Early Retirement - War of Attrition Against Public Services

[C. Flower]

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/frontpage/2012/0121/1224310578688.html?via=mr

Today's IT front page lists a pretty horrifying number of the most experienced and qualified of "front line" public sector staff who are retiring - in some cases, a large number in the same department at the same time.

These people will not be replaced because of the public sector recruitment embargo.

So far as I'm aware, the people retiring are self-selecting and there has been no systematic identification of non-essential posts.

The consequences for services, in the coming year, seem likely to be horrendous.

It's been widely reported over the last few years that some public sector departments (for example the HSE) are heavily overstaffed, while other areas under great strain. There were clearly savings that could have been made by using peoples' capacities to the optimum through reorganisation.

Instead of which, we seem likely to get the "lose weight by decapitation" approach.


NEARLY 50 hospital consultants and almost 1,000 nurses of different grades are set to leave the health service before new pension changes come into effect at the end of February, the first official figures show.

The new figures, released by the Department of Health, reveal 2,077 HSE staff have indicated they will retire either this month or in February before the end of the “grace period” under which their pensions and lump-sum gratuities will be based on their pre-pay-cut salaries.

An additional 1,500 health service personnel retired in the months between September and the end of December last year.

Overall the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform said last night that about 7,500 staff in the public service had so far applied to retire before the end of February deadline.

[Griska]

Eat your greens and drive carefully, folks.
Getting sick isn't a good option.:(

[eamo]

It is, a very clever(from their viewpoint) tactic. By delaying the cuts to their pensions until Feb. the powers that be are creating a stampede to retire. These staff will not be replaced due to the embargo and so the troica should be happy with their Paddypuppets. Their skill knows no bounds when it comes to ******** the Irish people.

[DCon]

The real concern is that it is people who have the skills to consult their labour back to the State (at a higher cost) that are likely to retire. The State could end up paying a pension and salary to the same person.

Administrators with no real skills or responsibilities will likey stay where they are

[C. Flower]

The real concern is that it is people who have the skills to consult their labour back to the State (at a higher cost) that are likely to retire. The State could end up paying a pension and salary to the same person.

Administrators with no real skills or responsibilities will likey stay where they are

That happened in the 90s, but this time around they will just let the services collapse, and privatise what remains.

[fluffybiscuits]

The other issue with this is the years of experience that they are losing. If 1000 nurses are set to retire that is probably 30k years of experience between them when compared to any new staff who are just starting off. Without the experience and the challenges facing the HSE its looking bleak for the HSE.

[C. Flower]

The HSE is now saying that it has a crisis management plan to deal with the mass retirements.

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/kenny-hse-has-contingency-plans-for-staff-departures-537277.html

[Baron von Biffo]

The HSE is now saying that it has a crisis management plan to deal with the mass retirements.

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/kenny-hse-has-contingency-plans-for-staff-departures-537277.html

Will it involve large wodges going from HSE coffers to agencies one wonders.

[Kid Ryder]

The HSE is now saying that it has a crisis management plan to deal with the mass retirements.

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/kenny-hse-has-contingency-plans-for-staff-departures-537277.html

I take it that would be the same crisis management plan they've used all along...


HSE Crisis Management Plan

Plan A: Deny there is a crisis in the health service.

Plan B: If that doesn't work, find a scapegoat it can all be blamed on.

Plan C: And if that doesn't work, refer all press enquiries to the health minister.

Note too that it's a 'Crisis Management Plan', and not a 'Crisis Resolution Plan'.

[C. Flower]

Mr Kenny said that a review will be carried out after the HSE's retirement scheme closes to assess the situation.

"The reason for the review at the end of February is that the numbers will become clear as to who actually has left and in what categories and sectors people have left," he said.

"The HSE have a contingency plan here

Read more: http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/kenny-hse-has-contingency-plans-for-staff-departures-537277.html#ixzz1kVwS8jK0

[C. Flower]

Colum McGee, head of the HSE, said today to the PAC at the Oireachtas that there would be gaps in frontline staff as a result of early retirement, but that was no problem, as they have money for recruitment....

Sorry, but wasn't the idea of the early retirement, which is very costly, that staff numbers were to be reduced ?

[Baron von Biffo]

Colum McGee, head of the HSE, said today to the PAC at the Oireachtas that there would be gaps in frontline staff as a result of early retirement, but that was no problem, as they have money for recruitment....

Sorry, but wasn't the idea of the early retirement, which is very costly, that staff numbers were to be reduced ?

In financial terms, early retirement isn't very costly, in fact it's the opposite, it's cheaper than full term service.

It may be that Magee (Cathal btw ;)) is saying that admin staff wont be replaced but some front line staff will. If a midwife with 30 years is forced out she can be replaced by a fresh graduate on a yellow pack scale. Of course the new recruit wont have the experience of the person she replaces and neither will she be able to learn from her retired colleague but that hardly matters because it wont have financial consequences so the Troika will still pat Gump on the head.

Some day we will get to the utopian dream of no admin staff at all. Then front line staff will be freed from the drudgery of their specialities and allowed to get on with sending out appointments, running the payroll system, ordering supplies and all the other things they spent years training for.

[C. Flower]

In financial terms, early retirement isn't very costly, in fact it's the opposite, it's cheaper than full term service.

It may be that Magee (Cathal btw ;)) is saying that admin staff wont be replaced but some front line staff will. If a midwife with 30 years is forced out she can be replaced by a fresh graduate on a yellow pack scale. Of course the new recruit wont have the experience of the person she replaces and neither will she be able to learn from her retired colleague but that hardly matters because it wont have financial consequences so the Troika will still pat Gump on the head.

Some day we will get to the utopian dream of no admin staff at all. Then front line staff will be freed from the drudgery of their specialities and allowed to get on with sending out appointments, running the payroll system, ordering supplies and all the other things they spent years training for.

I don't share they view that medical secretaries aren't front line staff.

[Baron von Biffo]

I don't share they view that medical secretaries aren't front line staff.

Their managers?

Fleet management staff?

Payroll?

[C. Flower]

Their managers?

Fleet management staff?

Payroll?

All essential. Take a look and it's often the case that delays in treatment are caused by lack of admin staff.

A lot of Consultants only have part time secretarial support, but are seeing people who may need their treatment moved on quickly.

Always thought the differentiation of "front line" and non is absurd.

That is not to say there is not a problem in the HSE of too many chiefs. I've had one complain to me that he doesn't have enough to do.

Not his fault - bad management and bad politics.

[Baron von Biffo]

All essential. Take a look and it's often the case that delays in treatment are caused by lack of admin staff.

A lot of Consultants only have part time secretarial support, but are seeing people who may need their treatment moved on quickly.

Always thought the differentiation of "front line" and non is absurd.

That is not to say there is not a problem in the HSE of too many chiefs. I've had one complain to me that he doesn't have enough to do.

Not his fault - bad management and bad politics.

The HSE, and the health boards before it, has serious management issues. Poor selection, inadequate training, poor performance monitoring and a culture of bullying have all contributed to the mess. Having the likes of Cowen and Harney at the top of the tree for so long didn't help much either.

[C. Flower]

The Frontline on this now.

"We are telescoping early retirements into one year from two or three years"

[riposte]

Kenny doesn't ask questions .... he just pontificates on his own agenda.

[C. Flower]

The cuts are being handled appallingly.

[riposte]

Kenny referred to some pubic sector workers as wasters.... he must have no mirror in his own house.

[fluffybiscuits]

Kenny referred to some pubic sector workers as wasters.... he must have no mirror in his own house.

He spent all his money on lilt...

[Baron von Biffo]

Today is the last day for early retirement applications. Story coming up in a moment on News at One.

[Baron von Biffo]

Didn't take too long for that discussion to degenerate into a PS bashing/Throw out Croke Park rant.

[Baron von Biffo]

David Murphy having a bit of a sulk about Paul Appleby only giving his employer one month's notice. I can't recall Murphy voicing any strong objections when the employer imposed unilateral cuts in pay.

[riposte]

David Murphy having a bit of a sulk about Paul Appleby only giving his employer one month's notice. I can't recall Murphy voicing any strong objections when the employer imposed unilateral cuts in pay.

Baron it is a little disingenuous to portray Appleby as an empolyee (ie. a guy who clocks in in the morning and clocks out in the evening) .... he is the BOSS of the Corporate Enforcement Agency.

[Baron von Biffo]

SixOne reporting that Appleby is deferring his retirement for 6 months. No details of what conditions apply.

[Baron von Biffo]

Howlin saying that an accommodation will be reached with Appleby following his decision to remain on.

It's clear therefore that the government can be flexible where its crude headcount reduction plan impacts on an area it believes important. Schools, hospitals and garda stations obviously don't fall into that category.

[C. Flower]

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/howlin-demands-no-noticeable-impact-on-public-services-from-retirement-scheme-538078.html

Howlin says there should be no impact on services from the early retirement scheme.

Can anyone confirm the purpose of the scheme ? Was it something negotiated in Croke Park to protect the pensions of current employees, while letting future pensions be cut ?

[Baron von Biffo]

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/howlin-demands-no-noticeable-impact-on-public-services-from-retirement-scheme-538078.html

Howlin says there should be no impact on services from the early retirement scheme.

Can anyone confirm the purpose of the scheme ? Was it something negotiated in Croke Park to protect the pensions of current employees, while letting future pensions be cut ?

The pensions of current employees aren't protected. Current staff who didn't or couldn't leave under the scheme will have their pensions calculated on their post cuts salaries.

The purpose was simply to get down headcount. The best that can be said about Howlin's claim that there will be no impact on services is that it's cretinous.

Early retirement schemes mean older, more experienced, senior staff leave. It's possible that both top level staff and those who would have been expected to succeed them will leave some areas with obvious consequences.

Howlin makes much of the facility for redeployment under Croke Park but whether by accident or design he overlooks obvious obstacles to that strategy.

There might be no one remaining with the relevant skills and experience to fill some posts. Areas like teaching and nursing are already understaffed so services can't be maintained by redeployment.

Even with non specialist work the most vicious PS basher would acknowledge that there are limits to how far people can be expected to commute. Moving someone from one building to another in Dublin wouldn't be too much of a hardship but trying to force a move of 30 or 40 miles would be unacceptable.

We shouldn't dismiss the possibility that the impossibility of filling vacancies through redeployment in smaller, more remote areas will be used both as an excuse to terminate services and to throw out Croke Park.

[Baron von Biffo]

Reports hint that Appleby will be staying on under his current T&Cs. If that's true he is being more generous than we deserve.

In his shoes I would have told Howlin that if he wanted to retain my services after next month my rate would be the same as the manager of Newbridge CU.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0201/1224311049333.html

[Baron von Biffo]

What did the PS ever do to SF?

The IT reports that the state has been forced to re-hire several retired PS workers and the thought of these people earning a few extra quid has Mary Lou seriously wound up.

“There has to be a compelling rationale for bringing back people, many of whom left on good pensions.”

Bringing back someone with specific knowledge or expertise to wrap up a particular project can make good sense. Bringing loads of people back because crude policies like blanket recruitment bans have screwed up succession planning is a very different matter.

McDonald had a fair point up to that. Then she had to throw in the gratuitous dig about 'good pensions' for reasons best known to her self. PS workers should be grateful that she didn't say 'gold plated' or 'index linked'.

Taken with her many calls to drive down PS pay, it looks like SF is fully bought into the IBEC/ISME/Indo agenda to close down the public sector.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0203/1224311177436.html

[C. Flower]

The pensions of current employees aren't protected. Current staff who didn't or couldn't leave under the scheme will have their pensions calculated on their post cuts salaries.

The purpose was simply to get down headcount. The best that can be said about Howlin's claim that there will be no impact on services is that it's cretinous.

Early retirement schemes mean older, more experienced, senior staff leave. It's possible that both top level staff and those who would have been expected to succeed them will leave some areas with obvious consequences.

Howlin makes much of the facility for redeployment under Croke Park but whether by accident or design he overlooks obvious obstacles to that strategy.

There might be no one remaining with the relevant skills and experience to fill some posts. Areas like teaching and nursing are already understaffed so services can't be maintained by redeployment.

Even with non specialist work the most vicious PS basher would acknowledge that there are limits to how far people can be expected to commute. Moving someone from one building to another in Dublin wouldn't be too much of a hardship but trying to force a move of 30 or 40 miles would be unacceptable.

We shouldn't dismiss the possibility that the impossibility of filling vacancies through redeployment in smaller, more remote areas will be used both as an excuse to terminate services and to throw out Croke Park.

This was one last FF kiss in the direction of public sector votes. But young workers won't thank them for it.

So, it was intended to save money by cutting posts, but Ministers are rushing to say that people will be reemployed (teachers for example) so be getting pension and wage for the rest of the teaching year, and new people taken on, and the scheme has brought forward "lump sum" costs.

Ironic to hear Colm McCarthy this morning condemning the way the job cuts have been made. I head him argue against prioritisation of cuts, at Kilkenomics, where he said that a straight percentage cut off each Department was the best approach.

He drew up the back of an envelope hit list that FG is happy to be following.

[Baron von Biffo]

This was one last FF kiss in the direction of public sector votes. But young workers won't thank them for it.

:confused:

After Lenihan had collapsed negotiations that he had conducted dishonestly and followed up with two pay cuts, why would re-hiring a few dozen retired staff sway PS voters to FF?


So, it was intended to save money by cutting posts, but Ministers are rushing to say that people will be reemployed (teachers for example) so be getting pension and wage for the rest of the teaching year, and new people taken on, and the scheme has brought forward "lump sum" costs.

Hopefully the staff being re-hired have listened to IBEC/ISME and are charging a proper private sector rate for their services. The Newbridge CU rate of €423 an hour sounds fair for something like teaching.


Ironic to hear Colm McCarthy this morning condemning the way the job cuts have been made. I head him argue against prioritisation of cuts, at Kilkenomics, where he said that a straight percentage cut off each Department was the best approach.

He drew up the back of an envelope hit list that FG is happy to be following.

McCarthy is probably best ignored lest by discussing him we encourage him.

[fluffybiscuits]

What did the PS ever do to SF?

The IT reports that the state has been forced to re-hire several retired PS workers and the thought of these people earning a few extra quid has Mary Lou seriously wound up.

“There has to be a compelling rationale for bringing back people, many of whom left on good pensions.”

Bringing back someone with specific knowledge or expertise to wrap up a particular project can make good sense. Bringing loads of people back because crude policies like blanket recruitment bans have screwed up succession planning is a very different matter.

McDonald had a fair point up to that. Then she had to throw in the gratuitous dig about 'good pensions' for reasons best known to her self. PS workers should be grateful that she didn't say 'gold plated' or 'index linked'.

Taken with her many calls to drive down PS pay, it looks like SF is fully bought into the IBEC/ISME/Indo agenda to close down the public sector.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0203/1224311177436.html

Is she talking about ex-PS staff retiring to their holiday homes in Donegal?

[C. Flower]

Enda Kenny says there will be "transition teams" of senior managers set up to manage the impacts of the early retirements.

He doesn't say who will do their jobs while they are at this.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0205/taoiseach.html

[Baron von Biffo]

Enda Kenny says there will be "transition teams" of senior managers set up to manage the impacts of the early retirements.

He doesn't say who will do their jobs while they are at this.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0205/taoiseach.html

It was fairly clear, or at least as clear as anything that that man rambles on about gets, that the government intends to use the impossibility of maintaining all services after the retirement as an excuse to abandon Croke Park.

He made a point of saying that pay would be hit if they couldn't get redeployments but it's blindingly obvious that redeployments can only work where there are surplus staff at present. With the best will in the world you can't expect great outcomes if you redeploy snow-plough drivers to vacant midwife posts.

[Baron von Biffo]

RTE news reporting that the HSE made a hames of the figures used to calculate entitlements that were used to induce staff to take up Harney's retirement scheme. In some cases people are getting 40% less that they were promised.

In a comment that will hopefully come back to haunt him, James Reilly said that people have a right to get what they signed up for.

[Dr. FIVE]

Every page of this week's SINDO will slam the overstating public service entitlements with a straight face

[d.vader]

That happened in the 90s, but this time around they will just let the services collapse, and privatise what remains.

Prolly and with the help of the propoganda of the meeja joe public will be cheering all the way. Great country.

[fluffybiscuits]

Speaking to a member of CPSU today who told me that some staff have relocated already to the HSE and Dept of Social Welfare. Im working in town but we are going to know in four weeks what is going to happen to our jobs. There is a list of vacancies being published where there is staff shortages and they are going to look for people to move voluntarily after which if we are over staffed in work we'll be moved against our wishes. They can move us anywhere within a 45km radius of work which means I could end up in fuckin Newbridge or somewhere in the middle of no where. Joking around , if its interview based and Im forced to relocate based on interview I could sit in the interview, dress like a complete scumbag and talk about my love of **** fighting, heavy drinking and the odd drop of LSD...wonder would I be recruited then :D

[Dr. FIVE]

Other then stoking the Croke Park flames can anyone explain the logic behind the decision to have people a month after the gov get final figures

also
Arthur Spring just said there a 300 "managers" in Howlin's dept working on this

[fluffybiscuits]

Other then stoking the Croke Park flames can anyone explain the logic behind the decision to have people a month after the gov get final figures

also
Arthur Spring just said there a 300 "managers" in Howlin's dept working on this

They pass the one brain cell around between them? :D

[Baron von Biffo]

Other then stoking the Croke Park flames can anyone explain the logic behind the decision to have people a month after the gov get final figures

also
Arthur Spring just said there a 300 "managers" in Howlin's dept working on this

If you're talking about Gump's 'Transition Teams' who knows, they might be just something that crossed his mind when he saw the mic in front of him. He's inclined to say whatever he thinks will go down well with the audience he's dealing with at the time. As the small print in many ads says 'Specification subject to change without notice'.

[Baron von Biffo]

Staff shortages are already causing problems in the courts. The early retirement cull wont help matters.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0208/1224311464311.html

[Baron von Biffo]

RTE reporting that Reilly is making much of technicalities that will allow the re-hiring of staff who avail of the current early retirement scheme. It's as close as we're likely to get to an admission that the scheme was an utter mess.

Hopefully any staff who are re-hired will hold out for private sector rates.

[ang]

RTE reporting that Reilly is making much of technicalities that will allow the re-hiring of staff who avail of the current early retirement scheme. It's as close as we're likely to get to an admission that the scheme was an utter mess.

Hopefully any staff who are re-hired will hold out for private sector rates.



Yes the Government has conceded they have no plan :-


Fianna Fáil TD Robert Troy has called on the Government to clarify what safeguards and restrictions it is putting in place, having admitted, in reply to a Parliamentary Question from Deputy Troy to Minister James Reilly, that public servants retiring this month may be kept on in their posts.

Deputy Troy said: “Ministers have been emphasising the need for flexibility in redeployment within the public sector, but an utter failure to plan for nearly 8,000 public service retirements over the past year has now left the country with the prospect of public service workers receiving lump sum retirement payments and being kept on in their jobs. The question of how they would manage the departure of large numbers of public servants has been on each Minister's desk since the day they were appointed. It is increasingly clear that this important question has been ignored.

“The Minister for Public Expenditure must immediately state what safeguards he is putting in place to ensure that this only applies to the most critical posts and that any such exceptions are strictly time-limited.

“The Minister for Education has said that teachers with exam classes will be facilitated until the end of the exam cycle this summer. We must be very clear that if certain mission-critical public servants are kept in their posts beyond the end of this month, it is by rare exception only.

“Any attempt at wholesale retention of workers who are taking lump sum retirement payments is wrong. It frustrates the efforts of young professionals trying to get posts in this country and will quickly exhaust the public's support for public sector reform.”

http://www.fiannafail.ie/news/entry/7904/#.TzLFYFSoO_U.twitter

[Baron von Biffo]

Yes the Government has conceded they have no plan :-


5 points was their limit, after that we're on our own.

[disability student]

FG 5 point plan is irrelevant now after broken promises.:)

[DCon]

Why are we giving a retiree a 91K tip on top of one and a half times his salary and an inflated pension? Is the tip really necessary?


As part of his pension payoff, Mr Mackey received one-and-a-half times his salary, totalling €220,266. In addition, he received a special severance gratuity of €91,255 -- the highest amount ever received by a retiring council manager.

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/pension-payoff-of-310000-for-city-manager-of-nine-years-3037765.html

[C. Flower]

As predicted, the retired are being re-recruited in significant numbers, while young people can't get jobs and other people are stuck without opportunity for promotion in the civil service.