools. Supported by Kostas Arvanitis, journalist of Public TV

Saturday 19/1 Athens, an anti-fascist city | National demonstration Omonia square 2pm
Gig Syntagma square 4pm

elric666
18-01-2013, 08:44 PM
There will also be a march.

Demo at the Greek embassy

Take action against Golden Dawn and Fascism
.
Many groups, organisations and networks are coming together in Athens and call for an International day of action against Golden Dawn and the fascists in Greece.

"We call for international solidarity with participation in Athens demonstration on 19th of January and antifascist action around the world outside Greek embassies."

In Dublin, anti-fascists are meeting at the entrance of Stephan's Green park (top of Grafton St) at 2pm Saturday January 19 2013 . From there we will be marching to the Greek embassy; 1 Upper Pembroke Street, Dublin 2

www . indymedia . ie/ article / 103028

riposte
18-01-2013, 09:07 PM
Jeeze.. it's like a game of draughts ....... I'd be happy to send money to SYRIZA and do anything to show support for the left in Greece ...... but even thinking about Golden Dawn is a polution of my mind ..... never mind poncing around Dublin doing a PR job for them....90% of the people of Dublin couldn't tell you who Golden Dawn are.... but thanks to this nonsense they will end up with more support here.

Any chance of a march to focus attention on the bástárds who reduced the population of this country to destitution.:mad:

elric666
18-01-2013, 09:37 PM
Jeeze.. it's like a game of draughts ....... I'd be happy to send money to SYRIZA and do anything to show support the left in Greece ...... but even thinking about Golden Dawn is a polution of my mind ..... never mind poncing around Dublin doing a PR job for them....90% of the people of Dublin couldn't tell you who Golden Dawn are.... but thanks to this nonsense they will end up with more support here.

Any chance of a march to focus attention on the bástárds who reduced the population of this country to destitution.:mad:

The march and demo is in solidarity with those who are fighting Golden Dawns attacks on immigrants and on the Left.

Taking your position to its logical conclusion then we shouldn't have a demo against PASOK or New Democracy either as it would only garner more support for them.

But if are organising such a demo then let me know, I'll give you a hand.

Simonsays
18-01-2013, 09:48 PM
People whether on the right or the left need to stand up to the fascist thugs in Golden Dawn. We know the evil fascism does. It must be stopped.

C. Flower
18-01-2013, 09:58 PM
Jeeze.. it's like a game of draughts ....... I'd be happy to send money to SYRIZA and do anything to show support for the left in Greece ...... but even thinking about Golden Dawn is a polution of my mind ..... never mind poncing around Dublin doing a PR job for them....90% of the people of Dublin couldn't tell you who Golden Dawn are.... but thanks to this nonsense they will end up with more support here.

Any chance of a march to focus attention on the bástárds who reduced the population of this country to destitution.:mad:

It might raise awareness here of the danger from the far right. And I would include FG in that.

C. Flower
18-01-2013, 10:11 PM
The march and demo is in solidarity with those who are fighting Golden Dawns attacks on immigrants and on the Left.

Taking your position to its logical conclusion then we shouldn't have a demo against PASOK or New Democracy either as it would only garner more support for them.

But if are organising such a demo then let me know, I'll give you a hand.

It is sadly ironic that Declan Ganley, who gathered together parties of the far right all across the EU into Libertas, and who is now succeeding in hijacking the Ballyhea protests, seems to be given a free pass by the anti-fascist left in Ireland.

Why do you think that is ?

elric666
18-01-2013, 10:23 PM
Ganleys not a fascist, hes not trying to set up a fascist party. Fascism means something in particular. Ganley isn't about organising attacks on immigrants or Jews, hes not out to smash Unions, hes not building squads of street fighters to advance his movement.

I'll be back tomorrow or Sunday to go into that in more detail.

elric666
18-01-2013, 10:26 PM
Or talk to you on the march/demo if you are there.

There is going to be food and film and short documentary screening in seomra spraoi - 10 Belvedere Court, just off Gardiner Street - after the demo.

For those of you who can't make it to seomra spraoi after, here are some of the videos being shown, and other videos of interest;

GOLDEN DAWN - Short video produced by the Guardian showing and describing the brutal reality of Golden Dawn http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/video/2012/oct/26/golde...video

GREECE'S UNCERTAIN FUTURE - A short video looking at popular social and alternative movements response the economic crisis and Golden Dawn http://vimeo.com/52660764

HOW MUCH FURTHER? - Documentary describing the real victims of the economic crisis, focusing on the stories of the most vulnerable in Greece, the immigrants http://vimeo.com/46319686

CHASSEURS DE SKINS (2008) - A French documentary on how groups of youth in Paris generated a backlash against the NeoNazi skinhead subculture, and by doing so earned themselves the nickname Chasseurs de Skins or 'Skinhead Hunters' http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Dn2NRvrR-U

Simonsays
18-01-2013, 10:27 PM
Ganleys not a fascist, hes not trying to set up a fascist party. Fascism means something in particular. Ganley isn't about organising attacks on immigrants or Jews, hes not out to smash Unions, hes not building squads of street fighters to advance his movement.

I'll be back tomorrow or Sunday to go into that in more detail.

Correct. I have no time for Ganley but the term 'fascist' is flung around far too liberally against people who aren't remotely fascist. Fascism has a specific meaning and Ganley does not remotely fit it. It is unfair for some people to call him that. It also devalues what real fascism is and makes it harder to distinguish between the real thing, and all it stands for, and things wrongly labelled fascist.

C. Flower
19-01-2013, 12:00 AM
Ganleys not a fascist, hes not trying to set up a fascist party. Fascism means something in particular. Ganley isn't about organising attacks on immigrants or Jews, hes not out to smash Unions, hes not building squads of street fighters to advance his movement.

I'll be back tomorrow or Sunday to go into that in more detail.

I'm not sure what you are basing this on. Do you know the groups that he brought together to form Libertas - 600 candidates stood across Europe ?

Do you know about his connections with the True Finns, with Atak in Bulgaria, with the League of Polish Families (with its Hitler saluting youth movement) and with LAOS, in Greece ? Libertas included anti-semites, homophobes and anti-Roma racists.

Did you know that Libertas had strike breaking as an objective of its legal Memorandum and Articles ?

I did not say that Ganley was a fascist because I use the term carefully, but he has been compared with Mosely by a number of writers, and I think that is a useful comparison.

Several of the groups in Libertas had form on the streets, including the League of Polish Families youth, who famously threw acid in the faces of gay rights marchers, and LAOS, whose leader's idea of a good night out was beating up leftists on the streets.

Anti bank populism, if it is aligned to the political right, or to some kind of third way, is part and parcel of the history of the far right.

I find it very frustrating that the movement in Ballyhea has been abandoned to these people.

C. Flower
19-01-2013, 12:07 AM
Fascism has a specific meaning

Just to be clear, I didn't describe Ganley as fascist and never have. I use the term in its particular historic sense. There are many extreme right wingers I would not call fascist.

That is not to say that he could not at some stage be part of a political development that could be called fascist.

C. Flower
19-01-2013, 11:45 AM
I agree with the conclusions of this article, that SYRIZA is a dangerous political compromise and failure, that there needs to be a political break to stop trying to save broken Greek capitalism, and that workers defence committees need to be formed in Greece.

http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2013/01/19/pers-j19.html

riposte
19-01-2013, 12:21 PM
Ganley is a failed politician. I just can't understand the obsession with him on this site. Did he seduce somebody's wife?

Apjp
19-01-2013, 12:30 PM
Tsipras is the only one in europe who may soon lead a socialist govt.

Sam Lord
19-01-2013, 02:14 PM
Just to be clear, I didn't describe Ganley as fascist and never have.


So you were wondering why someone you wouldn't describe as a fascist was being "given a free pass by the anti-fascist left in Ireland"?

:confused:

Sam Lord
19-01-2013, 02:15 PM
Ganley is a failed politician. I just can't understand the obsession with him on this site. Did he seduce somebody's wife?

:D

C. Flower
19-01-2013, 02:21 PM
So you were wondering why someone you wouldn't describe as a fascist was being "given a free pass by the anti-fascist left in Ireland"?

:confused:

What would your view of LAOS be ? Or the True Finns ? Or the League of Polish Families.

If you were an immigrant, or gay, or left activist, would you want to meet their members on a dark night ?

C. Flower
19-01-2013, 02:22 PM
Tsipras is the only one in europe who may soon lead a socialist govt.

What is SYRIZA doing to defend immigrants from being killed on the streets by Golden Dawn ?

Sam Lord
19-01-2013, 02:28 PM
What would your view of LAOS be ? Or the True Finns ? Or the League of Polish Families.


I don't have a great view of them. But your position of not describing Ganley as a fascist while at the same time wondering why the anti-fascist left "give him a free pass" is not the most coherent.

Are they many other non-fascists you think anti-fascists should be taking on?

C. Flower
19-01-2013, 02:32 PM
I don't have a great view of them. But your position of not describing Ganley as a fascist while at the same time wondering why the anti-fascist left "give him a free pass" is not the most coherent.

Are they many other non-fascists you think anti-fascists should be taking on?

Let's say, I don't have a great view of Ganley, either.

I think the comparison with Mosley is a good one. Was the British left wrong to take him on ?

If LAOS, or the other groups I mentioned, were active on the streets in Ireland, do you think the anti-fascist left should look at them and say
"They don't meet the dictionary definition. Nothing to see. Move on" ?

When fascism first came on the scene, it was not a labelled and recognised commodity, either.

Sam Lord
19-01-2013, 02:56 PM
I think the comparison with Mosley is a good one. Was the British left wrong to take him on ?


No. Mosley was a fascist. Your position is that Ganley is not.




If LAOS, or the other groups I mentioned, were active on the streets in Ireland, do you think the anti-fascist left should look at them and say
"They don't meet the dictionary definition. Nothing to see. Move on" ?


I think a serious assessment of them would be made by anti-fascists in Ireland.



When fascism first came on the scene, it was not a labelled and recognised commodity, either.

From my knowledge of the anti-fascist left in Ireland they well known what fascism is. If they are not taking on Ganley it is because they are of the view that he is not a fascist. You appear to agree with this but at the same time criticise them for not taking him on. It makes no sense.

C. Flower
19-01-2013, 03:14 PM
It is beyond me why you defend Ganley.

C. Flower
19-01-2013, 03:32 PM
In my opinion, Ganley is a far right opportunistic individual who is seeking to build himself a political career in the traditional hunting grounds of fascism. He is pro-Capital and anti-communist. He opposes trade union rights. In his efforts he has allied himself with anti-semitic, anti-Roma, anti-islamic, and other xenophobic nationalist groups, some of whom have a history of violence.

http://www.wiesenthal.com/site/apps/nlnet/content2.aspx?c=lsKWLbPJLnF&b=4441467&ct=7056503#.UPrYffIjM7c

The difference between his politics and traditional fascism is that he advocates deregulation and does not make populist attacks on "big business" as he aspires to be part of it (although he does make populist anti-banker statements).

In conditions of extreme social crisis, that it seems highly probable we are headed for, that part of his tune might rapidly change.

A term I've used for him in the past is proto-fascist.

He dresses up in a nice suit and goes to Church and says we should burn the bondholders. Much of his more overtly extreme right activity has been outside Ireland. Does that account for the "hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil" approach of the left in Ireland to Ganley ?


I think a serious assessment of them would be made by anti-fascists in Ireland.Where has this been done by them, in relation to Ganley ?

A bit on LAOS here. Like Ganley they are prone to deleting their websites when re-imaging is required. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Popular_Orthodox_Rally




John Weiss

John Weiss (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Weiss), a professor of history at Wayne State University (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wayne_State_University), sought to give a definition of fascism in his book, The Fascist Tradition: Radical Right-Wing Extremism in Modern Europe. He arrived at a list of ideas that he believed to be shared by the majority of the people commonly referred to as fascists:[31] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_fascism#cite_note-31)


Organicist (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organicism) conceptions of community;
Philosophical idealism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idealism);
Idealization of "manly (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masculinity)" (usually peasant or village) virtues;
A resentment of mass democracy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy);
Elitist (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elitism) conceptions of political and social leadership;
Racism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism) (and usually, though not necessarily, anti-Semitism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Semitism));
Militarism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Militarism);
Imperialism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperialism).

Marxist definition

In 1935, as fascist political movements were making gains across Europe and often took violent action against communist (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communism) organizations, it became important for Marxists (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marxism) to have an exact definition of "fascism" in order to determine precisely whom they were fighting. Thus, the Communist Third International (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comintern) published the following definition:
“ Fascism in power is the open, terroristic dictatorship of the most reactionary (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reactionary), the most chauvinistic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chauvinism), the most imperialistic elements of finance capitalism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capitalism). ” The majority of Marxists, even those who were not members of the Communist International, agreed with this definition.[citation needed (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)] Marxists argue that fascism represents the last attempt of a ruling class (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruling_class) (specifically, the capitalist bourgeoisie (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bourgeoisie)) to preserve its grip on power in the face of an imminent proletarian revolution (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proletarian_revolution). Fascist movements are not necessarily created by the ruling class, but they can only gain political power with the help of that class and with funding from big business. And, once in power, fascists serve the interests of their benefactors (not necessarily the interests of capitalism in general, but the interests of those specific capitalists who put them in power).[citation needed (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)]
“ The historic function of fascism is to smash the working class (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Working_class), destroy its organizations, and stifle political liberties when the capitalists find themselves unable to govern and dominate with the help of democratic machinery.

DCon
19-01-2013, 04:56 PM
Megan Greene makes a good point about teh EU choosing their interference


Megan Greene ‏@economistmeg

[email protected] Deafening silence from Brussels on Golden Dawn too, on grounds it's an "internal domestic affair". Unlike, say, fiscal policy?

C. Flower
19-01-2013, 05:29 PM
Megan Greene makes a good point about teh EU choosing their interference

Good girl Megan Greene.

The EU assisted in installing the first fascist in the Greek Government -
from the LAOS party.

http://exiledonline.com/austerity-fascism-in-greece-the-real-1-doctrine/

These people from "Human Rights Watch" seem to think that special police squads are the way to deal with Golden Dawn - when it is well known that most of their thugs are police, and more than 50% of Athens police voted for Golden Dawn, and when police attacks on immigrants are becoming more and more common.

http://www.europeanvoice.com/article/2013/january/another-greek-crisis-that-needs-the-eu-s-attention/76208.aspx

Ephilant
19-01-2013, 05:39 PM
Megan Greene makes a good point about teh EU choosing their interference

Fiscal policy, general election, budgetary priorities, social welfare regulations, military expenditure....

What a lot of people do not realize is that Eleni Zaroulia, the GD delgate our government send to Brussels to sit on the Committee on Equality and Non-Discrimination is the wife of the Fuhrer himself. She is on record in the Greek parliament as referring to immigrants as "subhumans" and "filth".

Personally, I think the EU is actually correct stating that the identity of the Greek delegate is an internal Greek affair. The integrety of the committee is however the responisbility of the EU, and so far the only demands for the removal of this deputy from the committee has come from 3 Greek MPs in the Greek parliament.
Despite Samaras shouting from the roof tops some time ago that he had reached agreement with the EU about her replacement.
I also think that her appopintment may just have been a perfect example of some proper Greek sarcastic humour, which would indicate that the decision was not made by Samaras. No humour there... But the unquestioned acceptance of the GD deputy by the EU does very much so expose the EU for what it is, a spineless, totally overpaid and surplus to requirements talking shop.

Sam Lord
19-01-2013, 05:46 PM
It is beyond me why you defend Ganley.

I don't defend Ganley but neither am I fixated on him. I think he is a deeply unsavory, very reactionary, individual but I don't think he is anything like an Eoin O'Duffy. The prime minister of Canada is more right wing than Ganley and he has power and influence but I doubt that if he visited Ireland you or anyone else would be out protesting.

The world is full of pro capital, anti communist, anti-union people who associate with unsavory elements. The military junta in Mali you could possible describe as fascist but the prime minister of France is happy to associate with it. Does that make him a fascist?

elric666
20-01-2013, 02:09 PM
Yesterdays demo was a success, we marched from traitors gate around the Green to the Greek Embassy. The SWP were present there and subtly tried to control events, without much success. The events back in Seomra were cancelled so we could attend the counter demo at the "lifer" vigil.

jmcc
20-01-2013, 03:59 PM
The ruefully funny thing about all this debate about what is fascist and what is anti-fascist is that some societies are changing rapidly while irrelevant people quibble. A day of solidarity - what good will that do? A bunch of roight-on types on a day out so that they can say that they did something? I'm surprised that they don't collect wristbands or t-shirts from each march or cause that they support. :)

Regards...jmcc

elric666
20-01-2013, 04:26 PM
The ruefully funny thing about all this debate about what is fascist and what is anti-fascist is that some societies are changing rapidly while irrelevant people quibble. A day of solidarity - what good will that do? A bunch of roight-on types on a day out so that they can say that they did something? I'm surprised that they don't collect wristbands or t-shirts from each march or cause that they support. :)

Regards...jmcc

You're right of course. Everyone should just stay at home and do nothing.

jmcc
20-01-2013, 04:34 PM
You're right of course. Everyone should just stay at home and do nothing.But what does it change for the Greek people?

Regards...jmcc

C. Flower
20-01-2013, 04:56 PM
I don't defend Ganley but neither am I fixated on him.

Months go by in which I don't mention Declan Ganley and he takes up a tiny proportion of my time. But every time I do mention him, I can guarantee that someone will pop up with the "fixated" "sure what harm" line.
I can think of no other Irish politician so well protected by his supposed opponents.


I think he is a deeply unsavory, very reactionary, individual but I don't think he is anything like an Eoin O'Duffy. The prime minister of Canada is more right wing than Ganley and he has power and influence but I doubt that if he visited Ireland you or anyone else would be out protesting.

Well, since you mention Eoin Duffy, what would you see and the differences in standpoint ? The eras are very different, and Ganley has not as yet got any elected political role, but leaving aside those things ?



In August 1933 a parade was planned by the Blueshirts in Dublin to commemorate Michael Collins and Arthur Griffith, both of whom had died 11 years earlier. This was a clear imitation of Mussolini's March on Rome and was widely perceived as such despite claims to the contrary by Blueshirt apologists. De Valera feared a similar coup d'état and as a result the parade was banned.

By September the Blueshirts were declared an illegal organisation. To circumvent this ban the movement once again adopted a new name, this time styling itself the League of Youth.

O'Duffy and some of his men also made an appearance at the 1934 International Fascist conference in Montreux where he argued against anti-semitism.[6]

Do you think that Ganley would have any qualms about a coup, if the occasion arose - if there was social breakdown after five more years of austerity, say ?

He likes playing soldiers and has had very close associations with US and UK military men.

http://www.albca.com/aclis/images/world_pictures/soldier.jpg



The world is full of pro capital, anti communist, anti-union people who associate with unsavory elements. The military junta in Mali you could possible describe as fascist but the prime minister of France is happy to associate with it. Does that make him a fascist?

I would not call the military junta fascist, on the basis of what I've read to date. They seem to be an officer group with no particular political programme and were very probably given the nod by the US and/or the French.

elric666
20-01-2013, 05:12 PM
But what does it change for the Greek people?

Regards...jmcc

Its a solidarity action.

You're right, be a cynic and a crank, just do nothing.

Dr. FIVE
20-01-2013, 05:41 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15bcAipyRWM

elric666
23-01-2013, 06:04 PM
Full text & pics at link.


International day of solidarity with Greek anti-fascists

As fascism and racist attacks continue to grow in Greece and with the rising popularity of Golden Dawn, the physical presence of organised fascists on the streets of Greece has increased. Greek anti-fascists are ramping up their presence on the streets of Athens and other cities and are confronting the threat of Golden Dawn while defending minorities groups.

Over 100 people turned out at the Greek embassy in Dublin to support Greek anti-fascists, while solidarity demonstrations also took place in Cork and Derry. ...
http://www.indymedia.ie/article/103189

jmcc
23-01-2013, 06:51 PM
What's really funny about the banner in the images from the march/protest is that it has the same colours as the Nazi flag. I suppose that this "solidarity" march gives all those people a nice warm feeling while people in Greece starve, freeze and are beaten. It would have been better if these people put some thought into a method to alleviate some of the problems.

Regards...jmcc

Kid Ryder
23-01-2013, 07:01 PM
What's really funny about the banner in the images from the march/protest is that it has the same colours as the Nazi flag. I suppose that this "solidarity" march gives all those people a nice warm feeling while people in Greece starve, freeze and are beaten. It would have been better if these people put some thought into a method to alleviate some of the problems.

Regards...jmcc

I suppose you'd have us donate money or dry food items to the Golden Dawn soup kitchens then? And what are you doing for the Greek people, o most arrogant and soi-disant 'practical' one?

jmcc
23-01-2013, 07:08 PM
I suppose you'd have us donate money or dry food items to the Golden Dawn soup kitchens then?Wouldn't it be better to set up something that caters for all and allow people to donate to that?

Regards...jmcc

Kid Ryder
23-01-2013, 07:13 PM
Wouldn't it be better to set up something that caters for all and allow people to donate to that?

Regards...jmcc

And what about the second ?, Mr. Grouch?

jmcc
23-01-2013, 07:29 PM
And what about the second ?, Mr. Grouch?Like some Irish Times reader, you think that using French terms makes you sound impressive? I never said that I was "practical". Like most Irish people, I'm a bit preoccupied with trying to survive financially. Perhaps you and the subsidised leisure class could try set it up.

Regards...jmcc

C. Flower
23-01-2013, 09:03 PM
What's really funny about the banner in the images from the march/protest is that it has the same colours as the Nazi flag. I suppose that this "solidarity" march gives all those people a nice warm feeling while people in Greece starve, freeze and are beaten. It would have been better if these people put some thought into a method to alleviate some of the problems.

Regards...jmcc

Neighbourhood defence groups are needed in Greece. Not a lot of point in patrolling Dublin looking for Golden Dawn / Laos etc.

Ephilant here is working in a food distribution centre in Greece and may be able to direct some resources suitably it you have an interest.

People here have been working on a Greek/Irish e-recipe book, to sell as a fund raiser.

fluffybiscuits
24-01-2013, 12:28 PM
Like some Irish Times reader, you think that using French terms makes you sound impressive? I never said that I was "practical". Like most Irish people, I'm a bit preoccupied with trying to survive financially. Perhaps you and the subsidised leisure class could try set it up.

Regards...jmcc

Im in the same boat as yourself but the struggle for survival drives me to change and I feel some sort of solidarity and a lot of empathy for my fellow Greek brethern. Struggling should be a strive for change and to fight austerity. If we are preoccupied with the situation that should act as a driving force for change of the better. Fighting fascism need not cost money, just an hour of your time here and there. :) And you have my full sympathy if you are suffering financially, we are all struggling . You have some excellent IT skills, who knows these could prove useful in the fight against fascism :)